Curse

br0thergr1m · Aug 15, 2006, 08:41 PM // 20:41

Hey guys. ( I play mostly PVE )

I'm a noob, I started playing right away with a N/ME, mostly focusing on Hex/Curse and a little blood magic. My question I guess is what would be the main difference if I switched instead to ME/N. The soul reaping ability doesnt really have a "Large" factor in what I play, but I've heard from other players that fastcasting loses its advantage in the long run. Is this true? Not to get long winded but what are the +/- of N/ME or ME/NE. I feel as if I am a Mesmer at heart even if its not my 1st profession...I dont want to lose ME. Again, I like the combination with the Hex/Curse, but I just want opinions on both combos N/ME, ME/N. Thanks guys!

Terra Xin · Aug 16, 2006, 12:45 AM // 00:45

Fast Casting along with Critical Strikes are the two classes that have diminishing returns the higher you put more into the skill. (All other classes have a fixed gain)

Fast Casting at 16 goes just over halving the cast time of all your spells. But here's a link you can look at: http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Fast_Casting

Dragannia · Aug 16, 2006, 02:27 AM // 02:27

PvE wise, Mesmer is probably the least fun class to play, no matter what my collegues say. It's hard to get into groups and farming wise there are much better classes. It does, however, teach you a little bit about PvP with a Mesmer, but since you play PvE that's a non-issue. Soul Reaping for PvE is absolutely great, with things dying everywhere. Go N/Me.

Hella Good · Aug 16, 2006, 02:37 AM // 02:37

N/Me def. for PvE. It allows you to learn Me skills and their uses on a very highly sought after prof in PvE- N. Necros own PvE, it's the absolute easiest thing to play and with minions you can solo just about anything. What you can't roll over with minions, you will with SS. Orders, Wells, Taint, etc... Quite a few wonderful and widely accepted builds you can play. Me- heh, good luck finding a group. Best bet is FC Ele, which isnt even a Me anyways... N >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Me - PvE.

NinjaKai · Aug 16, 2006, 02:49 AM // 02:49

Its actually easy to get into a group if its guildies or friends.

Avarre · Aug 16, 2006, 11:43 AM // 11:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by NinjaKai

Its actually easy to get into a group if its guildies or friends.

Most 8-man PvE groups find a place for a mesmer now. Whether it be shutdown, degen spam, fc healer (I've done that in THK

). Mesmers have as much place as necro in large teams.

Necro has the advantage for SS... but that's pretty much the extent. Necro's excel in massive solo damage dealing, and for minions. For this reason they're superior in small teams.

Jijimuge · Aug 16, 2006, 11:52 AM // 11:52

Hmmm....Necromancer is probably better mechanics-wise for PvE, but I think that one's character's appearance should be a factor.

Speaking personally, I've gone Me/Ne Illusion/Curses (my second mes!) simply because of the visual appearance. For me, it's a choice between gaunt/moody versus elegant/decadent. This is of course a value judgement.

Something to note is that if you're going necro for curses then, depending on your build (i.e. this doesn't apply to spiteful spirit!), things will be dying around you less often than if you had gone Death (i.e. MM), and to a lesser extent Blood, so the value of soul-reaping may be less if your intention with curses is to debuff.

However, fast casting provides the most visible benefit when you're using spells with long casting times and can help to avoid interrupts. OTOH, there are mesmer stances such as mantras of resolve and concentration that can prevent some degree of interruption (at a cost of course).

You also need to consider which skills you'll be using primarily - will they be necro skills or mesmer skills....as the fact that one can only use runes relating to one's primary profession is a relevant consideration too.

If, however, you are mostly using curses and blood, it seems to me that you've answered your own question - necro would be better stats-wise.

FWIW, my mes/ne uses a large number of the mes degen skills from the illusion line + ineptitude, clumsiness etc., and uses curses more as a backup.

Remember also that you can change your secondary, but not your primary...so which of the two skill sets will you want to have potentially available ALL of the time?

br0thergr1m · Aug 16, 2006, 03:13 PM // 15:13

Thanks for the suggestions guys!

I just find fast casting (again im a noob), mixed with the long casting time of the necros ability a great combination. Stacking hexes very quickly or spreading them around to different characters... I almost feel as if I kill things faster as a ME/N then I did as a N/ME. Maybe its because I've gotten over the slight learning curve. I simply am using my character as a Hexer/Anti (attack/spell). I like the abilites where opponents have draw backs if they attack or cast a spell. It does bother me just a bit though, that I might have a harder time getting into groups... but if thats the price I have to pay just to be something different oh well.

I think the biggest drawback I have found or that I dont like particulary, with ME/Necro as opposed to the reverse Necro/Mes, is having to know in advance, what I think im going to go up against. Is there going to be more melee, or casting....buffs? Monks? etc. I like the ability to be flexible and handle anything that is thrown out or that I come across and for that reason I like my Necro/Mes build. I'm still on the fence though, I keep going back and forth

holden · Aug 16, 2006, 03:27 PM // 15:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragannia

PvE wise, Mesmer is probably the least fun class to play, no matter what my collegues say. It's hard to get into groups and farming wise there are much better classes. It does, however, teach you a little bit about PvP with a Mesmer, but since you play PvE that's a non-issue. Soul Reaping for PvE is absolutely great, with things dying everywhere. Go N/Me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hella Good

N/Me def. for PvE. It allows you to learn Me skills and their uses on a very highly sought after prof in PvE- N. Necros own PvE, it's the absolute easiest thing to play and with minions you can solo just about anything. What you can't roll over with minions, you will with SS. Orders, Wells, Taint, etc... Quite a few wonderful and widely accepted builds you can play. Me- heh, good luck finding a group. Best bet is FC Ele, which isnt even a Me anyways... N >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Me - PvE.

qft.

necros are King of pve.

Hella Good · Aug 16, 2006, 06:11 PM // 18:11

FC shines in PvP, not PvE. Soul Reaping is vise versa. And with a N/Me, you will ALWAYS find a group in no time. GL doing the same with a Me/N. I am telling you this from experience. I have both a N (N/Me) AND a Me (currently running him as Me/E) in PvE.

luxor9 · Aug 16, 2006, 06:30 PM // 18:30

I really do hate fast casting. Makes me feel weak if I put more than 3 points into it. I'm sure it helps but I feel much stronger without it. I have a me/n and I kinda wish I had done it the other way around but I already have a necro so I can always change his second to mes.

You might aswell try both because they're both good primaries to have.

br0thergr1m · Aug 16, 2006, 06:36 PM // 18:36

I believe you guys...seriously, and thanks.

What I dont get though, is what can my N/ME do that my ME/N cant do. Besides soul reaping, why cant my Mesmer be a minion master minus the soul reaping (she'd do it quicker obviously), why cant she play around with blood/hex/curse, and just do it faster. Is soul reaping that much more powerful in PVE then fast casting? I see them as essientially the same build N/ME, N/ME...I just find Mesmers way cooler. Is it that Mesmers are just discriminated against so vividly in PVE? I guess I feel if I run a Me/N, I should be able to do everything that a necro would, only faster...AND have the ability to throw in some interupts. Again, im a silly noob, and I'm just trying to get a feel for everything, and obviously you guys like Hella Good have experience etc. thanks again!

Hella Good · Aug 16, 2006, 07:16 PM // 19:16

Minions at DM 12 have substantially lower armor than minions DM 16, that means they take hell of a lot more damage. I've tried running minions on my Me, I've also tried it on my Rit (which almost seems like a logical alternative actually but it's not). Cast time of minion spells is 3 (usually) and the Bloodstained Boots give 25% reduction to that cast time- this effectively outperforms FC. Also Soul Reaping gives you nrg when something dies and when you minions die, so every minion you have is actually an nrg reserve waiting to be harnessed. Plus I doubt that if you advertise yourself as an MM with a Me/N anyone will do anything but laugh at ya. Better minions, better and more useful primary, better image.

As for Curses, Curses and Illusion you can pretty much hop back and forth between. I normally run my SB RI build on my Mesmer, because I appreciate the faster casting and the damage reduction in Barbs isnt substantial. But with stuff like Spites, you want max damage.

Blood you want the max damage on the Orders again, nice pumped up Blood spikes, and Wells. Even tho FC Orders is quite viable, it's viable in PvP, not in PvE, least not so much.

So you cant rly play those builds on a Me effectively. Again this is entirely a PvE N/Me vs Me/N discussion.

Kai Nui · Aug 16, 2006, 07:47 PM // 19:47

Soul reaping is just so secksy in the PVE environment as opposed to mesmer. Seriously, are you going to use Arcane Langour on a PVE monster when you could be gaining a butt load of energy from all the corspes that die so incredibly fast...

Braggi · Aug 21, 2006, 01:12 PM // 13:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by br0thergr1m

I guess I feel if I run a Me/N, I should be able to do everything that a necro would, only faster...AND have the ability to throw in some interupts.

Agree with the things said above:
1) you lose the increased attribute level by runes and head armor, so your main skills are more efficient when from your main profession.
2) MM as necro takes (spellcost-soul reaping) energy to replace dying minions. As a Mesmer this is spellcost only - so potentially your army is smaller as well as weaker (runes, see above).

Necro skills are cool, as Blood and Curses have a lot of healing potential, which my mesmer lacks. But more damage for the same energy cost is obviously superior, so if I go SS I'd rather go with my necro. Interrupts are usually 1/4 sec anyway, fc doesn't help here a lot.
In PvE fc doesn't help you against high-level mesmer foes, because they have no reaction time and high fc anyway. For the rest a split second faster cast isn't worth much. On the other hand free energy by soul reaping comes in handy.

I used my necro secondary for healing and unconditional damage, things my mesmer is somewhat limited in IMO.