Curse

Made In Ascalon · Nov 12, 2006, 08:57 AM // 08:57

This build is all about combining the burning capabilities of elementalists and paragons. When I first started creating the build, I knew I had to address the fact that paragons suck with energy management, while most ele spells require tons of energy to waste. So with that in mind, I created this build:

Spear Mastery 13 (+1 head piece with +3 sup rune)
10 Leadership (+1 minor rune)
Fire magic 12

Skills:
Barbed Spear
Merciless Spear
Anthem of Flame
Glowing Signet
"They're on Fire!"
Glowing Gaze
Searing Flames
Sunspear Ressurection Signet

When taking on a crowd of monsters, first use "They're on Fire!" and start attacking (usually the monk), working up my adrenaline. Find the largest congestion of monsters, extra points if it's of melee/Rangers/Paragons and cast Searing Flames on them. Immedietaly use glowing signet to regain your energy and start the recharge early, since it's 20 seconds. Once the searing flames on the crowd ends, use the spell again, following it with Glowing Gaze on your target. You should have full adrenaline and your target is usually bellow 50%, so use merciless spear. Continue maintaining burning with searing flames, anthem of flame if you run too low on energy, and take out individuals accordingly. Use barbed spear to make degen even worse on the chosen target.

The idea is to grant mega protection against physical attackers by taking advantage of "They're on fire!" while at the same time keeping your energy high enough to use the 15 energy spell and kill your enemies. I have tons of fun with this build and usually never have problems with energy. What do you think?

Vahn Roi · Nov 12, 2006, 05:32 PM // 17:32

A very nice example of class-crossing with a Para. I'm eager to try this build out myself, but I wonder how the expected SF nerf will effect it.

Nice work.

Skuld · Nov 12, 2006, 05:44 PM // 17:44

Dumb idea. Use an ele with a high level searing flames.. or a spear/burn paragon, don't do both badly. Seriously.

unholy guardian · Nov 12, 2006, 06:38 PM // 18:38

if you don't have an ele though i don't see why you can't use this and have great effect

Skuld · Nov 12, 2006, 07:53 PM // 19:53

If you want to play ele, make an ele.. sheesh.

TadaceAce · Nov 12, 2006, 08:04 PM // 20:04

Yes you will go far casting 15 energy ele spells with 2 pips of energy regen... there are MUCH better ways of using they're on fire with other paragon burning spells.

Made In Ascalon · Nov 12, 2006, 11:06 PM // 23:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

Dumb idea. Use an ele with a high level searing flames.. or a spear/burn paragon, don't do both badly. Seriously.

Spears don't do AoE burning.
I don't do both badly. With 12 in fire magic I keep fire up for 6 seconds, and my skills allow me to keep my energy up easily.
I'd rather not use an ele, since I'm too busy using better heroes like necros.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

If you want to play ele, make an ele.. sheesh.

It's only two ele skills, moron. And Eles don't get leadership.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TadaceAce

Yes you will go far casting 15 energy ele spells with 2 pips of energy regen... there are MUCH better ways of using they're on fire with other paragon burning spells.

I've gotten quite far casting the 15 energy spell. Hence why I said earlier that I almost never run out of energy.
There are "different" ways, not "better" ways. Searing Flames gives advantages over something like, say, blazing finale, in that you can actually target the monsters you want, which is especially useful with ranger or paragon monsters, not to mention that the range of searing flames is Nearby while Blazing Finale is only Adjacent.

I didn't expect that I'd have to defend my build against stupid assumptions, damn.

Skuld · Nov 12, 2006, 11:28 PM // 23:28

It is your elite and half your attribute points. Eles have energy storage. You fail.

Made In Ascalon · Nov 13, 2006, 01:09 AM // 01:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

It is your elite and half your attribute points. Eles have energy storage. You fail.

OH noes! You just posted "You fail."!
That's retarded. So before the Elemental Attunement nerf, all mesmers that played lightning builds failed because they might as well have been eles? No, ofcourse not, because fast casting worked with the bulid and gave it an advantage, but some disadvantages, over playing an elementalist.

I can't play an ele with this build because I use it with leadership, a paragon-only attribute. I don't fail, you do for being a stupid shit.

Vahn Roi · Nov 13, 2006, 01:37 AM // 01:37

Wow, such hostility, and from a moderator...what's happening?

ivanthefool · Nov 13, 2006, 01:44 AM // 01:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

It is your elite and half your attribute points. Eles have energy storage. You fail.

Just what this unfortunately slow growing and pretty quiet guru paragon forum needs, a moderator that will troll peoples build posts with one line replies. Dont like the proposed build fine, mention where you think it is heading wrong, offer suggestions for tweaks. But hey, benefit of the doubt, maybe someone ran over your pet dog or you found out you have genital warts and are just having an off day.

I think I'll give your build a test run once I unlock the ele skills, nice to see paragons arent getting pidgeon holed into one or two builds only.

Ecksor · Nov 13, 2006, 01:47 AM // 01:47

I use a similar build to this, but with P/W instead.

16 Leadership
9 Command
11 Spear Mastery

1. Spear Attack of Your Choice
2. "They're On Fire!"
3. Anthem of Flame
4. Burning Refrain
5. "Watch Yourself!"
6. Blazing Finale
7. Leader's Comfort
8. Signet of Return

I don't know if this build has been posted before, but it works really well. Great defensive and offensive skills. If this has been posted before, credits to whoever made it up.

Thom Bangalter · Nov 13, 2006, 05:35 AM // 05:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by ivanthefool

Just what this unfortunately slow growing and pretty quiet guru paragon forum needs, a moderator that will troll peoples build posts with one line replies. Dont like the proposed build fine, mention where you think it is heading wrong, offer suggestions for tweaks. But hey, benefit of the doubt, maybe someone ran over your pet dog or you found out you have genital warts and are just having an off day.

I think I'll give your build a test run once I unlock the ele skills, nice to see paragons arent getting pidgeon holed into one or two builds only.

moderators should promote quality and discourage crap. The build leans toward the latter. It's pretty easy to see why. Paragons already have a skill that induces burning that they is easily accessible and has a short recharge, there's no point in adding a 15 energy fire hex to give the same effect.

LightningHell · Nov 13, 2006, 07:20 AM // 07:20

No more flaming or /close.

About the build, I must say, Searing Flames isn't efficient. I'd prefer something like Blazing Spear, or if you're THAT stuck on using a Fire spell, Immolate. Searing Flames is just...not good on a non-Elementalist; an Elementalist has to devote half a skillbar to manage it, a Paragon will need even more. And that's not to say that your Searing Flames has less of an effect.

Shadowfox1125 · Nov 13, 2006, 09:06 AM // 09:06

Your build is trying to achieve too many things at the same time. And by doing so, you basically fail at each.

Remove your Fire skills, add your points to Leadership, get a Sup Leadership Rune, and change some skills.

This is a little build that I recently used for Ruins of Morah with a PUG (We got Masters.)
Paragon/Warrior
Leadership 16
Spear 9
Tactics 4
Command (Rest)

Barbed Spear
Lightning Spear
Blazing Refrain
"They're on fire!"
"Go For the Eyes"
Anthem of Flame
"Watch Yourself!"
Sunspear Rebirth Signet

Some other skills to think about:
Leader's Comfort
Burning Refrain
Glowing Signet <- Sounds like a good skill, but really unnecessary when you have Leadership pretty high. 16 gives 8e when an entire party is affected, more than enough when you have adrenaline based shouts/chants.

I strongly disagree that "paragons suck with energy management." I have never had any problems with energy before.

Skuld · Nov 13, 2006, 02:38 PM // 14:38

16 leadership is overkill, I find 12 to be fine, especially with "Watch Yourself!" and "Go for the Eyes!": energy fountains. I've had success with 11+1 leadership, 10+1 spear and 10+1+1 motivation/command. Aggressive refrain is good in a GtfE/WY build :]

jesh · Nov 14, 2006, 07:59 PM // 19:59

I don't see what so many people have against this build. If you read the post, he makes it clear that the point for his build is to keep up a constant effect They're On Fire!. He doesn't claim that he can outdamage an ele. He's playing a support role for his team, and the damage is a side effect. He figured out a way to keep his energy up to make it viable, and most of the replies here are flames. Oh no, a Paragon/Elementalist, what the hell is he thinking? *rolls eyes*

Good job man, something original.

Skuld · Nov 14, 2006, 08:08 PM // 20:08

More like, what the hell is he thinking making half a bad ele, half a bad paragon?

No way around it, a full paragon, or a full ele, or the ele with ToF on a para hero etc would be much superior.

Nice try at originality, but the reason this isn't run is bcos it isn't very good.

Phoenix Ex · Nov 14, 2006, 08:16 PM // 20:16

As long as it works, then its FINE...I actually went and tried it out and it does what its suppose to do effectively: a constant dmg reduction with a damage side effect, ALL in one character.

Obviously an ELE + para would do better because of the combined total of 16 skills and higer attributes, but that doesn't mean this build sucks, since it saves you one character slot to do something else.

JoeKnowMo · Nov 14, 2006, 09:23 PM // 21:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

More like, what the hell is he thinking making half a bad ele, half a bad paragon?

No way around it, a full paragon, or a full ele, or the ele with ToF on a para hero etc would be much superior.

Nice try at originality, but the reason this isn't run is bcos it isn't very good.

I run a similar build (posted in this forum), and it works very well. I go 16 Leadership, 12 Fire and use adrenaline shouts, glowing sig, and fire attunement to manage my energy. I'm able to provide 53% dmg reduction for all allies for about 2/3 the duration of a fight and oftentimes longer. Compare that to Incoming which lasts 1/3 the duration of a fight (lasts 7 secs, downtime 13 secs) and only affects your party. Oh, and each SF does aoe dmg (from burning) of 84 regardless of armor level.

I've played the standard para builds a lot, the pure motivation healer/battery, the command build w Incoming and Stand your ground, the ToF build using burning finale, the spearagon. The SF based build that I run compares quite favorably with these builds.

The OP's build imo has some e-mgmt issues but is still pretty good. The build I run can go from 0e to 30e in a matter of seconds. Each SF only costs 9e with Fire Attunement on, and each adrenaline shout gains you 8e.

Also, even if you have an Ele with SF in your party, their job is not to keep multiple mobs on fire but rather to provide high dmg on one mob. While they're doing that, you could keep the other mobs burning.

The reason this build is not run is not because it is sub-par. It is because people look at it and think that it won't work. If people tried it instead of letting their knee-jerk reactions get the better of them, the verdict would be very different.

So far the people who have tried it, the OP, Phoenix Ex, and myself (altho I prefer my version) all think it does very well. The people who haven't tried it have very strong opinions, none of which comes from having any experience with the build. Conclude from that what you will.