Curse

Priceykins · Oct 27, 2006, 03:14 AM // 03:14

I tried that with a 55 troll build, the results were thus

Can kill avicara(mob of 5 who dont run

) and trolls outside

first mob inside troll cave, say roughly 10.

I go in, ps and hb up, then fire up soj. Trolls hit it for a bit, then all but 3 run at rought 50-75% health. a few seconds l8er soj times out, so trolls have time to regen outside fight to almost full health, and ones infight to about 75%, all trolls come back to fight, i fire up soj, they scatter, but a different 3 stay this time

I cant get the trolls below 25% health using soj with the new update. I am annoyed, but hey, its life, ive already spent a few hours trying out new builds, and I have a promising 55 necro build in the works, ill be sure to keep u all posted

Oznog · Oct 27, 2006, 03:14 AM // 03:14

Wow Sno. You may be the single biggest hypocrite I've ever run into on these boards. Not too long ago my necro was in ToA looking for an experienced monk to duo UW. You were spamming for experienced SS's and I PM'd you. After demanding to know my skill bar, you proceeded to grill me on the exact method I used against various enemies and the order of the skills used. When my responses did not please you I got an abrupt "wrong answer" (direct quote) and you proceeded to continue spamming for your perfect SS partner. I certainly appreciate that it is your prerogative to pick and choose who you duo with, but you really came across as kind of an ass.

Considering the money you've made farming and teaching others to farm I'll thank you to STFU when these changes come as a disappointment to those of us that enjoy the challenge that is solo or duo farming.

Yes, there will be new farming builds. After I play through NF with my chars and it has lost a bit of its luster for me I look forward to going back to farming. I hope that the builds that evolve from today's update are as effective as the old ones. I plan to try as many skill combinations as needed to find a good alternative to the builds we all know and love.

With all due respect to Sno and what he's accomplished, I hope to hell he's not the one that comes up with the new uber build. As insufferably arrogant as he comes across (on the boards and in game, as it turns out) I hate to think that I might have to be grateful to him for a new build.

PS to my story: I did end up finding a very competent monk and we went on several successful duo runs. It seemed like each time we would finish a run and zone back to ToA there was Faithful Sno, still spamming for his perfect SS. I laughed and laughed.

Priest Of Sin · Oct 27, 2006, 03:21 AM // 03:21

Ok, I am going to sound like a massive hypocrite (I've farmed and exploited and ran, ect), but there is more to this game than farming. Granted it is a little depressing knowing that my Dervish and Paragon will have to sit with 1.5k armor for awhile, but oh well. And there are MANY good points to this update. #1, people may have to work for their 15k armor. FoW armor will MAYBE become a little rarer, but I doubt it. Just sit back+play Nightfall, someone will devise a way to farm melee with the same profit we always did.

And yes, this update pissed me off at first.

BigDave · Oct 27, 2006, 04:15 AM // 04:15

Pongmei Valley is still easily farmable with a mist form ele. I had to change my build a little to make it work but it takes me maybe 20 secs longer to take out a group (about 1-2k less per hour, hardly a big deal).

The elementalists got several nice buffs with this update and i've used a couple of them with my farming build. Half the Kirin and Undergrowths are dead before they even get chance to run, and the rest follow soon after.

I've also noticed when helping guildies with missions that large mobs are now easier to deal with. When they start to take a hammering some run and some stay. You know the old saying? "Divide and conquer"? When they run away, they don't attack. When they don't attack, you don't die as easily. They divide themselves up and you can just sloughter them in smaller groups instead of struggling to kill them all before they kill you. I've found questing to be easier after this update, and i use an echo nuker for the most part. The AoE nerf isn't as bad as people think for questing.

Thom Bangalter · Oct 27, 2006, 04:16 AM // 04:16

Sno does pve?

Sno is arrogant?

When did everyone start to hate him? He's a really nice guy in my opinion, just putting the carebears in their place.

Objection!

The game doesn't end because you can't farm. Learn to PvP. After I scrubbed my way through phropecies twice (Degen ele! barrage always on my bar! W/Mo!) I started trudging up the ranks in HA. Then I started GVGing. And it's far more rewarding than the constant tombs green farming I was doing every night back in January.

Batou of Nine · Oct 27, 2006, 06:33 AM // 06:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by lambda the great

Have any of you guys tried farming without Cyclone axe?

Many people do, kthx. Farming will now go from about a 1:10 ratio. Meaning what may have taken us one hour before will take us 10 hours now. It truelly will become that rate with the new melee AI, and so many more skills that now trigger mobs to run...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shuuda

And GW is not about soloing, if you enjoy soloing more than teamwork stuff, online games are not for you.

You my friend have no right to tell people how to play the game, you have your opinion, but people can play solo or with others as they wish... You are not the all knowing GW representative to tell us how they intended for us to play, as i am sure they will also tell you for anyone to play as they wish!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shuuda

If you want FoW armor so badly, why don't you just go in a full team and fight for it, like a man!

So you think people are willing to go from 1 month of hardcore farming (more or less), to about 10 months? I don't think so buddy. More commendable? Maybe, but this silly farming nerf will send FLOCKS of people to Ebay for some easy-ticket gold...

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

These two are examples of people that simply don't get it. The farming nerfs are NOT simply about making cash fast, its the ABILITY to make money, in order to support several characters through PvP. Considering more then just items like Weapons and Armor... SKILLS!! The hundreds of skills we are now FORCED to buy?! And in order to enjoy past the mundane regular aspects of PvE, we are required to have exorbidant amounts of cash.

Admittedly, a person can make several thousand off of each character that plays through a chapter. Yet, that several thousand can dissappear in a instant through skill and item purchases.

Admittedly 2x, farming will still be a viable game aspect, however, it will be so much slower to the point that it could possibly take several months to gain the same amounts that we could previously have gotten in a few weeks. This nich, is NOT simply the dedicated farmers and market players. Farming helps the regular player gain cash every so often when he needs funds for a new character for the simplest of in game needs.

So, to re-iterate my point, its not about farming itself, its about access to game content. Without an ability to make cash in an acceptable amount of time, it will cause MANY people to lose interest, especially the low hour average GW player.

I do not think long term affects were taken into account as to the farming community. Honestly, i only farm when i need to, and enjoy learning new styles, creating my own and reflecting ideas off friends. It will now turn into a fustrating attempt to just stay affloat and get basic equipment for new characters in additional chapters.

Methinks Nightfall will be the last PvE chapter for me, PvP might call me back soon... I say this with a heavy heart as i am a hardcore GW fan. Maybe my opinions will change, but for now i am thinking basic PvE will be too fustrating. More to think about eh?

cheers!

Gavilan · Oct 27, 2006, 08:26 AM // 08:26

The thing i find most irritating is the fact that you can kill a lvl 24+ foe and still get the same crap you do from a lvl 12 fire imp.
Find it strange that they find reasons for nerfing farming builds, but never up the amout of good max weapons from foes that are supposed to be "tuffest in the game"

That being said i dont doubt our ability to find some auther place to farm for cash, so i cant say that im really worried.

Amity and Truth · Oct 27, 2006, 09:26 AM // 09:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter

The game doesn't end because you can't farm. Learn to PvP.

Congratulations on not understanding anything in this thread besides the PVP > PVE Wannabe argument.

Thanas · Oct 27, 2006, 11:17 AM // 11:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by sno

If you think about the basis of the game, all of pve is an attempt to simulate pvp. monster ai is meant to be the same as human intelligence, and as you progress through the game monsters become harder, until you reach the pinnacle (end-game) and progress into pvp. "Farming" was never an intended part of the game, only an inevidable outcome as many gamers are greedy and feel the need to have more of something than the average joe, regardless of how meaningless that something may be.

One or two people were never supposed to simply equip a certain skillbar which makes them invincible to any monsters in a given area, it's simply not what Guild Wars is about. Fortunately for all the whiners, there will be people out there creating new builds to farm even more useless gold (now that pvp creation is equal or better than anything you can get in pve, gold is really quite useless.) Soon enough you'll be able to come on this very forum and copy another skillset that with a very minute bit of skill will allow you to kill many high-level enemies in a short time. You will then repeat this process until your eyes bleed, because to you, change is bad. Having 100% control of the outcome is necessary for some people, which is understandable but not acceptable.

The way I see it there are two rational reasons that people want to stay in pve (and not progress to pvp.) First (and most common I think) people are very lazy, and don't want to actually make the effort to become skilled. They want to bash infinitely less intelligent things simply because they can and it fills their head with epeen. They're the ones that are upset at this nerf, since all that happened is that the monsters became smarter. Second, and much more rare, there are the people that want to avoid the rage and stupidity that human players inevidably bring to the game. This one is understandable, however this update does nothing but help those players. With smarter AI, pve-specific players can still develope a nuance of skill while completely avoiding all human contact (enter: "heroes".)

So really, if you think about it... This update could very well be the best thing to ever happen to Guild Wars, at least for the very short time before people learn how to exploit AI yet again.

Less Crying Is Key, kThx.

Several comments to make.

Firstly I do actually remember Gaille Grey saying something along the lines of farmers will be catered to, since it was recognised this was a form of play in GW, maybe unintended, but there none the less.

Secondly Sno, I gather you have farmed a fair amount of gold, XP etc. Why did you do this if its such a pointless exercise. Your arrogance astounds me.

Finally I am not overly upset by the updates, I can still farm and I'm sure I will come up with some innovative new builds. I like farming as I find it relaxing and I like being able to give my characters interesting items. Oh yeah and I do PVP. Don't generalise, not all farmers are skilless monkeys.

huntingtonm · Oct 27, 2006, 12:02 PM // 12:02

ho hum.

I have a few thoughts on this subject, so i will just go ahead and shoot.

I PVE'd till i had a good understanding of the game mechanics, then sliped into the PVP aspect, the competitive side being far more appealing.

Unfortuantly i also came to realise that to be uber good (read competitive) at pvp there is a need to get custom high level equipment out of the PVE side of the game, so i roll back into PVE to build a N/Mo for the farmin job and now things change.

Not gona cry or whine, since there seems to be plenty of that already along with arrogance and bare faced poppycok. But its a real pisser for the time being and probably fits in with Anet gently encouraging people to buy the next installment.

Have faith and rejoice for the future can be ours, we must simply have the strength to reach forth and shape it as our will desires.

Anet can make a million changes, but the power of the millions playing is key.

G-Humps · Oct 27, 2006, 01:36 PM // 13:36

=P go back to Tyria and run for money =) Best way to make cash again

SirShadowrunner · Oct 27, 2006, 02:21 PM // 14:21

Finally got some time from real life to play GW, remember not
everybody here stays at home all day playing games!!!!!

Farming the troll cave with my monk was still pretty easy and
the tundra giants went down with ease to, so 10:1 time ratio
is not true, basically it is 2:1 now, 2 cycles of SoJ and done, just
not as big as mobs maybe.

Remember even the most "famous" players in the game are
farmers, who wrote-up that spider-cave thread now, hmmmm....

see ya all in NF.....

sage tank · Oct 27, 2006, 02:25 PM // 14:25

lol I dont see why people make a big fuss about this, UW is still feasable if you got the right build. Now instead of dropping all the enemy at once, you do it 1 by 1(which is now easier since all the increase damage). I tested it out with spoil victor and insidious parasite, and doing the last shot with desercrate enchant and defile enchant, a axtaze will drop very fast..(spoil victor + insidious parasite = damage per hit). Since these are life lose "damage", the AI continues to attack, lol. BTW, use both of the visage, you want continuesly drain the smite. yes, it is a bit slow, but definately doable.

ikepdx · Oct 27, 2006, 09:30 PM // 21:30

I tried 55ing the trolls. It is no where near as quick, but it can be done and I found it easier with a 105 monk, as I could attack the trolls who ran off to heal. As soon as they take damage they stopped healing. Took 5 minutes to do the main cave where it would take 40 seconds before.

Korg died in 2 sets of SOJ, same as usual.

Tundra Giants went down just as fast as they had before. Dropped a group of 8 in 30 seconds

Didn't notice the change on Zealots Fire and found it worked fine even losing the 1 energy. It made it harder to farm the Avicara when they have Wise in the group, but so far I managed.

But I figured they were going the nerf the 55 sooner or later and was never into the kill one group, rezone, kill the same group, rezone, etc.

Crap, my inventory is full... got to go...

Edit:
Just noticed salvaging Runes isn't automatic any more. Now THAT is a bit of a bummer.

Edit 2:
I just sucessfully salvaged 4 runes in a row, even though it said I had a 41% chance, so maybe it is still automatic.

Age · Oct 27, 2006, 10:35 PM // 22:35

Quote:

Firstly I do actually remember Gaille Grey saying something along the lines of farmers will be catered to, since it was recognised this was a form of play in GW, maybe unintended, but there none the less.

I wouldn't mind knowing where Gaile said this.I tried the troll cave and it wasn't the same it was before just takes a lit more longer and you have to watch for thier disrupt. chop and the Avicera are easy.You know if the SB build was still good I would consider buying a secound copy for my secound account but not the way things are right now.

mrsmiles · Oct 27, 2006, 11:57 PM // 23:57

i for one love the update makes it more challenging anyways with this update i am still able to solo farm bosses with the A/E build no changes made

Nero_Fayth · Oct 28, 2006, 12:12 AM // 00:12

Solutions include:

~Using a different profession to farm (Ele is often overlooked *wink wink*)

~Start Running (Droks ftw, recycle those melee classes!)

~Farm with a TEAM! (Yea, drop "rate

rofit" is just as good when you factor in the time it takes to finish something as a team rather than solo or duo.)

~Try coming up with a new build---"ZOMGWTF OMG ARE YOU CRAZY?!?" It doesn't take time to make a decent build and start farming with it. You can still farm wardens with warriors, as well as vermin and the like. Maybe Instead of 2 manning the same old way in UW, you could run an earth ele and S-o-L-o. Yes, it is possible and every bit as quick as the old methods.

~Buy low sell high---Haggle with people, buy decent equipment, sell for higher price. (NOTE: Requires elementary knowledge of common courtesy and grammar. **Not recommended for those who play wammo often**)

~Look for new areas to farm, try coming up with a build suited for it---Again, not that hard to do. I myself have several farming spots around denravi which yield the same results as a more profitable FoW run, in less or equal amounts of time.

~Cry moar pl0x.

Mr D J · Oct 28, 2006, 03:51 AM // 03:51

I don't even feel bad because I don't even have an account

... I barely farmed at all... and it didn't make me lots of money so I found other ways to make money... everyone can do that. I started out from 10k 2 weeks ago and didn't play for a week and already got 200k in storage and lots of nice perfect items I'm gonna sell. No thanks to farming... except green drops.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nero_Fayth

Solutions include:

~Start Running (Droks ftw, recycle those melee classes!)

Here's the thing... I tried running forge when I was uber poor (2 weeks ago lol) and guess what... there is nobody wanting you to run them e.g. Cheapskates: LFR 2 Forge for Free. When you try to get someone for 3k... its 0 replies, 2k and I got 1 reply. That was on a weekend too I'm pretty sure. Also, running takes up an awful lot of time and IMHO not worth it. Trading is what really makes money.

Nathan the Skank · Oct 28, 2006, 05:12 AM // 05:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter

Sno does pve?

Sno is arrogant?

When did everyone start to hate him? He's a really nice guy in my opinion, just putting the carebears in their place.

Objection!

The game doesn't end because you can't farm. Learn to PvP. .

When you pay me the 50$ I spent on guild wars, you can tell me to pvp instead of pve.

This update has done it for me, I didn't say anything about the griffons, the warrior damage absorbtion, or even the dying nightmares, but this is too far. I've noticed alot of the people who say they don't care about the farming update already have more money than they know what to do with, or the people with uber crazy builds that them and maybe their guildies know of. Personally I don't pvp because a) my guild is crap and pugs in HA never seem to work for me b) the pvp is dominated by uber guilds c) it isn't interesting. Basically pve was all that really ever interested me. Soloing was easily my favorite part of the game, and now it seems shot to hell. Sure, I could group with a pug, but lets face it, majority of the gw players stink. I don't know if I'm going to play guild wars anymore, too much drama.

The game doesn't know what it wants to be, and it doesn't know what the players want it to be.

Fluffy Butt · Oct 28, 2006, 05:37 AM // 05:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlienFromBeyond

At least Spider farming seems to be intact.

Well 3 man trapper UW farming will still be intact... I hope, LETS GET FAVOR!!