Curse

Tears_Of_Crimson · Nov 28, 2006, 08:28 PM // 20:28

on my paragon i used song of power (http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Song_of_Power)
and then i used mending refrain
(http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Mending_Refrain)
and my energy regen from song of power ended. when the description states that it only ends when a skill is used. thus Ive come to the conclusion that all echos are considered skills?
Why are echos skills? I thought the only skills in the games are the ones that state that it was a skill
(http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Defy_Pain)
or ones that don't have a category
(http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Critical_Chop)
But mending refrain is clearly labeled as an echo.

Any explanations/clearifications would be helpful thanks.

bushe · Nov 28, 2006, 08:33 PM // 20:33

anything on your skill bar is a skill. Spells/attacks/shouts all are skills. Things are labeled as skill just because they aren't anything else in addition to being skills, like a spell or shout.

Etrik · Nov 28, 2006, 08:37 PM // 20:37

The wording in skill descrptions is weird. Take 'attacks' in Life Bond's description for example; it won't trigger from anything but attacks, tho someone hurling a Fireball at you is attacking you, per se.

The word 'skill' in SoP's description refers to any skill. Anything you can put on your skill bar is a skill.

Skills = Attack Skills, Glyphs, Enchantments, Hexes, Stances, Skills [RaO], Preparations, Traps, Echos, Chants, etc.

ss1986v2 · Nov 28, 2006, 08:38 PM // 20:38

all spells are also skills. but not all skills are spells. ok, that should confuse you a bit.

every signet, spell, stance, touch, ritual, or anything else is a skill. then skills are broken into these different catagories.

Spura · Nov 30, 2006, 01:58 PM // 13:58

Everything is very clear.
Everything in the skillbar is a skill.
There are several types of skills, also with subtypes. If the type is denoted as skill then this skill isn't in one of the type or subtype groups.
A skill counts as a member of its group and all the supergroups.

For instance Backfire is Hex Spell -> Enemy Targeted Spell -> Spell -> Skill
Eviscerate is Axe Attack -> Melee Attack -> Attack Skill -> Skill

The element that causes confusion is Expertise description, which used to say it reduces cost of skills, but in reality it doesn't reduce costs of spells like it should per this system because spells are skills.

Incidentally that is why Song of Power totally sucks.

Tears_Of_Crimson · Dec 01, 2006, 12:25 AM // 00:25

yes song of power does suck now that i know what it does

which is just 4 en regen when ur standing there not doing anything

Made In Ascalon · Dec 01, 2006, 04:38 AM // 04:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by ss1986v2

all spells are also skills. but not all skills are spells. ok, that should confuse you a bit.

every signet, spell, stance, touch, ritual, or anything else is a skill. then skills are broken into these different catagories.

It's not that confusing. It's like saying "A square is a rectangle, but a rectangle isn't always a square.

Etrik · Dec 01, 2006, 11:41 AM // 11:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spura

Eviscerate is Axe Attack -> Melee Attack -> Attack Skill -> Skill

Eviscerate is not a Melee Attack. Melee Attacks and [Sword/Axe/Hammer/Scythe/Spear/Bow] Attacks are not one and the same things.

Mystic Sweep is a Melee attack, Eviscerate is NOT. Melee Attacks can be used with any weapon. Just FYI.

And to those saying SoP sucks, let me tell you that it owns. It's great for speeding up inbetween-fight-breaks in both PvE and PvP [AB, anyone?]. Don't like it, don't use it, stop whining.

Mala · Dec 01, 2006, 04:25 PM // 16:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Etrik

Eviscerate is not a Melee Attack. Melee Attacks and [Sword/Axe/Hammer/Scythe/Spear/Bow] Attacks are not one and the same things.

Mystic Sweep is a Melee attack, Eviscerate is NOT. Melee Attacks can be used with any weapon. Just FYI.

But Eviscerate IS a melee attack. Melee attacks are a superset of axe attacks, so not all melee attacks are axe attacks, but all axe attacks are melee attacks.

Axe/Sword/Bow... attacks are the resp. subset of melee attacks that only work with the specified weapon.

I would draw you a nice venn diagram if I weren't too lazy for it
( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venn_diagrams )

Family Draconis · Dec 01, 2006, 06:20 PM // 18:20

It's always funny to hear these people complain about issues that are clearly addressed in the manual, not to mention in the in-game tutorial. Honestly, the only reason I even entered this thread was to get a cheap laugh and to point in mocking at this poor poor player.

Etrik · Dec 01, 2006, 08:27 PM // 20:27

I was tired. My bad, my appologies.

*retreats*

Also, Draconis, you made me lol.

Tears_Of_Crimson · Dec 02, 2006, 12:25 AM // 00:25

i play PvE more than PvP
in the description of the skill Anthem of Flame it says the next attack skill should make the enemy set on fire but the necro skill of Vile Touch doesn't make the enemy burn.(i tested it on the dummies in ToB)

So the definition of an attack skill is different from "any skill that does damage(including spells)", does attack skills only mean sword attacks bow attacks etc and not any spells or hexes which also do damage(cuz from what i read from above posts anything in the skill bar is a skill and AoF requires a attack skill to do burning), is attack skills limited to physical dmg?

thx for the posts so far, im trying to learn more so i can make more efficient builds by myself after the para nerf

and anthem of flame AoF with barrage/dervsish skills which hits multi targets doesnt stack, it burns one random target, i read a lot of posts about how paragons with AoF and ToF can alleviate dmg but i dont see how this is very practical as ur only making a few targets burn IF everyone in your team is not attacking the same target. and i only see ToF to be good in combination with rodgarts invocation.