Curse

Yanman.be · Nov 01, 2006, 04:56 PM // 16:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fabius Cunctator

If only orders and elemental damage got along well

They do?

SnipiousMax · Nov 01, 2006, 05:01 PM // 17:01

^Orders requires physical damage

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blkout

What a fantastic arguement in your defense. It's obvious you're clueless by your lack of debatable testimony.

ummm.... QFT = Quoted for truth. I was agreeing with you.

And in case that wasn't obvious enough:

Despite ease of use, which is often criticized, Barrage has the potential to dump out one of the highest damage outputs in the game. Properly backed by orders, it outclasses many other forms of damage, and is easily the most a Ranger can put out.

You can argue that damage isn't a rangers forte. I'm of the opinion that a Rangers role is to fit into whatever role is is needed in the group. If your group lacks substantial damage, or you know you are going to be facing a swarm mission... than a Barrage ranger is the best option. In other areas or against mobs with high variety, other options are widely availible. With the outset of Heros the options are LIMITLESS. But to argue that barrage is a bad skill because it is easy to use, and IS used by clueless people is ridiculously stupid. Purposely limiting yourself buildwise because of the 'stigma' of using barrage.... Surely we've come farther than that.

Maria The Princess · Nov 01, 2006, 06:04 PM // 18:04

think about it: barrage is a "following AoE"

ele casts meteo shower and some skills = mobs run away and ele is left with the whole skill bar rechanrging

ranger barraging= mobs try to run but ranger just keeps aiming at them

thegreatbabu · Nov 01, 2006, 08:25 PM // 20:25

my typical skillset is as follows:

barrage
vipers nest
barbed trap
flame trap
judges insight
healing breeze
troll ungent
res sig/throw dirt(res sig if i'm not henching)

I hench 90% of the game and i use barrage against single enemies too. i usually do 45+dam per arrow with a vamp bow. i've never had a problem getting into a pug and am always productive in any mission. Oh and a good barrage/trapper rapes luxons in fort aspenwood.

Sticky · Nov 01, 2006, 08:38 PM // 20:38

Im an assassin, if it wasnt for barrage id never get a PUG. I use barrage as a critical barrager. Basicaly, with a high critical attribute and the skills critical eye/sharpen daggers i get more damage than your average ranger barraging and cause bleeding to my opponents. If i stand spam 'A lfg' i get nothing. If i say 'A/R critical Barrager lfg', i often get picked up in a couple of minutes. I enjoy running a critical barrager, and to be honest i dont think id would have done as much ingame as i have if it wasnt for barrage.

jesh · Nov 02, 2006, 05:06 AM // 05:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blkout

I use Barrage, but guess what, I also carry two interrupts as well, I do far more than press one button, Barrage just happens to be my main damage skill. What's so hard to understand about that?

Good for you? Also I doubt you use a recurve bow and I KNOW you don't use Read the Wind. I'd rather have a real interrupter, and I still think barrage is boring.

Sir Mad · Nov 02, 2006, 02:29 PM // 14:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sticky

Im an assassin, if it wasnt for barrage id never get a PUG. I use barrage as a critical barrager. Basicaly, with a high critical attribute and the skills critical eye/sharpen daggers i get more damage than your average ranger barraging and cause bleeding to my opponents. If i stand spam 'A lfg' i get nothing. If i say 'A/R critical Barrager lfg', i often get picked up in a couple of minutes. I enjoy running a critical barrager, and to be honest i dont think id would have done as much ingame as i have if it wasnt for barrage.

Yeah I agree about the "PUG" part: it's really hard (and for some mission nearly impossible: I'd still be in Arborstone if the guys of my alliance didn't help me) for a daggers assassin to find a PUG.

However, for playing both a barrage ranger and a crit barrager I strongly disagree when you say a sin will deal more damage than a ranger because of the bleeding. When you reach the higher areas of the game, even with 16 in crit strikes and the bonuses, you won't have that many crit hits against lvl 24-28 mobs. Crit barragers are great against lvl 20-22 mobs, but that's it. Yes sometimes you'll make a lvl 28 bleed, but you still won't deal more damage than a ranger with 16 marksmanship. And energy becomes a problem in such areas as well since a sin relies on critical hits to manage his energy. And there are also MANY foes that can't bleed...

Don't get me wrong: I like my sin, but I won't say he's better than a ranger with a bow.

Sticky · Nov 02, 2006, 02:46 PM // 14:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir Mad

Don't get me wrong: I like my sin, but I won't say he's better than a ranger with a bow.

Not better with a bow. Just a bit better for damage from barrage. When the build first became popular i remember reading a very big number crunching thread on another forum. The total difference isnt much, but the assassin is a little bit more than a ranger

thegreatbabu · Nov 03, 2006, 12:28 AM // 00:28

i'm very anxious to get my copy of Nightfall later on this month. the dervish and paragon both have some skills that might be interesting combos with barrage.

Blessed of Melandru · Nov 04, 2006, 09:57 PM // 21:57

Why should a Critical strike depend on the Mobs level?

I just use a Zealous Shadow Bow for my sin and it works as well as my ranger with 16 markmanship

I didnt see lots of dervish/paragon skills working with barrage, best is still conjure flame or something like this^^

LagunaCid · Nov 05, 2006, 03:58 AM // 03:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beomagi

Best for pve is subject to debate.

In general? maybe.

My playstyle adapted to quickshot instead. I prefer a fast singlular continuous stream of rapid damage + interrupts to a singular target - Much better if you pick and chose targets - like the annoying healers or mages. My PUG or even henches will survive the other enemies, but Most damage comes from just one or 2 annoyances usually (as a referance to diablo 2 again - strafe vs multi?

).

I havent seen many barrage ranger's that would play dangerously - i.e. Wammo's that play leeroy, and nukers that run to the front line to initiate instead of tanks - cause "mmyy meteor shower is sosooo leeet!! I can hit them fiiirrst!! deedadee!"

Yea, me too. Its kinda fun seeing 4 numbers going up and up each second with Conjure+Kindle+Vamp bow D:

Am I A Good Sin · Nov 05, 2006, 09:50 PM // 21:50

Hello. I need ideas on this 2 skill barrage tactic. U start with professions as P/R and use a bow. Then get leadership and marksmanship as high as u can. Have anthem of fire ( I think that's it. Idk. It sets enemies on fire the next skill that you use ) and barrage. Using anthem of fire and barrage together will cause every1 hit with barrage to be set on fire. U can use the paragon's adrenaline shouts and chants to gain energy back because of the paragons special ability ( gain energy when a shout or chant is applied to u ). Also u can use a zealous bow. This way u don't waste energy on shouts and chants, u cause mass degen and some damage to the opposition, and u support the rest of ur team.

I haven't tried this yet so if any1 does can they tell me their results?

Sir Mad · Nov 05, 2006, 11:08 PM // 23:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blessed of Melandru

Why should a Critical strike depend on the Mobs level?

...

Because that's how it works, eh! The probability to critical hit depends on both your level in the weapon attribute and the difference of level between you and the guy you're striking.

Sticky, I agree with the fact that sins may be good with a bow, I'm just saying they're not better than rangers in higher areas of the game. I generally don't like the threads full of numbers trying to prove something because generally they don't include the whole complexity of the game and make abstraction of many aspects of the game. I haven't checked the thread you're refering to, but to compare rangers vs sins with barrage, you gotta include the time spent casting the sins enchants, make different tables based on the level of the mobs and the different probabilities of doing a crit strike (probability which is not clearly known as far as I know), compare the damage for monsters who can bleed and those who can't, etc. So in this matter I'll stick on my own experience

On a side-note I've just taken my sin to NF and crit barragers are deadly in the 1st missions, better than rangers there, for the damage at least.

Darkpower Alchemist · Nov 11, 2006, 12:50 PM // 12:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

Yeh, remind me not to invite you to my PUG..

Skuld, you wound me to the quick!

I never expected such a response from you.

Needling shot is an awesome skill when used properly. Its better in a spike scenario(with other rangers),but with a solo ranger, it lacks punch,and I agree with that analysis of the skill.

This is a build I have used in AB, with a Ranger/Capping team;

[skill=card]Needling Shot[/skill][skill=card]Read the Wind[/skill][skill=card]Distracting Shot[/skill][skill=card]Savage Shot[/skill][skill=card]Punishing Shot[/skill][skill=card]Troll Unguent[/skill][skill=card]Dust Trap[/skill][skill=card]Dodge[/skill]

Usually, the team will consist of a Poison/Crippling Ranger and another 2 rangers that do a mix of the previous 2 ranger builds. We are rather successful in a team situation. I still like needling shot, but back to Barrage, it lacks in places like AB/PvP/GvG. It's big in PvE strictly because of mobs of monsters attacking all at once.

markus_thom · Nov 12, 2006, 04:29 AM // 04:29

Barrage is a good aoe type of skill, but you will find there are many areas where it is not needed, in many areas interrupt and good single effect damage is needed more.

I was in vortex awhile back teaming up with a necro, to fight Shiro and the Lich.
Necro was set up as minion master. She asked for my build and I told her mine and my hero rangers.

My build: burning arrow, needling shot, distracting shot, read the wind, fav winds, throw dirt, whirling defense, and rebirth. I was Equipped with my trusty iron wing vamp bow.

My heroes build: poison arrow, read the wind, toxity( the -2 degen spirit), storm chaser, whirling defense, distracting shot, throw dirt, and rebirth.
She had Full points into wilderness, and a bow with a lengthened mod 33 percent on poison.

The Necro then asked why you don’t have barrage, and left the party.
I told the necro to go play tombs some more.

Moral of the story.

Some people have done their brain mental damage from playing tombs for to long.

around · Nov 12, 2006, 09:27 AM // 09:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by jesh

Good for you? Also I doubt you use a recurve bow and I KNOW you don't use Read the Wind. I'd rather have a real interrupter, and I still think barrage is boring.

You mean, instead of pressing 1 button, someone who presses three buttons whenever they recharge?

Barrage is a good skill because it frees up skill slots on your bar for other offensive/utility skills. You can interupt just fine with Distracting and Savage, as long as you have decent reflexes.

Shadis · Nov 12, 2006, 11:04 AM // 11:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by spawnofebil

You mean, instead of pressing 1 button, someone who presses three buttons whenever they recharge?

Barrage is a good skill because it frees up skill slots on your bar for other offensive/utility skills. You can interupt just fine with Distracting and Savage, as long as you have decent reflexes.

It's the typical "This skill is popular, so I must hate it to be different and cool!" mentality that a lot of RPG games have. People need to feel important and special, so they pick out popular skills and heap loads of unwarranted hate on it and those who actually, I dunno, have FUN with it as if they're superior because they use different builds.

Kais Unduli · Nov 12, 2006, 02:29 PM // 14:29

Barrage not only works great in some parts of the game, but is a good skill overall in most parts of the game. I used Barrage as my elite for a long time until I learned how to trap better and interrupt/spike better in PvE. I don't see where the hate is coming from. Just because a skill or build is simple to use doesn't mean it should receive the hatred.

Darkpower Alchemist · Nov 15, 2006, 01:42 PM // 13:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kais Unduli

Barrage not only works great in some parts of the game, but is a good skill overall in most parts of the game. I used Barrage as my elite for a long time until I learned how to trap better and interrupt/spike better in PvE. I don't see where the hate is coming from. Just because a skill or build is simple to use doesn't mean it should receive the hatred.

QFT

Cirian · Nov 15, 2006, 03:01 PM // 15:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkpower Alchemist

QFT

Ditto!