Curse

VitisVinifera · Jul 22, 2006, 08:20 PM // 20:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by OMFGimCUTE

i have no problems with touch rangers, mesmers rape them

qft.

I decided to join in the faction farming weekend event, and not being a PVP'er, but knowing I'd be dealing with touch rangers, I just sorta came up with something. N/Me blood degen/domination. You basically cancel out their touch skills with life transfer/life siphon, then cancel out their noobness with backfire and diversion. I'll tweak this a bit with some hex removal and energy stealing tonight.

VitisVinifera · Jul 22, 2006, 08:21 PM // 20:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by OMFGimCUTE

i have no problems with touch rangers, mesmers rape them

qft.

I decided to join in the faction farming weekend event, and not being a PVP'er, but knowing I'd be dealing with touch rangers, I just sorta came up with something. N/Me blood degen/domination. You basically cancel out their touch skills with life transfer/life siphon, then cancel out their noobness with backfire and diversion. I'll tweak this a bit with some hex removal and energy stealing tonight.

original whopper · Jul 22, 2006, 08:22 PM // 20:22

If your proposing to lower the cost to just 5 then that will make Touch rangers more energy effiecent, not to mention we'll have touch necros running around aswell. There are plenty of threads on how to counter them, they aren't really a Problem in serious pvp.

unholy guardian · Jul 22, 2006, 08:31 PM // 20:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pillz_veritas

This would easily lead with touch Necromancers, who can utilize it to its fullest, have additional enery regen and energy. This would be insanely overpowered for them. It is bad with 12 in the atribute... Think about if it was 16.

the natural balancing act between classes is the atribute roof. Touchers cant use the skills as powerfully as Necromancer can with there full attributes.

I give this a sign as long as you reduce the overall effectiveness of the spell by 2 atribute levels. (now atribute lvl 16 will be atribute lvl 14 after change) This would prevent it from being to overpowered.

well backfire... i mean there are so many ways to destroy a caster

Quote:

Originally Posted by original whopper

If your proposing to lower the cost to just 5 then that will make Touch rangers more energy effiecent, not to mention we'll have touch necros running around aswell. There are plenty of threads on how to counter them, they aren't really a Problem in serious pvp.

alliance battles don't count for pvp?

Rok · Jul 22, 2006, 08:35 PM // 20:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by VitisVinifera

qft.

I decided to join in the faction farming weekend event, and not being a PVP'er, but knowing I'd be dealing with touch rangers, I just sorta came up with something. N/Me blood degen/domination. You basically cancel out their touch skills with life transfer/life siphon, then cancel out their noobness with backfire and diversion. I'll tweak this a bit with some hex removal and energy stealing tonight.

Backfire - Hex Spell
For 10 seconds, whenever target foe casts a spell that foe takes 35-119 damage.

Backfire does absolutely nothing to a Touch Ranger, when will people learn.

Diversion on the other hand is good if they are spamming and don't notice it is on them.

remmeh · Jul 22, 2006, 08:35 PM // 20:35

ANet embraces touch rangers in one of those "newspaper" articles.

Touch rangers are zero-skill-required builds.

Thusly, ANet embraces zero-skill-required builds.

It desperately needs fixing, but I don't think ANet will do any such thing. They embrace zero-skill-required builds.

Vermilion · Jul 22, 2006, 08:38 PM // 20:38

Alliance battles don't count as serious pvp, no.

frojack · Jul 22, 2006, 08:39 PM // 20:39

You miss-understand. What he proposes is to make them 'spells' not skills. With the low energy cost, touchers can still take advantage of them, and now, so will the other classes. The added drawback (the balance) is that they are now spells so all the caster hate will apply to them.
Basically this will mean that mesmers will (using the nasty aforementioned term) rape touchers even more than before and give others the ability to do more against them. A good example of this approach would be Star Burst; An offensive touch 'spell' that can be affected by Backfire, PowerBlock, Power Leak, Mirror of Ice etc.

Fluffyx · Jul 22, 2006, 08:49 PM // 20:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

Touch Rangers take zero skill.

That's really the extent of the problem.

Peace,
-CxE

Lots of popular builds take very little skill to use, and I don't see complaint threads on them save x(way)s.

@All:
A good balanced team will always win out against a touch team, and otherwise touch is pretty weak unless they're in numbers.
I'm saying this since I have played touch for awhile and I know what you can and can't fight against.
So touch rangers can solo warriors, so can mesmers, necros, and just about any class you think of. I don't hear people saying nerf melee hate. Get used to it this build isn't a big deal spend your time compaining about something more productive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by frojack

You miss-understand. What he proposes is to make them 'spells' not skills. With the low energy cost, touchers can still take advantage of them, and now, so will the other classes. The added drawback (the balance) is that they are now spells so all the caster hate will apply to them.

If its a spell expertise should not lower its energy cost, so a touch ranger would be using it for what reason? There would be no point to it, the entire point of a touch ranger is taking advantage of a skilless build which is reduced by a high expertise.

Theus · Jul 22, 2006, 09:05 PM // 21:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by remmeh

ANet embraces touch rangers in one of those "newspaper" articles.

Touch rangers are zero-skill-required builds.

Thusly, ANet embraces zero-skill-required builds.

It desperately needs fixing, but I don't think ANet will do any such thing. They embrace zero-skill-required builds.

Who the hell gives a shit about skill?

As long as its effective its good.As as far as I can tell from all the complainers its effective.

..Skill..Lol.

frojack · Jul 22, 2006, 09:54 PM // 21:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fluffyx

If its a spell expertise should not lower its energy cost, so a touch ranger would be using it for what reason? There would be no point to it, the entire point of a touch ranger is taking advantage of a skilless build which is reduced by a high expertise.

You miss-understand. The main point you have not taken into consideration, is the effect of Expertise. We all know Expertise reduces the energy cost of certain abilities. A skill with a 15 energy cost will be reduced to 5 energy with max Expertise (16). The proposed new cost is 5 energy. I shouldn't need to write anymore than this...

bam23 · Jul 22, 2006, 10:03 PM // 22:03

A touch ranger usually uses a staff with full druids, giving him 37 energy. Spamming 5 energy touch spells while keeping his energy up with OoB is still no problem. And then you'll have the touch necro's as somebody mentioned.

beanerman_99 · Jul 22, 2006, 11:57 PM // 23:57

thetechx · Jul 23, 2006, 12:13 AM // 00:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by The truth itself

The problem isn't that they are overpowered, it's just that it is a completely skillless build, and that needs to be fixed.

the build is not skilless. it is a lil bit easier then other builds but is also harder then some builds. look at the echo nuker all he has to is sit back and hit arcane echo then a nuke spell then hit the spell again in a big crow.
cast ele att or fire att before battle and dont have to worry about nrg.
dont take that much skill to hit button.
"PLAY SMART NOT HARD"

Misc Merik · Jul 23, 2006, 12:15 AM // 00:15

Touch rangers are just o so fascinating to everyone...

Why?

who cares....

unholy guardian · Jul 23, 2006, 12:17 AM // 00:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by thetechx

the build is not skilless. it is a lil bit easier then other builds but is also harder then some builds. look at the echo nuker all he has to is sit back and hit arcane echo then a nuke spell then hit the spell again in a big crow.
cast ele att or fire att before battle and dont have to worry about nrg.
dont take that much skill to hit button.
"PLAY SMART NOT HARD"

i don't know a touch ranger hitting the numbers 1 and 2 seem pretty much something a moving paper weight could do

aron searle · Jul 23, 2006, 12:32 AM // 00:32

So all a warrior has to do is C space go, of course hell suck then.

But then if any touch ranger tries doing anything but 1&2, hell also suck.

Any build can be played without skill, just not very well.

bam23 · Jul 23, 2006, 12:34 AM // 00:34

A touch ranger doesn't have as big of a problem with interrupts and enchant removals as echo nukers do.

Kool Pajamas · Jul 23, 2006, 06:02 AM // 06:02

There are tons of builds that require little/no skill to play. Deal with it. Its an effective build (in certain areas) and it is easy to counter with the right skills. No need to nerf it.

I think its just all the whammos are mad because their precious healing hands doesnt work against touchers.

Curse You · Jul 23, 2006, 07:03 AM // 07:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kool Pajamas

I think its just all the whammos are mad because their precious healing hands doesnt work against touchers.

Wow, ignorant much?

I can kill touch rangers, sure. I have a Domination mesmer build that works wonders on them. However, I still dislike them. They cause rather large uproars in the fights, and excessive numbers of them are near impossible to kill.

About making the skills into spells, I am fully against it. I have a necro, I like to carry Vampiric Touch. It's a great counter to opponents using Spell Breaker, Obsidian Flesh, and Shadow Form.
A better (and more sensible) change is to make expertise only work on Ranger skills and all other attack skills. I have said this before, and I will keep repeating it. Rangers have a few too many uses, they can work with any secondary, and counter almost everything with a good build. Why let them have more?