Curse

Siren · Mar 26, 2005, 01:11 AM // 01:11

An idea for a build struck me the other day as I was chatting with a few guildmates. I'm sure there have been some variations (if not this actual type) before, but I was wondering how it looked. Its foci are mainly spell/skill shutdown and toxin damage.

Mesmer/Necromancer

Quote:

Domination Magic: 9
Illusion Magic: 9
Fast Casting: 3
Blood Magic: 12

Skill points used: 199/200

Skills:

Quote:

Soothing Images
Ignorance
Backfire
Conjure Phantasm
Life Transfer
Life Siphon
Well of Blood
Power Leak

I was thinking of either swapping Backfire or Power Leak for Blackout, because if I can health degen the target as much as I can, Blackout will ruin their hope to heal themselves.

Thoughts?

Tuon · Mar 26, 2005, 01:51 AM // 01:51

well of blood is really really hard to use well. Or to use at all, for that matter.

Siren · Mar 26, 2005, 07:59 AM // 07:59

Okay, Tuon, but other than that, how's the build look? Why isn't Well of Blood a worthwhile spell? Why is it difficult to use? What would you recommend in its place?

Insomnia · Mar 26, 2005, 08:23 AM // 08:23

Hav you tried it out before, looks a little heavy on the energy consumation if you're gonna shut down someone AND hex the hell out of somebody, but i might be wrong.

Lord Kinetic · Mar 26, 2005, 01:16 PM // 13:16

I'm not a fan of either of those Professions, but that looks like a good team build, you hex them and take off as much health as you can while keeping a strong health degeneration on them, and your team mates finish them off.

Siren · Mar 28, 2005, 07:43 AM // 07:43

I took Insomnia's feedback and examined the build a bit more closely, and I think I've balanced out the energy consumption issue. Thanks, Insomnia.

I've taken out the heavier energy drainers and replaced them with some skills/spells that should off-set the energy usage of my remaining spells.

Domination Magic: 6
Illusion Magic: 6
Inspiration Magic: 7
Fast Casting: 6
Blood Magic: 9
Curses: 10

Points used: 200/200

Skills:

Spirit Shackles: For 17 seconds, target foe loses 5 energy whenever that foe attacks.
Soothing Images: For 13 seconds, target foe cannot gain adrenaline.
Ignorance: For 13 seconds, target foe cannot use signet rings.
Insidious Parasite: For 16 seconds, whenever target foe hits with an attack, you steal 15 health from that foe.
Life Siphon: For 20 seconds, target suffers health degeneration of 3, and you gain health regeneration of 3.
Life Transfer: For 10 seconds, target foe suffers health degeneration of 6, which you gain as health regeneration. This is an elite skill.
Energy Tap: Steal 11 energy from target foe.
Drain Enchantment: Remove an enchantment from target foe. If an enchantment is removed, you gain 16 energy.

The way I see it, this build can be particularly useful against Warriors, because with Spirit Shackles, the Warrior's low energy pool will be quickly getting drained (exploited, lol) as they continue to attack, which would damper any healing abilities they may have.

Soothing Images blocks adrenaline. Warriors use adrenaline for a chunk of their skills. 'nuff said.

Ignorance, because if a character is using Signets of Healing, I can shutdown that ability for a few moments. I figure that if there's a W/Mo build, chances are, they probably won't be using spells as much as Signets, so Ignorance will prove useful.

Insidious Parasite is there to help keep my health up during combat. I've not counted how many times a character can attack in the span of 16 seconds, but if it's even 3 attacks, then I've got 45 health coming from them, which isn't too bad.

Life Siphon and Life Transfer are two-fold. Like I.Parasite, they're going to act as my health restores, but in regen. I'm looking to slap both of them on a foe and hopefully net a 9 or 10 health degen for the target and get that same amount in regen for myself.

Energy Tap and Drain Enchantment are my energy restores. Drain Enchantment will be doubly useful, because I can remove enchantments from the target and gain energy from it.

Now, I'd like to pump up Blood Magic/Curses a bit more, as well as increase the duration of Soothing Images and Ignorance, so I may back off Fast Casting a bit. Most of the spells in my set don't have terribly long activation times, so I don't foresee it being too much of a problem.

The recharge times are fairly long for most of the spells, and that may prove problematic. I'm still hunting for a fast energy recoup spell. =/

I've been revising this build off-and-on for the past couple of days, and I think it's finally starting to look feasible.

Thoughts?

Ensign · Mar 28, 2005, 09:13 AM // 09:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Siren

Domination Magic: 6
Illusion Magic: 6
Inspiration Magic: 7
Fast Casting: 6
Blood Magic: 9
Curses: 10

I just want you to take a good, long look at this, and decide if this is really what you want to be doing.

Peace,
-CxE

ratatass · Mar 28, 2005, 09:41 PM // 21:41

Ensign is getting to nice on his old days.
Hey, Ensign do you have a PvP char called Evil Ensign ?

Well if you spread the attribute poinst like this, you set yourself up for failure. Looking at your build, yes they are some nice skills. There are some players that spread Mesmers thin for Mind Wrack, Sympathtic Visage and Spirit Shackles, whic is a killer, but then again they have used 3 attribute lines to achieve this. You could do 9,9,9 and add a the rest for your life Siphons in the necro line, but...then again play what works for you. Those 3 skills I mentioned would take care of your objective.

Your build is good, it is very situational though one on one. But it is as good as any of them out there.

The only thing is that you will have to wait on Life Transfer and skills also takes a while to cast. So it won't be instant degen and regen. I forsee that after about 15 seconds both of you will probably be around the same HP. If you can keep it on him and he gets no assitance, yes the Warrior is dead. If he is healed and like I do swithces out my shield with a focus item now and then, and squeeze of a breeze now and then...then you guys are on equal measure. If you are under attack from two warrios you will be dead withinh 12 seconds unless you are very skilled.

I would try it. Crayzy spread on points, but why not.

tastegw · Mar 28, 2005, 10:18 PM // 22:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

I just want you to take a good, long look at this, and decide if this is really what you want to be doing.

Peace,
-CxE

actually i think that would be a great build, but it only has one purpose.
shutting down warriors.

im pretty sure if my war/monk went against a team with that mesmer build, i would for sure not be the last man standing if my team was loosing.

the skill layout looks allmost perfect to be anti warrior build.
you should partner up with a anti caster mesmer for some real fun.

Loviatar · Mar 28, 2005, 11:21 PM // 23:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuperJ24

actually i think that would be a great build, but it only has one purpose.
shutting down warriors.

im pretty sure if my war/monk went against a team with that mesmer build, i would for sure not be the last man standing if my team was loosing.

the skill layout looks allmost perfect to be anti warrior build.
you should partner up with a anti caster mesmer for some real fun.

now if you could be sure of facing only primary warriors who were to stupid to have a secondary profession

spread to thin

Ensign · Mar 29, 2005, 02:22 AM // 02:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by ratatass

Ensign is getting to nice on his old days.

Goddamn kids won't get off my lawn.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ratatass

Hey, Ensign do you have a PvP char called Evil Ensign ?

No, my PvP character slot is Alpha Reject.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ratatass

I would try it. Crayzy spread on points, but why not.

Because Shadow of Fear + Enfeebling Blood is better than his build.

Peace,
-CxE

Siren · Mar 29, 2005, 07:27 AM // 07:27

Ensign, could you elaborate? It's a slowed attack rate and weakness, yes, but why would it be better than the entire build?

Ensign · Mar 29, 2005, 11:19 AM // 11:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Siren

why would it be better than the entire build?

It's a good deal of hyperbole with a hint of truth. I'm going to use this as a springboard to talk about the Mesmer/Necro and my problems with it - I'm not directing this specifically at your build or you personally, so please don't take it that way.

I'd say that something like 99% of Mesmer / Necromancer builds get devoured by something I like to call 'the danger of cool things.' What do Mesmers and Necromancers have in common? They have a lot of interesting toys, a wide variety of powers and effects that make these two classes some of the most versatile. Put the two classes together, and you get a combo that has so many different tricks that it's easy to get lost trying to sort through everything. There's so much going on that it's easy to lose sight of the basics, of offense and defense, of those simple but vital components of a build that actually influence wins and losses.

As a result, focus and practicality take a back seat to cool tricks and new interactions. While I have nothing against tricks or new interactions, realize that those do not make a build. Any character can run a trick or two on their skill bar - across an entire team, you likely have a couple characters worth of tricks. So despite all the toys you have, tricks aren't going to make your character - you're going to have to do something concrete and useful if you want to make it onto a team.

You absolutely have to look at what you're trying to accomplish first and foremost. This is a goal-oriented game, you're already playing an obscure class, and losing site of the goal is just going to result in fairly random characters. You need to know where you're going, figure out how to get there, and work in the synergy and specific skills from that.

Why did I say that Shadow of Fear plus Enfeebling Blood is better than this build? Because the crux of the build is melee shutdown, and because of that you have to compare it to the gold standard - AoE, diverse, unconditional shutdown. Are the anti-melee skills you're using preventing your opponents from being effective attackers? No, they aren't - they're just messing with their ability to use attack *skills*. They're still perfectly able to pound away for 25 damage per swing unmolested. Do the energy costs, cast times, attribute spreads, number of targets, or other parameters compare well? Not particularly. So in general you're not doing as well as the gold standard with few, if any, notable advantages. So why aren't you using the gold standard?

There are some good ideas that can be followed up on, and a lot of bumps that need to be ironed out. I'll get to those tomorrow after I've had a chance to sleep on it.

Peace,
-CxE