Curse

Vittorio · May 08, 2005, 08:35 AM // 08:35

All right, take a look at this build and tell me how it could possibly be stopped:

Monk/Necro - 12 Divine Favor, 12 Blood Magic, All Superior Runes except Vigor, Order of the Vampire, Signet of Devotion, Blood Ritual

Monk/Necro - 12 Divine Favor, 12 Blood Magic, All Superior Runes except Vigor, Order of Pain, Signet of Devotion, Offering of Blood, Blood Ritual

Six Rangers with - 12 Marksmanship, 12 Beast Mastery, Call of Haste, Barrage

The Monks sit back in a safe location while the Rangers wait at a choke point. Once the battle begins, the Monks perpetually cast Order of the Vampire and Order of Pain while Blood Ritualing eachother and healing their extremely low hp with Signet of Devotion. Rangers proceed to repeatedly Barrage while their animal companions attack with Call of Haste on them. The entire enemy team would die almost instantly. If blocking became a problem, Warrior's Cunning could be thrown in. Am I missing something, or would this be almost completely unstoppable?

Lews · May 08, 2005, 08:48 AM // 08:48

Backfire.

Vittorio · May 08, 2005, 08:55 AM // 08:55

Blocked choke point.

Amanita Device · May 08, 2005, 10:01 AM // 10:01

That does sound like it would be very hard to defeat.

The only difficulty would be the degree of teamwork required to pull it off.

Get a group together and let me know how it goes.

JYX · May 08, 2005, 11:51 AM // 11:51

you wanna stand still at a choke point?

a few meteor showers/firestorms/searing heats/deep freeze/fireball/earthquake/aftershock/disease/mark of pain will sort them out good

besides...the enemy team will NOT die almost instantly. Pets don't do that much damage, and barrage is good, but considering the end game char has 480 health, prolly has life bond, a good monked team can cancel that.

Another interesting point...I think Barrage requires line of sight, whereas theres a good few ele AoE spells that don't.

if you wanna abuse ranger/monks then you should take a look at the fertile season build

Vittorio · May 08, 2005, 12:32 PM // 12:32

Everous, please read the post before replying, thanks. The premise behind the team build is ORDER OF PAIN and ORDER OF THE VAMPIRE. Pets and Barrage WILL deal insane damage with those spells up.

And the Rangers would obviously not HAVE to stand on that choke point. If someone moves up to cast, they can just as easily back up or engage them. The entire reason I mention a choke point at all is to signify the area which the Rangers would have to guard to protect the monks. They can even be all spread out. It doesn't matter as long as they're all in firing range when the attack begins.

The Fox · May 08, 2005, 12:38 PM // 12:38

I like it Vittorio

BlackArrow · May 08, 2005, 01:05 PM // 13:05

If anyone gets to your monks they're dead with all Superior runes. They wouldn't have much helath to begin with.

Vittorio · May 08, 2005, 01:17 PM // 13:17

Don't allow them to get to your monks then

I don't imagine it'd be too hard to stop them when each ranger is belting out 50-70 dmg shots to five targets every 2 seconds and they have 6 hastened pets running up to block people and deal 40ish per hit.

The monks have low hp for a reason: low hp = low sacrificial costs = easily healed for no mana by signet of devotion. In fact, that's the entire purpose behind the superior runes.

JYX · May 08, 2005, 01:49 PM // 13:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vittorio

Everous, please read the post before replying, thanks. The premise behind the team build is ORDER OF PAIN and ORDER OF THE VAMPIRE. Pets and Barrage WILL deal insane damage with those spells up.

And the Rangers would obviously not HAVE to stand on that choke point. If someone moves up to cast, they can just as easily back up or engage them. The entire reason I mention a choke point at all is to signify the area which the Rangers would have to guard to protect the monks. They can even be all spread out. It doesn't matter as long as they're all in firing range when the attack begins.

read the post...they still won't deal insane damages with those 2 spells up. I was reading the updates from the last BWE and didn't someone say all calls have been removed? Dunno what that was all about.

Besides, if you're continually casting those 2 spells with the monks then the rangers get no healing, they're either casting those two spells which have poor duration or they're healing themselves. I understand that Barrage and OotV combo can grant good healing, but to sacrifice a monk's touch for that isn't worth it tbh.

Its a good team build and actually quite common, but no its not undefeatable. If the rangers do not stand at the chokepoint then then as Lews said a shutdown mesmer will bring the show to a halt. If they do stand at the chokepoint an ele will bring the show to an even deader standstill. Another thing:

A competent enemy team will split up after your first barrage. Thus your damage to 5 people is highly theoretical. Plus even 70 damage shots aren't THAT impressive considering a fragility build will dish out 100 damage every time he strikes...which is roughly 75DPS against you 35DPS. So insane damage? hardly.

Besides, damage isn't everything, you are lacking in disruption, anti-caster, interrupts etc. if you wish to squeeze the most out of those rangers. You can have Savage shot which'll do good. No shutdown to speak of...

What're you going to do against Amity/ Enfeebling Blood on your rangers. Order of the vampire and order of pain cost 10 energy a piece to cast. It only lasts 5 seconds. Some energy drain or malaise will wreck you...not that you'd be able to continually cast those two anyway.

Problem is with low health on the monks that spike damage will kill very easily. When you're using all superior runes...theres extreme danger that a lightning ele will kill you in 2-3 seconds using a few high impact high energy spells.

Cronos · May 08, 2005, 05:48 PM // 17:48

Yeah couldn't I just like cast Fire Storm or something and blast those Monks to death? People who aren't the most ELITE couldn't block everyone.

Anarchy 2k · May 08, 2005, 05:48 PM // 17:48

Healing Seed, gg.

Vittorio · May 08, 2005, 10:14 PM // 22:14

lol, ok, let me clarify AGAIN...the monks can be standing ANYWHERE ON THE MAP to do their job. ANYWHERE. This means that the rangers don't have to stand in ONE SPOT in order to achieve their goal of preventing people from getting to them. Also, I thought about it a bit and I believe that the casters of order of pain and vampire could be even more effective by being ele/necros. With Aura of Restoration up at level 8 (11 from a superior rune), they'd recover all hp lost to sacrifices as well as have a ton of energy in their reserve. This would leave enough attribute points to throw 12 into blood and 10 (13 with superior) into another skill which could be used for defensive/offensive spells in the event of someone slipping through the rangers. Another route the rangers could take for more damage potential would be to sacrifice a few points in Beast Mastery for some points in Wilderness Survival to utilize Favorable Winds and Winnowing.

Also, how on earth do you figure that the rangers would be dealing 35 dps? Barrage hits FIVE TARGETS, not to mention the damage their pets would be doing. And the enemy team splitting up? lol, how would that work, exactly?

However, Anarchy is right when saying Healing Seed (if used precisely) could overthrow this build. BUT, there is, of course, a perfectly legitimate counter for that, as well. As long as the Order monks/elementalists are far enough back, Nature's Renewal could be used to destroy Healing Seeds as well as any other annoying enchantments that may prevent success.

Adacia Calla · May 08, 2005, 10:37 PM // 22:37

You fail to realize that 2 warriors could make short work of any one of those monks. All that healing is nice, but when you get hit for 400 damage in a second by the warriors hopped up on meds, you stop healing your crew for a split second, and that's all it takes for a team to fall. How do I know? Because I've seen it done.

Vittorio · May 08, 2005, 10:41 PM // 22:41

gosh, forget it. no one has the attention span to read the strategy carefully enough to have any intelligent input.

May 09, 2005, 02:04 AM // 02:04

well how do you expect people to make a fair critique when what you posted is pretty much a half-assed build? :/

akiasura · May 09, 2005, 02:15 AM // 02:15

I agree with Blacklace 100%

It seems to me that if they don't bow to your uber-ness they are idiots.
You sir, need to get off your high horse and realize these people are trying to help you. Just because you don't like what they say does NOT mean they are in any way wrong or stupid.

Also, anytime your calling everyone in a discussion stupid and wrong...your probably wrong. At the very least, you need to take a good look at your reasons for thinking so.

Adacia Calla · May 09, 2005, 02:40 AM // 02:40

Yeah, no group no matter how uber always loses. Look at HoH, there are new names on there all the time.