Curse

Eonwe · Aug 19, 2005, 08:28 PM // 20:28

Not putting 16 in your weapon attribute, in my opinion, is just plain stupidity.

Calibretto_9 · Aug 19, 2005, 08:42 PM // 20:42

Alot of times the warrior is the first to die because he runs a little too far ahead of the group. We all know a warrior has to be up close to fight, and normally the monk (Which is often the primary target) is far behind enemy lines. So of course the warrior bolts off to attack said target, but by the time you've gotten there you've got all kinds of elemental, hex, and condition damage. Oftentimes just slowing down so you can stay with your monks will show why warriors are never targeted. Too much armor, therefore too easy for the monk to keep at full health.

To me, 16 is really the only way to go for axe builds.

Neo-LD · Aug 19, 2005, 09:25 PM // 21:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calibretto_9

Alot of times the warrior is the first to die because he runs a little too far ahead of the group. We all know a warrior has to be up close to fight, and normally the monk (Which is often the primary target) is far behind enemy lines. So of course the warrior bolts off to attack said target, but by the time you've gotten there you've got all kinds of elemental, hex, and condition damage. Oftentimes just slowing down so you can stay with your monks will show why warriors are never targeted. Too much armor, therefore too easy for the monk to keep at full health.

Its a spur of the moment call, but this is why it is sometimes better to go for the mesmer. (at least initially)

Van the Warrior · Aug 19, 2005, 09:29 PM // 21:29

ive tried yukito's build out i placed weaken armor on the caster type that was the most threat...stood next to the SoB hit frenzy and was default attacking at 60 dmg per second its a fun a nifty skill works best with a SMART solid heal monk on the team

Calibretto_9 · Aug 20, 2005, 01:00 AM // 01:00

I agree Neo, I often will do the same. Sometimes a caster will stray too far to the front, confident that the monk will be the primary target. Nailing him instead is a great way to start the fight off, because the monk's now having to scramble to keep him alive, said caster takes off running, and regrouping becomes primary concern rather than attacking the warrior.

Yukito Kunisaki · Aug 20, 2005, 03:28 AM // 03:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eonwe

Not putting 16 in your weapon attribute, in my opinion, is just plain stupidity.

And that is a flame. Thankfully, your opinion doesn't matter much to me seeing as I obviously play people who are idiots 99% of the time since I'm always being attacked quickly. [most of the time, my monk IS within heal range...]

This "generalizing" that all warriors aren't targeted first all the time is something I've learned not to accept any longer. With a monk a warrior supposed to be hard to kill? Without a monk a warrior supposed to be hard to kill? Come on...

Anyone with a brain knows that killing a warrior is NOT a matter of 2 hours of workable strategy. Armor piercing skills, negate warrior's monk backup for about 3 seconds, and bam, dead warrior. Having 16 in your weapon only ensures your death that much faster.

If anyone thinks a warrior is too hard to kill in 7 seconds or less, they obviously don't get it... Then again, any class is easy to kill in 7 seconds, just need the right strategy. It's sickening to me that people say one thing, when I'm experiencing the other 99% of the time...

Bah to them! bah!!

Calibretto_9 · Aug 20, 2005, 04:48 AM // 04:48

I wouldn't agree. A sup rune loses 75 health. Now lets think about that... 75 damage can be dealt in one decent spell, so you have 2 ways of thinking: No rune, and give yourself the time to attack for a little bit longer, or take a rune, and kill the threat more quickly. It all comes down to what the warrior's job is.

When an axe warrior is in your team, you want dps from him, correct? Well, an axe warrior with 16 is going to outdamage an axe warrior with 12, and not by any small margin. Therefore, you give up 75 health, yet become that much more efficient at doing what it is your team needs you to do.

Now there's also this point that must be remembered: A warrior with no self heals is not ridiculously hard to kill, as it may sometimes be said. Harder to kill than most casters, but not too hard. On the other hand, a warrior who does bring self heals is one of the hardest classes to kill in the game. Since the opponent doesn't always know which it's going to be (Moderately difficult to near impossible), they're going to pass over you. And for that reason, warriors began, and continue to throw self heals out the window to become more efficient at what they are brought along to do.

You also have to keep in mind (And when I say "you," I don't point out Yukito so much as to anyone reading the post) what form of PvP you're playing in. Random/Team PvP, and yes, a self heal isn't completely absurd. With only 4 players, you WILL be targeted at one time or another. But anything beyond that like tombs or GvG, and bringing a heal is obnoxious, because if the enemy begins attacking you, guess what you're doing? Right class! You're tanking!! If the heat is on you and not, say, a monk or mesmer, well my friend, you've just won that match.

Yukito Kunisaki · Aug 21, 2005, 03:05 AM // 03:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calibretto_9

I wouldn't agree. A sup rune loses 75 health. Now lets think about that... 75 damage can be dealt in one decent spell, so you have 2 ways of thinking: No rune, and give yourself the time to attack for a little bit longer, or take a rune, and kill the threat more quickly. It all comes down to what the warrior's job is.

When an axe warrior is in your team, you want dps from him, correct? Well, an axe warrior with 16 is going to outdamage an axe warrior with 12, and not by any small margin. Therefore, you give up 75 health, yet become that much more efficient at doing what it is your team needs you to do.

Now there's also this point that must be remembered: A warrior with no self heals is not ridiculously hard to kill, as it may sometimes be said. Harder to kill than most casters, but not too hard. On the other hand, a warrior who does bring self heals is one of the hardest classes to kill in the game. Since the opponent doesn't always know which it's going to be (Moderately difficult to near impossible), they're going to pass over you. And for that reason, warriors began, and continue to throw self heals out the window to become more efficient at what they are brought along to do.

You also have to keep in mind (And when I say "you," I don't point out Yukito so much as to anyone reading the post) what form of PvP you're playing in. Random/Team PvP, and yes, a self heal isn't completely absurd. With only 4 players, you WILL be targeted at one time or another. But anything beyond that like tombs or GvG, and bringing a heal is obnoxious, because if the enemy begins attacking you, guess what you're doing? Right class! You're tanking!! If the heat is on you and not, say, a monk or mesmer, well my friend, you've just won that match.

Good post. And I must say that even though it's true I live longer for that much, I kill faster if I die faster. That's the trade off. One thing I did notice though, they say nobody tanks in pvp, though people still have entire teams of 8 shooting at them. [monks aren't tanks in pvp? lol] In any case, there is one thing I'm curious about.

Canthan Targe - preorder shield

armor 14 (req. tactics 10)
energy +2 (req. swordsmanship 8)
energy +2 (req. Axe 8)
hp+30 (req. strength 8)

I know there are better shields out there with better efficiency in both results and stat output, can someone tell me [or better yet, show me in a pic or in game] a shield that does 3 things for me at max efficiency?

a: high def
b: energy boost
c: hp boost

OR

if it's already 16 armor for X strength,

b: effect 1?
c: effect 2?

If someone can show me a shield that's THAT much better (which I'm guessing it is easy to find, just that I'm unlucky and everyone else is...), I'd like to trade or buy it off ya. ^_^

I'd like 2 HOT bonuses that are comparable to +2 energy/+30 hp.

edit* I want the shield to look cool too. Not like shadow/eternal but at LEAST something worthy of a high ranking knight. Tall Shield being minimum. I dislike the round/crude/wooden/poor 'dirty' shields ^_^ If it's shadow/eternal, hey, I'm for it ^_^

Diestro · Aug 21, 2005, 04:08 AM // 04:08

Like you, I've seen tons of teams in the random arenas targeting warriors right off the bat. Whether they're new players that don't know better, or experienced warrior killers doesn't matter, they're still bringing the fight to the fighters.

As far as your shield goes, although I don't play warriors very often, I'ld agree that there are shields out there better suited for your role. Since you like to use frenzy, opening yourself up for increased dam, I don't see why you wouldn't want a max defense shield. Personally, for your build, I'ld want to go with a 16def shield that has -dam while in stance, since your build needs the adrenalin surge from frenzy to pull off the desired combo effectively, and you'll be using it frequently. Now I'm not sure if losing the bonus 2 energy would hurt your effectiveness much, but it seems the extra defense would serve you better in the long run that the extra 30hp.

These are, of course, only my opinions, and I've seen alot of posts arguing +hp vs defense. In my case, I prefer the extra defense, since that will help against a majority of the attacks I'll face, although I have seen an increase lately of direct dam spells and max degen builds, which of course would be helped more by increased hp. In general, be it random, team, gvg, or tombs, I'll go with the defense in hopes it'll keep my dam down enough that the monk doesn't have to worry about me as much.

Nightwish · Aug 21, 2005, 09:29 AM // 09:29

In comp arena, its often that my warrior gets targeted before others except monk or mesmer, for reasons I yet to discover (and no, my warrior is not below lvl 20 and hes wearing the highest Al :P)
For gvg, my warrior is less targeted but I cant support this firmly as my gvg experience is much lacking compared to arena =/

Yukito Kunisaki · Aug 21, 2005, 03:29 PM // 15:29

From what I've read from ensign and others...

For people with low armor values, higher armor values helps. For us warriors or rangers with already high armor values, adding more armor doesn't protect us from what people will be using [armor piercing] skills.

Therefore, getting extra hp is ALWAYS good when you're the warrior people want dead asap using -10 degen ON TOP of armor ignoring lightning or smite magic.

ICURADik · Aug 22, 2005, 02:49 AM // 02:49

You can't trade the preorder shield...

Yukito Kunisaki · Aug 22, 2005, 06:00 PM // 18:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by ICURADik

You can't trade the preorder shield...

I know. You can't even dye it or drop it on the floor either. However, I'll trade other things... ^_^