Curse

Yukito Kunisaki · Aug 17, 2005, 06:22 AM // 06:22

This is a random arena build and I've decided to just step into this place using some of the 'old school' skills from presearing and such... Using some of the most basic skills [save for elite], I found this build to be stupidly powerful in random arena...

(and yes, I'll admit for now that sudden adrenal spikes with an axe are teh sexay... 300 dmg+ in UNDER 3 SECONDS?!?!!!!

)

This build does, without a shadow of a doubt, Elementalist style damage IF the enemy doesn't react within the 4 seconds or so.

I feel like such a noob...

stats: 7+1 Strength, 10+2 axe, 9+1 Tactics, 10 Curses

Penetrating Blow
Eviscerate {E}
Executioner's Strike
Frenzy
Healing Sig
Sprint
Plague Touch
Weaken Armor

Just thought to post it here, outside Plague and Evis, each skill is pretty much newbie-ville skills you get early game. Just goes to show how AWESOME Guild Wars is whereas in other MMORPGs, your early game skills are almost always thrown aside as crappy...

I couldn't believe my eyes, but these "I'm guessing" decent monks can't stand next to me for more than 5 seconds without dying. Or any other class for that matter...

I nailed a warrior with Penetrating Blow, Evis, Exe Strike WITHOUT Weaken Armor using a Frenzy burst and ripped him down 250+ hp... Am I seeing things? Is the 'adrenal burst' SUPPOSED to hit this freakin' hard? I can understand that with weaken, this build should pretty much mow down the chosen target, but WITHOUT weaken, this thing is still doing something nasty beyond belief...

Healing sig I'll never call a crap skill again. This thing saved my ass from -10 degen for 15s... I'm glad they made it so that it's -40 armor vs. 2x dmg input... [whew]

This is probably the most efficient energy-wise build I've made thus far with my little warrior. (and yeah, I shrunk his ass to as short as the game would allow)

It's funny watching a short dude tear up VERY tall people... ^_^

Hope this helps some new guys trying out trix and such, I should find more 'old school' skill builds where u use as few late game skills as possible... It's neat... ^_^

The Red Knight · Aug 17, 2005, 01:41 PM // 13:41

16 axe FTW =/ healing sig only good in comp arena :b Team arena FTW and yes evis exec and penetrating = Great damage output

Moskel · Aug 17, 2005, 02:54 PM // 14:54

Yeah if you like your damage with 12 axe mastery, try 16 (12 + headgear + superior axe).

Then get a smiter on your team to stack judge's insight on you. I've hit for 200+ on targets before with Executioner's Strike

Neo-LD · Aug 17, 2005, 03:19 PM // 15:19

for random arena this is good, but this build is good enough to move up to at least TA if you tweak a couple things.

First, get rid of tactics and healing signet. Its the monks job to heal, not yours. Wasting 2 seconds on a crappy self heal doesnt help you kill the target.

Put in a res sig, I dont know why people dont carry them. They are the single most important skill for ANY arena character. I get so mad when we out play an enemy team only to lose cus the nubs didnt bring their sigs.

Raise Axe to 16. There are several threads on that, generally it is agreed that a warrior should pretty much always have 16 in his weapon no matter what.

Im not so sure about weaken armor... isnt that a 3 second cast? w/e if it works keep it. If you want to try something else try putting in swift chop to spam on any attacks that arent being taken up by adrenal skills.

ElderAtronach · Aug 17, 2005, 03:59 PM // 15:59

Weaken armor rocks. It's like a 30 second JI for 10 energy. The 3 second cast hurts, but it's well worth it in the long run especially if the other team doesn't have hex counters. I'd agree with scrapping healing sig for res sig though... even in random arenas, I can't justify the use of healing sig as a self-heal. Since you're using curses anyway, why not try to squeeze parasitic bond in there? ~80 pt heal plus 1 degen on your enemy, and it's short recharge so you can put it on the entire team if you have the energy

Tevash Szat · Aug 17, 2005, 04:26 PM // 16:26

Sure most of the skills you have there is from the beginning of the game except for evisecrate which is at the very last mission..

Yukito Kunisaki · Aug 17, 2005, 05:07 PM // 17:07

The reason I carry tactics is due to my preorder shield. I wonder how many times I've said that? lol

What's more, try not to think too hard on random arena vs. tvt or something. This is Random Arena build only. The reason I don't have a res sig is because I'm designed to be the first to die on team. [not that I mind, that means I'm fighting and not cowering like some smushy character]

Healing Sig allowed me to fend off two warriors. [the fact that the enemy kept hitting me with blind/weakness and I simply spread it between the two was quite amusing]

Yes, in Team Arena build, the healing sig will most likely be chucked for res sig, but in a place where monks might not be on your team, I've decided that of all the skills a w/n will want, Healing Sig is the one...

I've had parasitic bond before and I know that even if it's removed, YOU DO get healed by it, however, when massive DoT hits you, you don't have 20s. to wait for it to kick in if the enemy is either not dying fast enough or doesn't remove the hex. Healing sig needs no energy. [and this build uses energy quite readily due to plague touch]

At least I can fend off 10 degen from condition/hex blends. Not if it's just hexes... [damn life transfer + siphon] From there, it's healing sig spam all the way...

Yukito Kunisaki · Aug 17, 2005, 05:12 PM // 17:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moskel

Yeah if you like your damage with 12 axe mastery, try 16 (12 + headgear + superior axe).

Then get a smiter on your team to stack judge's insight on you. I've hit for 200+ on targets before with Executioner's Strike

The reasons I don't go past 12 are 2fold...

1. I'm conservative, I can't run 12/10/10/8 if I go for 16. I like several stronger stats instead of one monster stat and a few meager ones. That and I like minimizing weaknesses vs. maximizing strengths. It's worked for me thus far and I have no reason to fix it ^_^. My ability to defend against calamity with 12 for max vs. 16 is also higher.

2. I like my hp, I run around with 551 due to my pre order shield and minor vigor rune. [I'm poor] I NEED to punch it to 581 if there's a +30 fortitude axe piece. What's the highest Fortitude hp one can acquire? I'm thinking it's +30...

Syno Nym · Aug 17, 2005, 05:28 PM // 17:28

Healing signet rocks, not only for random arena but also for GvG or tombs (well, dunno about tombs actually...).

The current metagame is sliding from pur spirit spam to spirit spam + energy denial. So do you know what happens when your monk is oom ? You die... Unless you have something to heal !! Oh yeah, here's healing signet.

Since the damage output of these teams is usually based on life degeneration, you don't risk much getting -40 armor while using the signet.

I would recommend Troll onguent for rangers too, really cheap and useful.

Now if you think I'm a noob... ask the better korean teams what they think about that.

(we fought a few of them using only two monks and tree warriors with tactics, healing signet, and a traper with Troll onguent).

thekolman · Aug 18, 2005, 12:07 AM // 00:07

If you are going to spec out curses I'd use rigor mortis instead of weaken armor. I like it better then warrior's cunning (crap as it is right now) despite the cast time.

Plague touch is fun to use, but it can be inefficient. If you want to give, say crippled, to your target but you are layered with conditions, you might have to use plague touch two or three times just to get the other conditions off you before transferring cripple. That's 15 energy right there which is alot for a warrior to use. Still though, nothing is as funny as a ranger throwing dirt on you and you transferring blind right back to him

Kishin · Aug 18, 2005, 01:54 AM // 01:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yukito Kunisaki

The reason I carry tactics is due to my preorder shield. I wonder how many times I've said that? lol

And you're PvPing with your PvE character why? A PvP Shield is not only superior to your Pre Order shield, its usable based off Strength, freeing up your points for the real meat of your build, which is offense, offense and more offense. The only reason I can see for PvPing with a PvE character (other than aesthetics and an attachment to that character) are if you haven't unlocked the items you need for the build and can get them relatively cheap.

That so,You could probably pick up a maxed out strength shield pretty easily as well. 580 HP isn't that important to a Warrior who's the final target in any battle anyway, and 16 Axe gives you more overall benefit to an offensive build than a shield and Healing Signet. No matter how you design yourself to be 'the first one to die on the team', you're still getting targetted last. It's the way things work with Warriors.

Yukito Kunisaki · Aug 18, 2005, 04:56 AM // 04:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kishin

And you're PvPing with your PvE character why? A PvP Shield is not only superior to your Pre Order shield, its usable based off Strength, freeing up your points for the real meat of your build, which is offense, offense and more offense. The only reason I can see for PvPing with a PvE character (other than aesthetics and an attachment to that character) are if you haven't unlocked the items you need for the build and can get them relatively cheap.

That so,You could probably pick up a maxed out strength shield pretty easily as well. 580 HP isn't that important to a Warrior who's the final target in any battle anyway, and 16 Axe gives you more overall benefit to an offensive build than a shield and Healing Signet. No matter how you design yourself to be 'the first one to die on the team', you're still getting targetted last. It's the way things work with Warriors.

My PvE character finds better items in PvE than in PvP. I like what the shield does for me and there are very few shields anyone has shown me that makes me not want my Canthan Targe. What you said makes no sense. How can I be targetted last if I'm the first one to die? [um, paradox? are you speaking to me in riddles? Logic states that if you die first, everyone wants you dead first at least...]

Like I've stated before, by not going 16, I increase my character's efficiency and versatility. I do read up on these things and my choice is a sound one. If I lose several points in two stats just to add 1 in another, I'm NOT being efficient. [It's been stated a billion times by people who've studied this game and I'm not going to argue with them. And it makes all the sense to me because I believe more in logic.] Logically speaking, it's like having a bazooka, but no armor in a firefight. Sure I can kill things, but I'll be easy to kill too. And I for one refuse to believe the "warriors are targeted last" routine. I've fought some very dangerous teams where I'm dead wayyy faster than any monk could save me. A warrior can die in seconds with the right setup from an enemy(s).

Until I experience a long slew of fights where I'm ALWAYS the last one standing, nobody can tell me "Warrior's are never targetted ya noob." I've experienced too much of the contrary for me to ever believe in those words again. [and no I'm not fighting noobs, these are people (some Korean) who KNOW how to kill...]

Those of you other warriors out there, if you WANT the maximum 16 stat, then go ahead, but I'm telling you right now, some teams just want you dead knowing it's no hassle to kill you as a warrior...

When you're hp drops to 10% in 2 seconds [hey it DOES happen even with all this armor], you'll understand why I never go past 12...

The Red Knight · Aug 18, 2005, 01:23 PM // 13:23

meh I pvp with my pve 15k plate mail sup axe sup vigor sup absorb max damage axe 15% while in stance 16 11 str req shield quick recov from cripple and+28 hp constantly

. Who the hell focus's warriors first yukito? maybe empathy or blind but thats about it =/

FrogDevourer · Aug 18, 2005, 01:55 PM // 13:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yukito Kunisaki

(and yes, I'll admit for now that sudden adrenal spikes with an axe are teh sexay... 300 dmg+ in UNDER 3 SECONDS?!?!!!!

)

This build does, without a shadow of a doubt, Elementalist style damage IF the enemy doesn't react within the 4 seconds or so.

It's a great way to kill sitting ducks in the random arena. You need at least 10 seconds to build up and release adrenaline and to deal damage, you have no way to snare your opponent, and you're assuming he's neither using avoid/block stances/wards/spells, nor running, nor being healed (any divine healer will self-heal 300dmg in 2s thanks to the 10+ energy you gave him with Balth Spirit), nor being enchanted by a Prot.Spirit. Yes warriors are great, but I'm personally much more annoyed by snares & knockdown locks from warriors. As far as spikes are concerned, I personally hate unexpected focussed spikes from elementalists that I can't run away from, and that I can see running toward me.

Yukito Kunisaki · Aug 18, 2005, 04:07 PM // 16:07

Yes, it does take time for the spike to build from this build, but it's a warrior build, not an elementalist build.

What's more, wth focuses a warrior? Maybe 2 people tops. That's all it takes. A fragility bomber in random arena is quite deadly. Remember, this is for random arena... For other arenas I'm almost always going to bring my conditions disruptor build. But in random, I think this build does the best for me.

The 4 seconds I'm referring to is if the enemy doesn't know about the adrenaline you've built. Doing frenzy and then the 3 strikes of this build to a non-stanced/enchanted user is probably the best shot at maximum dmg.

If I AM fighting stance/enchant defense, then I should have brought my conditions disruption build which uses Swift Chop and Rend.

ICURADik · Aug 18, 2005, 10:39 PM // 22:39

The way axe works, it gains fair amount more at 16 compared to sword and hammer. Because axe has such pathetic minimum damage, that in turn pulls the average damage down, increasing your number of crits is very more important(it is no doubt important on sword/hammer, but doesn't result to nearly the jump that axes gets). The crit chance at 12 and 16 skills is 16% and 21% respectively(GWOnline numbers) against an equal level foe.

16 weapon skill gives a 15% damage bonus along with the 38% bonus applied by a perfect weapon(15%x20%). On a sword you average hit is (24+35)/2=29.5, and on an axe the average damage is (10+44)/2=27. A critical hit for a sword is 49(35*1.41) damage, and a critical hit for an axe is 62(44*1.41).

With crit chance to way to calculate your average damage is simply to multiply crit chance by the crit damage and (1-crit chance) by the average normal hit and add the two numbers.
Sword damage(12 skill): (.16*43+(21+30)/2)(1-.16))=6.88+21.42=28.3
Axe damage(12 skill): (.16*55+(8+39)/2)*(1-.16))=8.8+19.74=28.54

Sword damage(16 skill): 10.29+23.305=33.595
Axe damage(16 skill) 13.02+21.33=34.35

In the end axe actually gains about 20% more damage from 12 to 16 weapon skill, while sword recieves an 18% benefit.

This is on a stationary target. If for example you were fighting a moving target, you crit chance might approach 50%.
In this case the average damage on a sword is 24.5+14.5=39
On an axe is is 31+13.5=44.5

What I'm trying to say is that axe depends on crits, a very large amount. And at 16 skill weapons have a noticable amount of more crits than at 12. The only time I would ever keep a weapon at only 12 would be if I was using a sword, or running a R/W.

ICURADik · Aug 18, 2005, 10:42 PM // 22:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Red Knight

meh I pvp with my pve 15k plate mail sup axe sup vigor sup absorb max damage axe 15% while in stance 16 11 str req shield quick recov from cripple and+28 hp constantly

. Who the hell focus's warriors first yukito? maybe empathy or blind but thats about it =/

Good to see more people are using while in stance instead of health>50%.

Jake · Aug 18, 2005, 11:24 PM // 23:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yukito Kunisaki

Like I've stated before, by not going 16, I increase my character's efficiency and versatility. I do read up on these things and my choice is a sound one. If I lose several points in two stats just to add 1 in another, I'm NOT being efficient. [It's been stated a billion times by people who've studied this game and I'm not going to argue with them. And it makes all the sense to me because I believe more in logic.] Logically speaking, it's like having a bazooka, but no armor in a firefight. Sure I can kill things, but I'll be easy to kill too. And I for one refuse to believe the "warriors are targeted last" routine. I've fought some very dangerous teams where I'm dead wayyy faster than any monk could save me. A warrior can die in seconds with the right setup from an enemy(s).

Until I experience a long slew of fights where I'm ALWAYS the last one standing, nobody can tell me "Warrior's are never targetted ya noob." I've experienced too much of the contrary for me to ever believe in those words again. [and no I'm not fighting noobs, these are people (some Korean) who KNOW how to kill...]

Those of you other warriors out there, if you WANT the maximum 16 stat, then go ahead, but I'm telling you right now, some teams just want you dead knowing it's no hassle to kill you as a warrior...

When you're hp drops to 10% in 2 seconds [hey it DOES happen even with all this armor], you'll understand why I never go past 12...

If using a superior rune made me die too fast to make use of any damage I wouldn't use it obviously, but that's not the case, I believe I'm fine. I make use of specialized builds to take care of certain situations that seem to bother warriors, whilst still keeping the 16 and a good amount of str and run into no trouble. Whatever floats your boat though doesn't really matter to me.

Yukito Kunisaki · Aug 19, 2005, 07:07 AM // 07:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by ICURADik

This is on a stationary target. If for example you were fighting a moving target, you crit chance might approach 50%.
In this case the average damage on a sword is 24.5+14.5=39
On an axe is is 31+13.5=44.5

Actually, when an enemy runs, your crit rate is 100%. So yeah, your 16 axe rating is pretty much guarunteed to beat the damage my axe does. But for someone unlucky as I to keep getting blasted to hell in both random and team arena quickly. [I'm never the last one standing, I find that not fair ;_;] I can't afford to lose the hp... To each his/her own.

ICURADik · Aug 19, 2005, 07:17 PM // 19:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yukito Kunisaki

Actually, when an enemy runs, your crit rate is 100%. So yeah, your 16 axe rating is pretty much guarunteed to beat the damage my axe does. But for someone unlucky as I to keep getting blasted to hell in both random and team arena quickly. [I'm never the last one standing, I find that not fair ;_;] I can't afford to lose the hp... To each his/her own.

When enemies run they usually stutter step, due to casting spells, lag, etc. I find I don't crit continuously, but 50+% is definitely accurate.