Curse

Shen Xi · Dec 03, 2005, 04:57 PM // 16:57

right... and teams that don't use conditions the monks are comletely screwed... great idea. signet of devotion is too slow for any normal healing for starters...

as for the rest of your posts, have fun being so 1337 and unique :rollseyes: you do sound like a snob, and no overly surprisingly you're guildless.. then again it does sound like you are doing people a favour

entropy · Dec 03, 2005, 04:58 PM // 16:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vermilion Okeanos

Haha, now I see a better reason for this topic. A good laugh. The moment I saw there was yet another new reply, I was interested to hopfully see an interesting reply. Then I saw it and tried to read it, then I laughed. Why? Because I am asking myself why do I even bother? It is laughable.

Anyway, I will just ignore any post that is not related to skill/build. Anyone try to post anymore like those above, you are really an idiot. I hope I won't see people trying to come in to show others that he/she is an idiot (why are you posting those kind of crap when I already wrote that I will ignore it? Idiotic indeed). If you don't want that tag, post something interesting.

Tell me something I don't know.

You just responded to it OMG n00bed.
In the middle of halls do you think people are going to be able to go and look around for the spirit? It has its uses and its not totally nerfed. It just requires more skill to use. Melandru's resilience has been tried and tested it doesn't work. Yes you get more energy but are you really just going to let tons of hexes and conditions sit on you? REally? Hiding the spirit isn't that hard to do on some tombs maps. Not every skill can be used everywhere. It has specific uses but that doesn't mean its nerfed.

Vermilion Okeanos · Dec 03, 2005, 05:56 PM // 17:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shen Xi

right... and teams that don't use conditions the monks are comletely screwed... great idea. signet of devotion is too slow for any normal healing for starters...

as for the rest of your posts, have fun being so 1337 and unique :rollseyes: you do sound like a snob, and no overly surprisingly you're guildless.. then again it does sound like you are doing people a favour

If u put things together, you will know that QZ and Serpent quickness both can increase recharge of devotion. Also, since when do I say signet of devotion is the only thing I use? I still have 4 other slots considering rez sig is a standard. Having able to save energy for most of the time is devotion, and using more faster heal when in urgent... This is where playing skills as a monk play off, I defintely don't recommend newbie using it. There are only few hex out there that can stop signet, and we know what those are. The only time it might be harsh is when it is either an interrupt ranger or an interrupt warrior 24/7 babysitting you, but then everyone has that problem. Some may argue that having 5 hex on you is very bad. However, with Melandru's resilence, sometimes yes, sometimes no... that completely depend on the situation. I would defintely not run into a fight completely without hex removal, that would just too unbalanced.

That build however, was ignored and ceased to develope further. Then I moved onto other build soon after (I can't stay focus with the same build for more than a week, that means each week I do get to play, it is a completely new build... or else the game is boring). Now that my mind came back to it, I might work on it a bit more. Then perhaps not, cause I don't play GW all that often anymore (running out of ideas for it).

You didn't even try to explore the idea. And the time a monk that is not stacked with hex and condition, that game is already won.

I have appreciation, and also furstration, it deeply annoy me when I had to hand fish to people when the fish is right under their nose. I would really appreciate it if people explore more deeply into things, I would also apreciate for trying, but neither of those two condition are even close to being met.

The reason I left my guild was due to that none of my ideas was even taken a least respect, I would post 8+ builds, and contribute modification, yet I am still viewed as a lowly just a slave member while also being ignored in guild chat. Who wouldn't one leave? You would have to be some kind of budha or idiot to stay. I wasn't even annoying, nor was I that talkative, and I also answer just about every question and help any guild member in need. They didn't complain about my existance yet I do not exist or so it seems. They were way too focused with voice chat to give anyone who is typing a chance, ridiculous reason. So wth, it is past.

And I find many guild's recruiting method to be completely bad and wrong. They would first view you as an individual and pay respect to you as one, then the moment you just the guild, BAM! You just realize you are trash, they are just getting some numbers.

Now you see, how hard is it to get people to look outside the box? Nearly impossible? I might agree with that.

Dmitri3 · Dec 03, 2005, 08:48 PM // 20:48

Let's think of it as using the skills that can seem pretty useless at the first look, but turn out to be effective when you see it work.

Somewhat I was fan of signet of devotion one day... and I used it every time I could, I also kept some ideas on how you can work it out in 8-player or 4-player build. But since I don't have GWFreaks installed on this comp... I will post the build a bit later.
Offensive and defensive as well.

Former Ruling · Dec 03, 2005, 10:41 PM // 22:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vermilion Okeanos

I can see why you don't get it, obviously you can not appreciate thinking outside the box. Yes, I constantly try things that shouldn't have fit together, and that is the point of this topic. If no one ever try to fit different things togethher, no new build is going to be discover.

Now if you are not going to post something more interesting than saying "this skill can only do this" or "I don't see your logic" then don't post anymore. I won't even bother replying to you after this, unless it is something related to the topic.

I get what you are trying to say with this thread - But I have trouble understanding your flawed logic behind what you are saying.

Starting with the quotes I pickedd out in just 2 minutes of looking through thread:

Quote:

this skill practically has only one purpose now. The disruption of opponent team at a great cost of you

Quote:

This is a good skill to waste 25 energy

But when it is expressed to you that QZ is used in atleast 2 situations not described in your original post, and a flaw in your post is shown to you, your rebuttal is to say that they are not "thinking outside the box" - The cheapest copout ever, and you know it.

Next ones:

Quote:

not like they can't interrupt you or if you do succeed in getting it out; 2 sec is all they need to kill it.

Quote:

while it does not require a very specific build to stop it.

These two go together also because in each you justify your statement by generalizing QZ with "spirits" in general. Is it not true that all spirits can be taken out easily, or interupted while casting because of long cast times if the caster does not think of his situation?

Spirits have been used for as long as they have been out and effectively too. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the caster will have to access the situation and palce it where and when it is most appropriate. Maybe you should think of this before telling others to "think outside the box", and maybe you should stick to talking about QZ when it is QZ the topic is about.

Then the confusion starts:
Your post starting with "Some people here". By combining your main thesis that QZ is nearly impossible to use, with the ideals you set out in this post - It was clear that I had to post what I did in mockery.

I use my sarcasm to levy on you the challenge of making a build in which you use Awaken the Blood effectively when not using any Blood or Curse skills. Which is a ludicrous idea given that Awaken the Blood is designed specifically for use of Blood or Curse skills and using it elsewere would be in effect - wasting a skill slot.

To my great surprise and laugher, you reply with:

Quote:

Yes, I constantly try things that shouldn't have fit together, and that is the point of this topic.

Which cuased laugher because of the examples set forth before it. I find it funny how you would try to use something like Awaken the Blood without the use of any blood or curse skills, and then condemn someone else for conforming to society because they do use it for its designed propose.

Then a person brings your argument yet again into question, to which you reply again with another useless attempt to try to dig yourself out of the 60 foot depth ditch you've crawled in.

Quote:

I hope I won't see people trying to come in to show others that he/she is an idiot

ohhh...nooo...I shouldn't call out your completely flawed logic and useless bantar at the risk that I might get ignored or called an idiot by the very person that we are making fun of.

4th grade attempts at "don't make fun of me or you are a big stupidhead" no longer works i'm afraid.

After this I guess you finally decide you should post something relevant so you don't risk being completely ignored in your attempt to act superior to everyone.

After this you dropped your attempt to seem "uber" - and actually started decent build talk.

-----------------------------Main Post Part-----------------------------

Maybe the lesson learned here today is to just try out your "new - outside the box" ideas and discuss them, and drop your dry attempts at making yourself seem better than everyone else, and maybe also drop your rash generalizations and comebacks..

I am not attacking you trying to combo QZ differently - I'm attacking your way of going about it. First you generalize QZ and say its worthless, giving no more than 1-2 real reasons for this type of remark completely not talking about its main roles, reasons that were quickly shot down. Then you come back and act like your Lord here and everyone should worship you because you think not running what others are running makes you superior because you aren't "copying".

Well simple fact is, maybe everyone else LIKES using Awaken the Blood when actually using blood and curse skills..and maybe they LIKE offsetting QZ's cost with expertise, and maybe they LIKE using skills in combinations that are proven to work, and are close to what the skill was desgined for.

You know why? Because they work..and its fun..this game is a GAME we must remember.

Maybe instead of calling these people "idiots" and acting like you are so much better - you might try showing them some different uses or discussing different plans..if they don't want to hear it - leave them to their thoughts.

For the most part I think you are actually getting closer to realizing people dont want to be called idiots, and started actually posting relevant things they can discuss. Thats a start.

Shen Xi · Dec 03, 2005, 10:47 PM // 22:47

with the sort fo attitude you are showing here i am not overly surpised by your guild's reactions. that and thy seem a tad crackpot really.

so yur only form of energy management with that idea other than sig od devotion is nothing if you have no conditions? i.e. even normal monks would operate better than you do.

also in tombs a rez sig on a monk is decidedly NOT a standard, lol.

and if you knew anything, it's the cast time and not the recharge time on sig of devotion which makes it substandard.

as for the not being annoyig pat and people not saying anything about that to you... i only know you from this thread and your condescendingly superior attitude annoys me, let alone being in the same guild as you...

Dmitri3 · Dec 04, 2005, 05:15 AM // 05:15

Definitely not for holding halls... lol. Mostly oriented for GvG, still lacking something...

Quote:

Player 1

Ranger/Warrior
Level: 20

Expertise: 13 (12+1)
Beast Mastery: 16 (12+4)
Swordsmanship: 12

Ferocious Strike [Elite] (Beast Mastery)
Predator's Pounce (Beast Mastery)
Disrupting Lunge (Beast Mastery)
Whirling Defense (Expertise)
Otyugh's Cry (Beast Mastery)
Fertile Season (Beast Mastery)
Charm Animal (Beast Mastery)
Resurrection Signet ()
Player 2

Ranger/Warrior
Level: 20

Expertise: 13 (12+1)
Beast Mastery: 16 (12+4)
Swordsmanship: 12

Ferocious Strike [Elite] (Beast Mastery)
Predator's Pounce (Beast Mastery)
Disrupting Lunge (Beast Mastery)
Whirling Defense (Expertise)
Call of Haste (Beast Mastery)
Revive Animal (Beast Mastery)
Charm Animal (Beast Mastery)
Resurrection Signet ()
Player 3

Ranger/Warrior
Level: 20

Expertise: 16 (12+4)
Wilderness Survival: 13 (12+1)

Spike Trap [Elite] (Wilderness Survival)
Barbed Trap (Wilderness Survival)
Flame Trap (Wilderness Survival)
Dust Trap (Wilderness Survival)
Lightning Reflexes (Expertise)
Whirling Defense (Expertise)
Quickening Zephyr (Wilderness Survival)
Wild Blow (Warrior other)
Player 4

Monk/Necromancer
Level: 20

Reversal of Fortune (Protection Prayers)
Mend Ailment (Protection Prayers)
Draw Conditions (Protection Prayers)
Protective Spirit (Protection Prayers)
Divine Spirit (Divine Favor)
Glyph of Renewal [Elite] (Elementalist other)
Smite Hex (Smiting Prayers)
Divine Boon (Divine Favor)
Player 5

Ranger/Warrior
Level: 20

Expertise: 13 (12+1)
Beast Mastery: 16 (12+4)

Ferocious Strike [Elite] (Beast Mastery)
Predator's Pounce (Beast Mastery)
Disrupting Lunge (Beast Mastery)
Whirling Defense (Expertise)
Call of Protection (Beast Mastery)
Predatory Season (Beast Mastery)
Charm Animal (Beast Mastery)
Resurrection Signet ()
Player 6

Ranger/Warrior
Level: 20

Expertise: 13 (12+1)
Beast Mastery: 16 (12+4)

Ferocious Strike [Elite] (Beast Mastery)
Predator's Pounce (Beast Mastery)
Disrupting Lunge (Beast Mastery)
Whirling Defense (Expertise)
Call of Haste (Beast Mastery)
Revive Animal (Beast Mastery)
Charm Animal (Beast Mastery)
Resurrection Signet ()
Player 7

Ranger/Warrior
Level: 20

Expertise: 16 (12+4)
Wilderness Survival: 13 (12+1)

Spike Trap [Elite] (Wilderness Survival)
Barbed Trap (Wilderness Survival)
Flame Trap (Wilderness Survival)
Dust Trap (Wilderness Survival)
Lightning Reflexes (Expertise)
Whirling Defense (Expertise)
Quickening Zephyr (Wilderness Survival)
Wild Blow (Warrior other)
Player 8

Monk/Elementalist
Level: 20

Divine Favor: 12
Protection Prayers: 12

Reversal of Fortune (Protection Prayers)
Mend Ailment (Protection Prayers)
Draw Conditions (Protection Prayers)
Protective Spirit (Protection Prayers)
Divine Spirit (Divine Favor)
Glyph of Renewal [Elite] (Elementalist other)
Smite Hex (Smiting Prayers)
Divine Boon (Divine Favor)

Vermilion Okeanos · Dec 04, 2005, 09:15 AM // 09:15

Hmm, that build is not a very obvious "push the button and win" that kind of thing (then again, that applied to most build out there).

I can't say how well it will turn out in GvG, as pet are kind of hard to control.

There is one mistake I think... like Mo/N having glyph of renewal?

The thing I can see is that if the battle is fought on the top 50 of the ladder, it either be destroy quite quickly, or last a long time.

one of out five
Spike damage **
Interruption ****
Steady damage ***
So the strength is in interruption, therefore you probably want to babysit your opponent target.

However, knowing how high end people always have very high mobility. It might be difficult for pet to be effective (thx to pet AI). I personally like beast matery class, I just cry over the AI still, especially when it chase something that is running.

There are time it is possible for one of their monk that is targeted purposely bring the pet really far away from the group on the opposite end, then they will be in control of your movement as you need to stay together to be more effective; or you can forget your pet, but you just lost half of your build. Pet don't get DP, so letting them die and survive until they revive would be ideal. If the situation does given that the pet get too far. (not sure if the change any more pet AI, the last time I use they still can get really far... about the size of 3/4 radar).

Beast mastery had long since been tough to play on high end due to the incapability to control them. Yet, they are only as good as a nromal weapon in terms of normal damage (while you can control weapon perfectly).

The QZ + disrupting lunge would be really annoying, I see it as the best hope. If you can spam it until it lock like 3 skills, well... if your opponent is smart, they will retreat for awhile.

Hmm, actually... it is not good at all to talk about it here. Since I only said about negative things that can happen, and thats not exactly what you want people to know.

This build would defintely bring surprises to the opponent team, and if QZ + disrupting lunge work. Your steady damage should be able to make good work of them.

I think most of the build is great, and got important skills. I really worried about the pet chasing however. (pet would sometimes have trouble hitting even someone with cripple on, it is quite ridiculous)

I wouldn't spend too much energy keeping pet alive. I see revive animal being good only when you killed most of them, and want to get your pet together before the timely rezz.

Edit: Oh yea, if you can get brutal strike in there... thats potentially good spike for finish off. Then this build would have all kind of damage at your disposal. Melandru's assault is also interesting to think about.