Curse

mortalis doleo · Oct 29, 2005, 06:53 AM // 06:53

these two elites work well with the protection monk, and are mant to get rid of conditions.
im trying to find out which one is better, here's what i got so far:

martyr (+mend ailement):
low cost
10 sec recharge
gets rid of all the conditions of all the party
great self-heal
takes two skill slots

restore conditions:
can't be cast on self
1 skill slot
low cost
spammable
gets rid of single person's conditions
great heal for others

so far i like martyr better... it gets rid of desease pretty well, unlike restore conditions.

but i might be wrong, what do you think?

Rico Carridan · Oct 29, 2005, 07:43 AM // 07:43

Well, IMHO, the problem with restore conditions is that it is extremely unlikely any individual person will have more than 2-3 conditions on them at any given time, and while having 2-3 conditions is pretty debilitating, you can clear them just as well with mend ailment as restore conditions, if the need arises (although frankly, most monks that I run into these days completely ignore conditions, but that's a different story). However, it is likely that at any given time (especially in PvP) you could have several party members all inflicted with 1-2 conditions, which can all be ridded with martyr.

Now, using martyr does transfer those conditions to self, which can be quite debilitating *unless* you're playing as Mo/N or N/Mo, then you have all kinds of interesting ways to deal with your conditions (aside from spamming mend/purge conditions on self). If only you could get martyr and Plague Signet on the same person... that would be something to fear.

Rico

Racthoh · Oct 29, 2005, 09:09 AM // 09:09

Prehaps in 4v4, Restore Condition is probably better. In 8v8 though, the ability for one spell to strip all of the ailments from 7 other allies is just too good to pass up.

coldslammer · Oct 29, 2005, 11:07 AM // 11:07

this is what you do:

one monk runs martyr
the next monk runs melandrus resilliance and draw conditions

what happens is the martyr monk runs his spell, and the other monk draws the conditions from the martyr monk, which feeds the melandrus resilliance monk.

entropy · Oct 29, 2005, 02:16 PM // 14:16

The problem with melandru's resilience is that it basically require conditions/hexes making the monk really weak. 10 regen won't save the monk from a spike and with deep wounds on him/her it'll be simple for the opposing team to kill him. Sure you get a nice energy regen but you can't really use it effectively IMO.

Aldarond · Oct 29, 2005, 02:36 PM // 14:36

One Monk takes Martyr, the second one - Restore Conditions. Isn't it the simpliest solution to get rid of a bunch of conditions?

mortalis doleo · Oct 29, 2005, 07:44 PM // 19:44

but that's using two characters (monks, even), for a relatively small problem...

Schorny · Oct 29, 2005, 08:02 PM // 20:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rico Carridan

Well, IMHO, the problem with restore conditions is that it is extremely unlikely any individual person will have more than 2-3 conditions on them at any given time

Trapper teams

blind, burn, cripple, bleeding and often poison and sometimes deseas.

and now, most teams have atleast one trapper...

OTOH with martyr you can disable vim healers much easier...

Mercury Angel · Oct 29, 2005, 08:37 PM // 20:37

There's almost no reason not to have martyr in your party, particularly because it takes no attribute points to be 100% effective.
Generally, you want your monks to have some form of elite energy management, and Martyr to be relegated to a party member with monk secondary who can get by without an elite energy management, such as a me/mo with extra inspiration skills.

Amity · Nov 18, 2005, 09:06 AM // 09:06

I use martyr alot in random arena, mainly becuase having blind on me does nothing and its like heal party (you dont need them to be in the agro range). And it helps with the rangers with apply poison+tab+spacbar+tab+spacbar, it works well if you have another (good & not smiting) monk on your team.

But please, and i say this again, PLEASE if your a monk and you have wars beating the crap out of you and you see a condition on an ally "please dont use it" deep wond is a biatch when you have 3 other conditions covering it from mend ailment, unless you arent on my team

.

mortalis doleo · Nov 18, 2005, 11:51 AM // 11:51

actually... if im being attacked and i see a lot of conditions in the party (note, im a prot), i immediately go martyr-mend ailement. even with deep wound, you get healed for so much and you can get the deep wound in the next few mends...

this should only be used by someone who knows what tey are doing, though. and only in situations where the enemy team has trappers - a lot of ***different*** conditions.

Amity · Nov 18, 2005, 09:02 PM // 21:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by mortalis doleo

actually... if im being attacked and i see a lot of conditions in the party (note, im a prot), i immediately go martyr-mend ailement. even with deep wound, you get healed for so much and you can get the deep wound in the next few mends...

this should only be used by someone who knows what tey are doing, though. and only in situations where the enemy team has trappers - a lot of ***different*** conditions.

true. but i was meaning the healing monks who have 3 prot att. Having so many conditions wouldnt help.

notwist · Nov 18, 2005, 10:00 PM // 22:00

I would rather carry Martyr + Mend Ailment over Restore Conditions. If you are only carrying Restore, and there is a Mesmer spamming Signet of Humility, it would put you in a bad position since condition removal for your team is now screwed. With Martyr + Mend, you can still mend your teammates even if Martyr is "blacked out". Of course you can bring Restore Conditions + Mend Ailment but that's just a little too redundant for my tastes.

Ristaron · Nov 19, 2005, 01:56 AM // 01:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by mortalis doleo

actually... if im being attacked and i see a lot of conditions in the party (note, im a prot), i immediately go martyr-mend ailement. even with deep wound, you get healed for so much and you can get the deep wound in the next few mends...

this should only be used by someone who knows what tey are doing, though. and only in situations where the enemy team has trappers - a lot of ***different*** conditions.

In other words: don't try this at home, kids.

Tap Tap · Nov 19, 2005, 02:45 AM // 02:45

I think what you face in the metagame on that current day should dictate what elite you bring.

I run as a protection monk frequently in the Tombs, and I jockey back and forth between the two. As a rule of thumb, I'll start off with Restore Conditions until we run into a team that utilizes a mass condition stragety (such as multiple trappers). Then I can always switch to Martyr.

Both elites are just that, elite. Restore Conditions is an awesome healer when utilized properly, but Martyr can save a team by proactive defense (pulling off conditions immediately), and also prevent a Disease Outbreak from happening.

/twocents

tafy69 · Nov 19, 2005, 07:17 AM // 07:17

The way I look at it is:

If you got tainted necro then take restore, unless u face lots trap teams (but they usually lock out ur elite

If your team is mostly casters id take restore again
If you got 2+ warriors and no tainted then i would take martyr

¿Evan¿ · Nov 21, 2005, 04:41 AM // 04:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by coldslammer

this is what you do:

one monk runs martyr
the next monk runs melandrus resilliance and draw conditions

what happens is the martyr monk runs his spell, and the other monk draws the conditions from the martyr monk, which feeds the melandrus resilliance monk.

What if the other team has no conditions? It leaves the mo/r pretty useless