Curse

Lestat Requiem · Jun 12, 2005, 12:21 AM // 00:21

Hello i seen today a axe warrior hitting me for about 100-150 damage per skill at the speed of a sword (gg battle rage), and then im a warrior with a platemal 85 armor +10 physical -.- somethimes i doubt about using hammers ....

Hammer skills dont have a good +dmg bonus on skill ... it need to be the contrary cause hammer attacks slower :X

iDissapear · Jun 12, 2005, 12:44 AM // 00:44

Ok, well ya hammers suck brutally. They are cool for the specific use of knock down but they really can't compare to sword or axe. Wether (sp) PvP or PvE I recommend you make the change to axe or sword. Additionally you mentioned axe swinging at the speed of sword. This would be because they both have the exact same attack speed. As for the 100-150 damage though I can't be sure. One possibility is that he is combining judges insight (holy armor ignoring damage) and maybe some other buffs with a powerful axe attack, maybe that 4 adrenal elite. Now as to wether (sp again) swords are better than axes or vice versa it is really a preferance issue. My warrior has switched back and forth a good 5 times. I'm settling on axe though because the you can cause deep wound without needing to bleed (which in PvE some monsters are immune to) and because the area attack move cyclone axe is far, far superior to 100 blades. See my post on hundred blades for details. http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...73&postcount=8
Axe is definately not over powered, imho it is slightly better than sword but thousands can debate that. Whatever he was using to deal such massive damage was completely independant to his weapon. But hammers are completely underpowered and until/unless this changes I would recommend dropping it for an axe or sword and shield.
Hope that helps.

PS> Can anyone explain what the point of the -20% defence on judges insight as it converts the damage to holy which ignores defence?

Lestat Requiem · Jun 12, 2005, 12:55 AM // 00:55

I think judge is only 20% - 100% would be way too powerfull (300 per hit lolz)
And i were sword warrior before with battle rage and co, i only tryed axe a very short time when i were lv 15 , but aswell with hammer im happy to manage to kill a lone monk wiout he can make anything trough, i just think now axe could be countered by a monk thats heal pretty well, but when the axe guy pwned me i wasnt using my 50% evade ward :X maybe my big mistake ...

Howling Wind · Jun 12, 2005, 01:01 AM // 01:01

Thats quite high dmg, were u using frenzy when he was attacking you? He could have used judges insight + penetrating attack or evisecrate but that is quite high dmg to recieve, a critical hit.

Lestat Requiem · Jun 12, 2005, 01:06 AM // 01:06

No i wernt using frenzy , if i good remember the guy was W/necro , he putted me weakens armor and maybe the monk of his group puted on him judge insight, then he made me penetrating hit for about 120 and evicerate for 100

Keure · Jun 12, 2005, 01:45 AM // 01:45

...

Ya know, given the buffing/debuffing I'll be willing to bet that you'd be hit about as hard with a sword. Look at the skills, do the math, and know that the axe isn't really at fault here.

As was said previously hammers really aren't very good.

MasterKaChun · Jun 12, 2005, 03:10 AM // 03:10

Should i have cleave for my axe warrior or would battle rage be better for overall damage. Sorry if this question leaves out so many variables. a general idea of what I would get with each will do. Thanks alot you pros.

BigTru · Jun 12, 2005, 03:13 AM // 03:13

Can someone specify why hammers aren't good? It seems pointless for me to use a sword...

It certainly isn't for damage - Even with hammers slowerer attack speed, it ends up doing more. Plus, you don't bring a Warrior along just for damage...

The shield doesn't help much either. Warriors are usually the last ones to be attacked. Also, if you think about it, the damage differance isn't that big. If the enemy is knocked down, they are also doing less damage to you. By knocking them down, you can change their damage output, regardless of rather or not they are attacking you.

I don't know... I'm using a sword... I have 13 in swordsmanship, 12 in stregnth. It just seems like I'm just an extra body added their to take up space.

Aranador · Jun 12, 2005, 03:56 AM // 03:56

They may have also attacked you from behind - shiled AC is apparently not used if you are attacked from behind.

Anyway - when I get a crit hit with my axe, while using a special, I can break 100 damage - and thats at lvl 15.

Also - judges insight converts your damage to holy, sure, but it is only the holy damage smites thast say they ignore armour, that ignore armour. JI ignores 20% of armour (like it says) and also converts your damage type to holy, which ignores + to physical armour and + to elemental armour, but doesnt ignore + to untyped armour. Which is still great

Hooshang · Jun 12, 2005, 08:05 AM // 08:05

and just so you know, weaken armor only works with physical damage so he could not have stacked it with judges insight.

Deathlord · Jun 12, 2005, 07:43 PM // 19:43

If it was 150 each, then you either have bad armor, were running away, or were using some kind of self-weakening. It is not uncommon to see an axe (I'm an axey 100%) pummel somebody down. They can easily spam cleave and penetrating blow every other attack. Eviscrete and executioners axe might have to take a few hits to build up adreniline but can deal even more (Not as effecient as penetrate and cleave, but still good). I've tried battle range and i don't like it much, it takes up an elite and it doesn't increase attacking speed, it's more of one of those "Anti-Runner" kind of things.

Hammers are okay in their own way, but if you try to compare them up to a axe, then you're in for some trouble. The lowest requiring damage + adrenal skill is 6, with the attacking speed, that's going to take a while to build. 50% of the adrenal skills also make you lose ALL adreniline when you use it, crippling your effect to combo alot of things. I've used hammer in E3 and WPE, used sword from lvl 1 - 15, axe from 16 - 20. I'd still have to say axe is best for PVP, and the best for PVE in MOST situations. (Sword + Tactics can prove useful for tanking occasionally... mainly stance purposes)

iDissapear · Jun 12, 2005, 08:50 PM // 20:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deathlord

They can easily spam cleave and penetrating blow every other attack.

I agree with what you say except this. When you use an adrenal skill you lose 1 hit of adrenaline from all your adrenal skills. You notice this when you use one adrenal skill then try to use another one right after. You have to wait till your next hit to recover that lost hit.

BigTru · Jun 12, 2005, 08:50 PM // 20:50

Battle Rage takes care of the Adrenaline problem, even without it I find I really only need 6 adrenaline to do my key skills, and that doesn't take long. The only useful sword skills I find are sever artery, final strike (or whatever it's called), and savage slash.

I'd say hammer is best for PvP, atleast you have purpose when using it. Damage with axe and sword is nothing to brag about, neither is hammer in the ned, but knocking things down seems to give a role.

I tried Hammer with a PvP only character, but after seeing how well it performed, I'm definitaly switching to hammer with my RP character.

If you can't find a good skill combo for Hammer, that seems like it's more of your problem then the hammers...

Hokutan · Jun 12, 2005, 08:58 PM // 20:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigTru

Can someone specify why hammers aren't good? It seems pointless for me to use a sword...

It certainly isn't for damage - Even with hammers slowerer attack speed, it ends up doing more. Plus, you don't bring a Warrior along just for damage...

The shield doesn't help much either. Warriors are usually the last ones to be attacked. Also, if you think about it, the damage differance isn't that big. If the enemy is knocked down, they are also doing less damage to you. By knocking them down, you can change their damage output, regardless of rather or not they are attacking you.

I don't know... I'm using a sword... I have 13 in swordsmanship, 12 in stregnth. It just seems like I'm just an extra body added their to take up space.

I was looking at some of the skills availiable later in the game.From reading a few of thier discriptions i started to see what makes the sword pretty cool is not only does it pump out some nice damage,and health drain conditions (Bleeding) ,or a nice condition (Crippling) ,but it gives you access to a couple defensive abilities that actually require you to have a sword. these are the ripostes ,they give you chances to block AND deal damage .Looks like thier are two of them, ones an Elite.
So while the Sword wont usually out dmage an axe,it does give you some more defensive options in return =)

Hooshang · Jun 12, 2005, 09:18 PM // 21:18

but for pvp, defense isnt that good when no ones targetting you.

Howling Wind · Jun 12, 2005, 10:42 PM // 22:42

I'd say in terms of damage sword and axe are the best. The only reason i'd go for axe is for cleave and evisecrate because cleave is so highly spamable and evisecrate is a cleave + dismember in one. I have a w/mo, a sword user, mainly because the highly effective early on sever artery + gash (later on it not all that since many mosnters won't bleed) but the main reason for me to use it because of Final Thrust and Savage Slash, especially final thrust, the dmg factor is extremely high and is a non-elite, also if your a tactics user then I highly recommend deadly riposte.

I wouldn't say axe is powerful than sword or vice versa but few people have tested that with swords the dmg is higher than axe when used with skills and has a consisten high average damage. Axe is not much consistent, damage is too widespread but axe has good skills to cause deep wound with-out the need for bleeding and an area of attack cyclone axe skills which isn't an elite.

Hammers are good for PvP, especially knocking them down but their not really a weapon for damage. I'd pick hammer for backbreaker elite, very nice to see your opponent on the ground, knocked for 5 seconds, easy bait for an elementalist or for you to hack away. Plus hammers blunt damage is good against non-flesh monsters in PvE

Gerbill · Jun 13, 2005, 12:25 AM // 00:25

I prefer axe, like the attack speed and skills.
I used to have a sword though what I noticed I had a 15-22 dmg sword.
with some bonusses, no dmg bonusses.
and when I switched to axe I had an 6-21 dmg axe.
also with some bonusses but no dmg bonusses.

with the sword I averagly pumped out 20 damage.
with the axe I averagly pump out 18-20 damage, it just seems higher, because sometimes you hit for like 26 (or higher/lower depending on armor etc.. had like 60 occasionaly) and sometimes you only hit for 9.
Axe and sword are averagly the same, I like axe better because of the Area skills, and dismember and disrupting

BigTru · Jun 13, 2005, 06:20 AM // 06:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hokutan

I was looking at some of the skills availiable later in the game.From reading a few of thier discriptions i started to see what makes the sword pretty cool is not only does it pump out some nice damage,and health drain conditions (Bleeding) ,or a nice condition (Crippling) ,but it gives you access to a couple defensive abilities that actually require you to have a sword. these are the ripostes ,they give you chances to block AND deal damage .Looks like thier are two of them, ones an Elite.
So while the Sword wont usually out dmage an axe,it does give you some more defensive options in return =)

Riposte / Deadly Riposte isn't that impressive. They only block one hit and other classes can inflict bleeding too. If one character has a skill to bleed an oponent, there really isn't much need for more.

Eskimo Bob · Jun 13, 2005, 07:19 AM // 07:19

I am a axe warrior and I can dish out the hurt fairly well in pvp. Except a I can't solo a monk, they just heal to fast. That is where hammers come in, with all those knockdown skills you can take out a monk on your own.

funkenstein · Jun 13, 2005, 08:09 AM // 08:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eskimo Bob

I am a axe warrior and I can dish out the hurt fairly well in pvp. Except a I can't solo a monk, they just heal to fast. That is where hammers come in, with all those knockdown skills you can take out a monk on your own.

Wouldn't that be were the disrupting axe hit would come into play?