Curse

Nighthavvk · May 09, 2005, 02:20 PM // 14:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by dorn

Last I checked mesmers don't get daze right? Daze is 3x casting time and you get interupted if you take damage from what I understood. Quite powerful yet quite situational to me because it's damn hard to catch a monk casting a long enough spell to land a concussive shot or skull crack.

it's difficult, but not insanely hard, to get a concussion shot in while using arcane conundrum

goku19123 · May 09, 2005, 02:20 PM // 14:20

I like using Skull Crack to daze opponents, then use skills like Berserker's Stane and Flurry to increase my attack speed...and Daze = twice** as long to cast spells, and any dmg taken will interrupt the casting.

Twilight Doll · May 09, 2005, 04:21 PM // 16:21

I don't think there is a single skill in the game that is overpowered. Every skill I believe has a counter, you just have to be the right job and have the counter-skill.

neoflame · May 09, 2005, 10:16 PM // 22:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Typhoon

The counter to spammable spells is both interrupt AND daze effect. Unfortunately the ONLY good daze affect belongs to the mesmer. Concussive shot blows.

Or Backfire. Or Diversion. Or Arcane Conundrum. Or Distracting Shot/Blow. Or any energy-draining skill. Or Skull Crack (which, incidentally, is an elite Warrior skill, and the only skill IIRC that causes Daze other than Concussion Shot. And Concussion Shot doesn't blow in the hands of a good primary Ranger.)

Typhoon · May 10, 2005, 06:43 AM // 06:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by neoflame

Or Backfire. Or Diversion. Or Arcane Conundrum. Or Distracting Shot/Blow. Or any energy-draining skill. Or Skull Crack (which, incidentally, is an elite Warrior skill, and the only skill IIRC that causes Daze other than Concussion Shot. And Concussion Shot doesn't blow in the hands of a good primary Ranger.)

.. what is your point? I said the only good daze effect belongs to mesmers. Are you trying to argue that? I don't get it.

I am a primary ranger. And I am telling you, directly from experience, that using concussive shot to interrupt near instacast spells so they are not near instacast, is a waste of 25 mana and spell slot compared to something MUCH more reliable, like mesmer skills. If someone is exclusively spamming Orison of healing and other fast cast spells, how are you going to proc concussive shot in the first place? You might as well use distracting shot, at least you don't blow 25 mana when you miss.

It's like saying glyph of energy won't work unless you cast the spell first, then cast glyph of energy, then cast the spell again. How does daze help you interrupt fast cast spells if you have to use a 25 mana shot to try and interrupt a fast cast spell without any daze, in order to proc it. It's useless.

Keure · May 10, 2005, 11:57 AM // 11:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Typhoon

.. what is your point? I said the only good daze effect belongs to mesmers. Are you trying to argue that? I don't get it.

I am a primary ranger. And I am telling you, directly from experience, that using concussive shot to interrupt near instacast spells so they are not near instacast, is a waste of 25 mana and spell slot compared to something MUCH more reliable, like mesmer skills. If someone is exclusively spamming Orison of healing and other fast cast spells, how are you going to proc concussive shot in the first place? You might as well use distracting shot, at least you don't blow 25 mana when you miss.

It's like saying glyph of energy won't work unless you cast the spell first, then cast glyph of energy, then cast the spell again. How does daze help you interrupt fast cast spells if you have to use a 25 mana shot to try and interrupt a fast cast spell without any daze, in order to proc it. It's useless.

I think the problem was that you made a fairly broad statement here:

Quote:

Healing Breeze is fine, it's Osiron of healing that is the problem. For a nearly instacast, spammable 5 energy heal spell that is near impossible to interrupt, every monk that comes under attack will ***** that skill to no end.

The counter to spammable spells is both interrupt AND daze effect. Unfortunately the ONLY good daze affect belongs to the mesmer. Concussive shot blows.

This is (easily) interpreted to mean that interrupt and daze are the *only* ways of countering spammable spells like that. Neoflame brought up examples of non-daze, non-interrupt ways of messing with spammed healing.

Elurian · May 10, 2005, 01:16 PM // 13:16

^ Hes exactly right if you backfire a spamming healer you can quickly eat thier health and effectively take them out of action until it wears off or gets a remove hex. Breeze is in no way overpowered if you've ever played a monk in PvP you know that 10 energy cost is a ton when in the thick of battle and I'd rather throw out a remove hex or a mend ailment instead of just putting a "temporary fix" on to stop the degen. Now that I've gotten word healing I don't even use breeze to heal someone after a rez I just hit em with word and bam there is 3/4 their hp back. The only time I use breeze anymore is to give our w/mo a +10 regen going into battle (mending + breeze = good)

Cymmina · May 10, 2005, 04:43 PM // 16:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by d4nowar

i think shield of regeneration is similar. except it is much better. why use healing breeze when you can use SoR?

Shield of Regeneration = Protection Prayers, Healing Breeze = Healing Prayers. About 90% of the monks are healing prayers/divine favor only, so breeze is the logical choice. SoR also has an extra 5 energy cost in exchange for that +40 AR.

SoR is also elite. If you ask me, Word of Healing is a much better elite to take. It is nearly as spammable as Orison but gives extra healing for the same energy cost. Switching back and forth between Orison and Word allows you to heal non-stop until you run out of energy. If you combine breeze with orison+word spamming from a monk with Divine Boon, a target becomes quite difficult to kill.

For what it's worth, as a Me/Mo, I take healing breeze as my *only* healing spell (other than res) in PvP, even though my odds of getting breeze as an Inspired Enchantment are quite high. It's simply that good.

Lewick · May 10, 2005, 05:57 PM // 17:57

Erm, I've found Reversal of Fortune to be very effective when it comes to keeping someone alive. It's a spammable reversal heal. If they get hit, they don't take the damage and it then heals them for N points (based on the protection prayers level - at level 6 I believe it was 45hp and it gets better from there.)

While Healing Breeze is good for partially countering HP dots, it certainly is not overpowered. As a secondary monk, I use a balance of Protection Prayers, Healing Prayers, and Smiting Prayers. I use Balthazar's Aura a lot in PvE, and have either a human necro or the Cultist henchman feed me energy after I use it. This tends to shred annoying mobs that like to swarm.

I probably wouldn't use Balthazar's in PvP though, but I'm not very experienced with PvP. I'm still enjoying the PvE portion of the game.

Lewick · May 10, 2005, 06:02 PM // 18:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cymmina

Shield of Regeneration = Protection Prayers, Healing Breeze = Healing Prayers. About 90% of the monks are healing prayers/divine favor only, so breeze is the logical choice. SoR also has an extra 5 energy cost in exchange for that +40 AR.

SoR is also elite. If you ask me, Word of Healing is a much better elite to take. It is nearly as spammable as Orison but gives extra healing for the same energy cost. Switching back and forth between Orison and Word allows you to heal non-stop until you run out of energy. If you combine breeze with orison+word spamming from a monk with Divine Boon, a target becomes quite difficult to kill.

For what it's worth, as a Me/Mo, I take healing breeze as my *only* healing spell (other than res) in PvP, even though my odds of getting breeze as an Inspired Enchantment are quite high. It's simply that good.

As a secondary monk, I'd much rather have shield of regeneration. This allows me to deallocate all of my healing prayers points and allocate those points back into protection prayers and smiting prayers. That way I only have to managed my 2 ranger primary skills and 2 monk secondary skills (I don't use wilderness survival much because I haven't found ANY trap skills yet, and I don't use a pet anymore because in the higher levels the smiting prayers skills were better than the pet skills.)

Granted, everything I've said here is geared toward PvE.

Anariel · May 10, 2005, 09:56 PM // 21:56

Healing breeze is good. But it's 10 energy cost and a regen over time, which doesn't cut it for healing. Often as a monk you must dump large amounts of hp on someone very quickly.

Shatter enchantment sucks, and a mesmer/x + monk/mesmer party can totally shut down an opponent party's healing base. Even if the monk recasts healing breeze, that's 20 energy gone from the monk's limited energy pool AND damages AND delays the healing.

I agree with this post:

Quote:

Breeze is in no way overpowered if you've ever played a monk in PvP you know that 10 energy cost is a ton when in the thick of battle and I'd rather throw out a remove hex or a mend ailment instead of just putting a "temporary fix" on to stop the degen.

IMO healing breeze is a limited situation spell and isn't nearly as powerful as people are making it seem. The one spell that every monk primary must have is orison, everything else is up to debate.

d4nowar · May 10, 2005, 10:09 PM // 22:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cymmina

Shield of Regeneration = Protection Prayers, Healing Breeze = Healing Prayers. About 90% of the monks are healing prayers/divine favor only, so breeze is the logical choice. SoR also has an extra 5 energy cost in exchange for that +40 AR.

SoR is also elite. If you ask me, Word of Healing is a much better elite to take. It is nearly as spammable as Orison but gives extra healing for the same energy cost. Switching back and forth between Orison and Word allows you to heal non-stop until you run out of energy. If you combine breeze with orison+word spamming from a monk with Divine Boon, a target becomes quite difficult to kill.

For what it's worth, as a Me/Mo, I take healing breeze as my *only* healing spell (other than res) in PvP, even though my odds of getting breeze as an Inspired Enchantment are quite high. It's simply that good.

well, i too have a me/mo. but you are right. i was a protection secondary and not healing prayers. it works nicely for pvp and some of the harder pve missions.

Darynael · May 11, 2005, 08:10 AM // 08:10

You can counter Healing Prayers using the mesmer hex spell Backfire. It deals a minimum of 35 damage everytime the foe affected my the hex attemt to cast a spell. The hex last for a minimum of 10 seconds. However, it does not prevent the monk's allies from being healed, but the Monk itself won't last long.
This spell are truly the bane of many a spellcaster.

Hint: Add a Emphaty and your target spellcaster (Monk) won't be able to aid at all without harming itself...

-------------------------------------
Darynael Mistwalker
European Elementalist/Mesmer
-------------------------------------

Omega_2005 · May 11, 2005, 08:40 AM // 08:40

I have found out that E/Mo have a harder time without Healing Magic, so when I am in trouble, I use Healing Breeze (ankh) and then Heal area to recover more health (when no enemies are around or in VERY DIRE situations)

Xellos · May 11, 2005, 09:57 AM // 09:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by dorn

That was my point really. Healing Breeze is part of the problem because it makes getting rid of Shield of Imbalance etc harder.

Someone said that enchant breaking is just too messed up but I honestly think the real problem is there are too many token enchants that you can stack on a target compounded with the fact that you don't know which enchants are there.

On the other side of things you have hexes where your teammate can click control + mouse click and tell you in an instant that he has this horrible hex on him and you can purge it off or spam cast remove hex untill it's gone.

I think allowing you to spam break enchants would be quetionable though because a lot of them are on long recast timers and they'd just suddenly suck.

Then theres the versatility of healing breeze. Someone implied a mesmer can somehow get -8 degen with one spell? The highest I've seen is -5 though. I think mereley that 8 regen in one spell slot is a bit much. Split that up into two slots somehow without having even more enchants be on the same target.

1. As a meatshield enchantment, it's expensive, not that great on a monk primary, and has nothing on reversal of fortune.

2. Rend Enchantment currently is the <3

3. Healing Breeze is currently one of the only monk moves which promotes secondary class healers. We do not want monk primary to be the only defense player a year down the road from now. This game needs to be balanced in gameplay, and diversity.

4. Healing Breeze can't save people.

5. 10 mana, 160 heal over 10 seconds. Opposed to Orisons, 130 heal to 160 heal with 5 mana instantly. Let's not get into Heal Other and Word of Healing.

6. This game has been confirmed that defense > offense, counters > attacks, etc etc. A mesmer is suppose to require 2 spells to equate 1 of the monks spells. The real problem is though, is what counters the monk spells. It should be like rock paper scissors, and right now, whatever counters monk spam chants, doesn't work well. There's a reason that a casual group with spam chants vs a casual group with a more balanced team will result in spam chant winning. Casual players just simply don't have the coordination, and spam chanting is very skill less, not to mention the monks barely have to be scared of casual groups at this point. I doubt there's still much arguement that enchantment removal needs to be buffed up a bit, or at least given more control (like uh, having the option to cancel which enchant? WOAH).

You want to complain about a 10 mana uber effect over time enchantment? Check out Protective Spirit. Now that's godly.

Care Less · May 11, 2005, 10:17 AM // 10:17

here is a tip for all you whiners ..

Go play a monk primary , then start whining

for this "Nerf healing" you want to see id would only be fair to give
monk primarys the warriors AR atleast , with a nerf to healing and no buff to defense / damage , the monk will be replaced with w/mo with a few healing spells and restore life (in pvp) why? becouse monks would not live long enough with a nerf to healing .

kairusan · May 11, 2005, 05:10 PM // 17:10

you might think monks heal to well but try going down into the Rift and fighting some foes... see how much healing breeze helps rofl.

Lewick · May 11, 2005, 06:53 PM // 18:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by kairusan

you might think monks heal to well but try going down into the Rift and fighting some foes... see how much healing breeze helps rofl.

Yeah, healing breeze is a good heal until you're fighting stuff that hits for 100+ per hit. Then you have to start looking for options, like reversal of fortune and heal other, etc. Otherwise, the mage tanking after overnuking is going to die. Even to swarming lower level critters.

master · May 11, 2005, 07:42 PM // 19:42

k, healing is REQUIIRED to at least out heal the damage, otherwise there's no point of having a healer since it's just a waste of time. Healing spells has to be WAY better than damage spell, period. The truth is it can be shut down, if you know anything about guild wars quite easily as mentioned by many above. IF you find a way to beat the healers, then your team pretty much wins.