Curse

sister morphyne · Dec 01, 2006, 09:33 AM // 09:33

Someone please explain to me why ANet has to @#$% everything up?

Dark Angle · Dec 01, 2006, 12:21 PM // 12:21

why not they can do as they wish lol

Thom Bangalter · Dec 01, 2006, 01:28 PM // 13:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by sister morphyne

Someone please explain to me why ANet has to @#$% everything up?

some people want things to be balanced, myself included.

buzzerman · Dec 01, 2006, 03:25 PM // 15:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter

some people want things to be balanced, myself included.

Well, there is no such thing as "balance" in PvE anyway, so we don't care

.
I really dislike it every time when Anet has to ruin [some] nice builds for PvE people just because PvP gourmands need to have it "balanced"

This dual-Paragon support build was mostly a PvE build, one at which finally the otherwise ridiculous skirt wearing, gay angelique shouting-their-a**-off "Paragon" class was really shining..

This build still works in PvE, it's just as not as effective as before.. Too bad.

Relnor · Dec 01, 2006, 10:13 PM // 22:13

Can anyone post the template keys for these builds?

misfire200 · Dec 01, 2006, 11:35 PM // 23:35

lol yet they did nothing to searing flames pvp build, yeah makes a lot of sense messing with the paragon which was a pve build

ArianeB · Dec 02, 2006, 12:27 AM // 00:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by strcpy

Great build - thanks a lot.

I do not have Restore Conditions yet (I just made it to the mission, while I have been playing since just about the beginning, all of my chars that made it that far never needed to cap the skill and have since been deleted and new ones made - I hate playing prot/heal monks so never any need to cap it) and have been using mend conditions - work's pretty good too. I will cap Restore Condition tomorrow on my Dervish.

I also didn't have Song of Restoration and had already taken the quests that cause Nightfallen Garden to be where you go. I used Aria of Restoration and it worked pretty good. I finally got someone to take me to the Garden of Seborhim (if you have the Nightfallen garden just get someone who has not taken those quests as the party leader - you can enter the mission. Then just have them map out or go along with you). I can tell a difference with the Song of Restoration so it is worth getting.

I have the exact same problem.

I substituted Song of Restoration with Cauterize Signet and for the Monk came up with a better build:

Aegis
Reversal of Fortune
Power Drain (interrupt #1)
Leech Signet (interrupt #2)
Orision of Healing
Heal Whisper
Healers Boon
Ressurection Chant

This build is energy friendly so the nerf bat does not break it.

The best henchies to take are Devona, Sologon, Herta, and Kihm since they all have powers that help the Heroes.

bsumlin · Dec 05, 2006, 06:32 AM // 06:32

- Scenario 1 -
Setting: an opulent room high atop a lone tower at Anet headquarters.

A fat, southern gentelman in a white suit with a monacle and cigar sits in front of a glowing monitor displaying gwonline.net. The forum search box reads "awesome team build". The old man hmmms and haaaas and harumphs as he says "well, we certainly can't have THAT." In his left hand is a list of skills to be nerfed, written in elegant, flowing script. He signs the list, gets up from his chair and walks over to a metal pipe running from cieling to floor. Opening a concealed door, he puts his list inside the tube, closes the door, and presses a button. A slight thump, and he takes a long pull from his cigar. He is satisfied.

- Scenario 2 -
Setting: Anet development headquarters, on a Sunday.

Two of the game's programmers are enjoying a hero battle on Anet's closed testing server. After a crippling, humiliating defeat, One says, "holy hell that was stupid. How'd you beat me so fast?" Two says "oh it's this build I found on the forums. I think Lordhelmos wrote it. Man, it's amazing what the community can do with the tools we give them, isn't it?" One says "haha yeah, it's pretty neat, they're really smart at synergizing!" Two gets up to leave for the day when One says "hey I'll catch up with you, I'm gonna check my email." After he is alone, he sets down to nerf the hell out of the build he lost to.

- Scenario 3 -
Setting: some broken alley behind an inner-city 7-11.

A bunch of anet developers are sitting around, super stoned. Many are also drunk. One says "oh man oh man oh man oh man oh man...know what would make everyone hate us? Let's find the best build on the forums and totally NERF THE HELL OUT OF IT!!! OH MAN HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!"

Has anyone found a way around the recent changes? I tried Djinn farming (which has always been easy with this build) and got horribly murdered. I might try that OOTV setup...

Santra · Dec 05, 2006, 07:27 AM // 07:27

I ended up changing the paragon to this build here http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Build:P/W_Party_Support

With this party support paragon + the RC Prot Tahlkora/Dunkoro + Kihm, I've found the team is pretty survivable in PvE. Let's me pick 3 henchies (normally I take the Blood and Illusion henchies with Mhenlo for some extra healing just in case I do a bad pull), and one more hero spot that is open for me to pick and choose.

For the 3rd hero slot, I pick what I find useful. I've used the Koss build posted earlier for some steady damage. This Souseke build for interrupts. This searing flames build for added damage. Or the necro MM build.

Main problem I've been having is damage. It's got plenty of protection, but damage output is a bit lacking. I'm making up for it by playing a spirit bombing Rit for the armor ignoring damage, but it could be better.

Checka · Dec 05, 2006, 03:12 PM // 15:12

Para Holding WAS imbalanced. Nothing to say. You just are not able with any skills ingame to get them off altar. Vocal Minority and well of silence only helps against the 2 paras but what about the RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOin wards and the monks with unlimited energy because of the paras? i think it was imba so they fixed it, nothing more to say. If u played against a dual Parabuild u will have to fight about 20 minutes and more to win or u just /roll it... very nice.

or whats the reason why [hex] hold halls about 30 times in a row? because u are unable to kick their asses if u dont gank them with 2 teams.

Cold · Dec 05, 2006, 05:04 PM // 17:04

Only one problem here, ranger hero won't use barrage if she can use other skills. And don't ever give her Throw Dirt

Some elites are just ignored by heros. "Shove" is the one that Koss doesn't want to use at all...

Cygnus_Zero · Dec 09, 2006, 04:41 AM // 04:41

After some time I was able to get things set up right with this hero build and was able to finish some difficult quests. Although I could not finish I believe it was A History of Violence. It's the one where you have to beat 3 different bosses. The quest was pretty long. I just could not handle the massive amount of lvl 28 enemies at the end. The henchies were getting wiped out constantly throughout the entire quest. The hero's held up better, but they died pretty often too. So although this hero build is good, it's definitely not as strong as it used to be.

I did find though that I was having more luck swapping out Jin for Olias. His minions do help to distract and absorb some of the damage, and that could mean the difference between success and failure. I was finding Jin to be dying too often. With that short bow, she just runs right into battle like a tank and receive the brunt of the initial damage. So I just got rid of her. She wasnt helping much. All around I find Olias to be much more of a huge help.

I even used himt o help me cap Feast of Corruption which is one of the toughest skills in the game to cap. I originally tried this with Jin and didnt make it out of snake dance.

sister morphyne · Dec 12, 2006, 07:29 AM // 07:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter

some people want things to be balanced, myself included.

translation:

someone kicked the crap out of my mediocre twat build with a really well thought out, creative build.

Because I lack the imagination to come up with anything remotely creative, I therefore welcome the reduction to the lowest common denominator.

Would you say that was accurate?

jesh · Dec 12, 2006, 08:11 AM // 08:11

sister morphyne, the title says it all. Please elaborate on how unlimited energy with non elite skills is balanced, if you would.
If Arena Net wanted that, they would have buffed Mantra of Recall instead of nerfing it.
Quoting Thom Bangalter on a nuetral post and turning it into a personal attack is just a little uncalled for. Well thought out? Please, you didn't invent using paragons any more than Al Gore did.

sister morphyne · Dec 13, 2006, 09:46 AM // 09:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by jesh

sister morphyne, the title says it all. Please elaborate on how unlimited energy with non elite skills is balanced, if you would.
If Arena Net wanted that, they would have buffed Mantra of Recall instead of nerfing it.
Quoting Thom Bangalter on a nuetral post and turning it into a personal attack is just a little uncalled for. Well thought out? Please, you didn't invent using paragons any more than Al Gore did.

When I call you Sunday's River Mud Prawn with delusions of consciousness, that's a personal attack.

Soooooo, the spider on your little white-washed wall is unlimited energy huh?
Well, my ranger spams expensive skills, Brutal and Penetrating, and keeps up an "unlimited energy" supply from Ferocious Strike. So what can I now expect from the ANet Toad? They going to double the recharge on Ferocious? Half the bonus on expertise?

My warrior does even worse than that. She totally circumnavigates the entire energy issue by using "For Great Justice!". She uses that, hamstrings the opponent so it cannot run away (another moronic ANet offering), uses Flail when it's ready, then quite literally spam Galraths and Dragon Slash to great effect. The only time energy comes into play for her is to occasionaly fire up shield stance to cover for healing signet and to turn on "For Great Justice!" when it has cooled down. What nerf can we expect for this unforgivable behaviour in your world

Intelligent energy management and creativity does not deserve to be penalised. In this particular strata of ANet, creativity=punishment (and I draw a clear distinction between the wonderfully creative programmers and artists who give us this terrific, addictive game, and the Ellsworth Toohey like, no-value-added parasites, who try and take the fun away)

P.S.
Oops, before I forget, let me share the greatest of my perversions with you which will no doubt have the cookie-cutters and the simpering sycophants howling for my blood, I use a pet with Ferocious on my monk (gasp). She doen't do the more exotic condition and hex removals, but the bread-and-butter keep-them-on-their-feet healing flows without a hitch because of the notorious "unlimited energy" supply.

Taala · Dec 13, 2006, 10:12 AM // 10:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by sister morphyne

Well, my ranger spams expensive skills, Brutal and Penetrating, and keeps up an "unlimited energy" supply from Ferocious Strike.

Didn't happen to notice jesh mentioning "unlimited energy with non elite skills"?

sister morphyne · Dec 13, 2006, 10:30 AM // 10:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taala

Didn't happen to notice jesh mentioning "unlimited energy with non elite skills"?

Sue me.

(nits are in danger of becoming extinct with all this picking)

jesh · Dec 14, 2006, 07:32 PM // 19:32

Of course rangers have expertise. Paragons, in their previous state, could give unlimited energy to allies, not just themselves. That's why it was changed.

It really bothers me how you think that people are actually changing the game so that you have less fun. Guess what? Arena Net could care less about what you think is fun. They keep things balanced, because that's what keeps the GAME fun.
No one said anything about creativity. If anything, this is one of the least creative team builds - simply because P/Ws were rampant for just this purpose - before the skill balancing.

Muk Utep · Dec 14, 2006, 09:21 PM // 21:21

I can't get Magrid to use barrage reliably. She'll use the skill once in a while, every 5-10 seconds or so, which is not incredibly effective. What to do?

jesh · Dec 14, 2006, 09:28 PM // 21:28

Make sure she's set to attack mode. If she already is, you can also open up her bar and just hit barrage over and over, while you use keys to activate your skills.