Curse

Showtime · Jul 14, 2009, 02:40 PM // 14:40

Haven't played for a while, but this sounds fun. I will have to try Farkenway.

Shadowphoenix · Jul 15, 2009, 11:33 PM // 23:33

Hey Dynamic Duo

, congratz on your build it is awesome combining the recently buff ritualist with 2 discords but I will make you a humble opinion, try to replace Rotting Flesh with Withering Aura just to make the conditions for the use of Discord since you're targeting one foe at a time but without the spreading disease and going safe against human foes, again just my humble opinion.

P.D: What is the combination for your Sword/Shield set? (I know Sword is Vampiric Dragon Sword, but the shield didn't recognize in the photo), just asking because I'm a Fashion Victim

Jensy · Jul 15, 2009, 11:54 PM // 23:54

Guildmate and I run this through HM Bogroot for funs, and it's awesome. We're not in it for speed clears, so each run takes us 40 mins or so. We're both SY! command paras, and yeah... thanks for sharing.

fenix · Jul 16, 2009, 02:50 AM // 02:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadowphoenix

Hey Dynamic Duo

, congratz on your build it is awesome combining the recently buff ritualist with 2 discords but I will make you a humble opinion, try to replace Rotting Flesh with Withering Aura just to make the conditions for the use of Discord since you're targeting one foe at a time but without the spreading disease and going safe against human foes, again just my humble opinion.

P.D: What is the combination for your Sword/Shield set? (I know Sword is Vampiric Dragon Sword, but the shield didn't recognize in the photo), just asking because I'm a Fashion Victim

Considering I've been running Hundred Blades with Whirlwind Attack, Withering Aura would be a great condition spread. Might give it a try.

We were using Guardian of the Hunt shields

Jeydra · Jul 16, 2009, 03:05 AM // 03:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by pansy malfoy

Guildmate and I run this through HM Bogroot for funs, and it's awesome. We're not in it for speed clears, so each run takes us 40 mins or so. We're both SY! command paras, and yeah... thanks for sharing.

There's no doubting the build is powerful; the real question is whether it is superior. There're lots of builds that can take you through HM Bogroot Growths with little to no pain, especially since you had two Imbagons. Fair to ask is: can you do the dungeon faster / smoother / etc with this, and what about other areas of PvE?

@Build - just realized this not so long ago: Spiritual Pain destroys this build. Which means against any area with Spiritual Pain (in EotN where I do most of my PvE, that would be the Shimmering Oozes), you'll have to weigh your options carefully before leaving, as well as prioritize any Shimmering Oozes if you run into them (even more so than Earthbound Oozes).

fenix · Jul 16, 2009, 03:20 AM // 03:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeydra

There's no doubting the build is powerful; the real question is whether it is superior. There're lots of builds that can take you through HM Bogroot Growths with little to no pain, especially since you had two Imbagons. Fair to ask is: can you do the dungeon faster / smoother / etc with this, and what about other areas of PvE?

@Build - just realized this not so long ago: Spiritual Pain destroys this build. Which means against any area with Spiritual Pain (in EotN where I do most of my PvE, that would be the Shimmering Oozes), you'll have to weigh your options carefully before leaving, as well as prioritize any Shimmering Oozes if you run into them (even more so than Earthbound Oozes).

This build DOES have that issue, but the benefit of the way the build works is that you can bring literally ANYTHING on your primary character and the build won't be any less effective.

This means you can bring skills designed purely for shutting down Shimmering Ooozes and similar monsters. For example, X/E with Thunderclap, and then wanding to interrupt the skills. Alternatively, you could go /Me and bring Guilt, which would interrupt Spiritual Pain + steal energy.

A great way of taking these challenges on, is to flag back the heroes and running in to take aggro with Prot Spirit on you. This takes the first few spells, after which you can slowly pull them back into spirit range. If you put down Shelter/Displacement/Union before aggroing, you'll tank most damage pretty easily.

Arkantos · Jul 16, 2009, 03:31 AM // 03:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeydra

There's no doubting the build is powerful; the real question is whether it is superior. There're lots of builds that can take you through HM Bogroot Growths with little to no pain, especially since you had two Imbagons. Fair to ask is: can you do the dungeon faster / smoother / etc with this, and what about other areas of PvE?

@Build - just realized this not so long ago: Spiritual Pain destroys this build. Which means against any area with Spiritual Pain (in EotN where I do most of my PvE, that would be the Shimmering Oozes), you'll have to weigh your options carefully before leaving, as well as prioritize any Shimmering Oozes if you run into them (even more so than Earthbound Oozes).

I've never h/h'd through Bogroots, so I wouldn't be able to talk about that. However, I have found that this build is faster and runs smoother in some areas, as opposed to discord/sabway. I've also found that it's slower and not as smooth in some areas. No build is going to be amazing in every single area of the game.

Yes, spiritual pain does destroy this build, if you don't take time to flag heroes and such. The great thing about PvE is that you know what the enemies are running, so you can adapt/change your build. As I said before, it's faster in some areas and slower in others.

Jeydra · Jul 16, 2009, 03:39 AM // 03:39

I should amend what I wrote. Spiritual Pain destroys this build when it is caught off-guard. When you're ready, when you've flagged heroes / henchmen apart and pre-cast all your spirits, when you're aggro'ing / triggering popups properly with Prot Spirit on you, then the danger from Spiritual Pain is greatly reduced, and this build will roll through the Oozes like any other mob. You don't need to change the build on the player, you can just adapt tactics and beat the Oozes. Especially since Shimmering Oozes tend to be pretty rare, like 1-2 of them in a full mob of Oozes.

On the other hand, if caught by surprise - and Ooze popups are fairly common in dungeons - red bars will not only fall they will fall alarmingly fast. Spiritual Pain, Energy Surge and HM + Fast Casting is a deadly combination, and even one Shimmering Ooze can wipe your party if you leave him alone long enough. It's not long too; I'd give him ~15 seconds before some people start dying. If you trigger unexpected Ooze popups then unless you are so fast as to flag heroes apart ASAP, you really have to lock on to the Shimmering Ooze(s) and kill them first ...

That's why I mentioned Spiritual Pain. The skill is a hard counter to this build. It still works alright, you just need to be more careful. It's rather like fighting Burning Spirits + Flowstone Elementals. If you're ready for them, they're not that bad. If you're not ready for them, then you will suffer.

As for Bogroot Growths, I'd say that standard Sab / Discordway is faster. That's because there're oodles of bodies in the dungeon. With 20, perhaps even 30 minions about as a mobile destructive force, kill speed increases accordingly. At the other end of the spectrum is a place like Oola's Lab. This time there're few bodies so massing spirits will be faster, although of course any thinking player will not bring standard Sab / Discordway into Oola's Lab.

Just some thoughts.

wiz12268 · Jul 17, 2009, 03:07 PM // 15:07

Haven't tested it out, but since I got back on my ritualist I made the standard spirit spammer type builds, and have xandra on with that guy, haven't gotten to razah yet on him but have razah and xendra on my ranger. So I have fooled around with a few things. A couple spirit spammers and hybrid discord/MM builds and they all seem to work well in most situations. Hell, even with ROJ monks spirit spamming worksbe cause by the time they get away from the wall they are half dead (in hardmode) and 3/4 (dead in NM)

But on the ritual lord one in particular, you have a high channeling, with only one channeling skill, which from what can tell (again not tested deeply) doesn't give all that much energy back to begin with. Then ritual lord itself, is it really that good or even necessary? Because with a 13 communing those spirits will last 56 seconds anyway, and since they are semi defensive they really shouldn't be dying before then, even in a hard mode situation, especially with armor of unfeeling going.

Unless I am missing soemthing that is. Again haven't played too deeply into it and haven't really tested it. I assume that replaced reclaim essence, which you talked about on the first couple pages (I haven't read every page here). But if there is an issue with that one and them casting it out of combat, what about clamour of souls (if youre lloking for energy help) it doesn't really give any energy back, but it is free to cast and is't a half bad AOE, or if you want to have some channeling and are really having power issues, keep channeling at 13 and keep spirit siphon and throw in offering of spirit. Obviously all these skills are predicated on how well heroes cast them in and out of combat, but ritual lord to me doesn't seem to fit for soem reason.

Ahh I guess because of the Minions, these spirits die pretty fast, depending on your spawning power level, and even then they can go fast. Seems to be a slight conflict there, so I would either go full spawning/communing with no channeling to max out the spirits health and armor, and figure out another power source, or hope the minions don't counteract the build too much.

Voodoo Rage · Jul 18, 2009, 03:50 AM // 03:50

I vanquished Tahnnakai (sp?) Temple with a non-MM version of this build with myself as the Communing Defensive Rit.

Shadowphoenix · Jul 20, 2009, 10:02 PM // 22:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by fenix

Considering I've been running Hundred Blades with Whirlwind Attack, Withering Aura would be a great condition spread. Might give it a try.

We were using Guardian of the Hunt shields

Nice, ty for the shield name and thanx for taking my opinion in consideration

fenix · Jul 20, 2009, 11:40 PM // 23:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeydra

As for Bogroot Growths, I'd say that standard Sab / Discordway is faster. That's because there're oodles of bodies in the dungeon. With 20, perhaps even 30 minions about as a mobile destructive force, kill speed increases accordingly. At the other end of the spectrum is a place like Oola's Lab. This time there're few bodies so massing spirits will be faster, although of course any thinking player will not bring standard Sab / Discordway into Oola's Lab.

Just some thoughts.

Well at the moment our build has 20 minions also, or 10 if you run the 1 man build. This is the same as Sab's build, and Discord, as those two only ever have 1 MM in a team of 4. If you are doing a zone like Bogroot, which does have large numbers of corpses, then of course the build can be tweaked (such as making the Signet of Spirits Rit a Rt/N with SoS, Summon Bone Minions and Explosive Growth/Death Nova).

Ariena Najea · Jul 21, 2009, 05:19 AM // 05:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeydra

There's no doubting the build is powerful; the real question is whether it is superior. There're lots of builds that can take you through HM Bogroot Growths with little to no pain, especially since you had two Imbagons. Fair to ask is: can you do the dungeon faster / smoother / etc with this, and what about other areas of PvE?

@Build - just realized this not so long ago: Spiritual Pain destroys this build. Which means against any area with Spiritual Pain (in EotN where I do most of my PvE, that would be the Shimmering Oozes), you'll have to weigh your options carefully before leaving, as well as prioritize any Shimmering Oozes if you run into them (even more so than Earthbound Oozes).

I gave this a spin with a friend while doing the ZBounty for Magmus in Heart of the Shiverpeaks. The oozes initially obliterated our party since there were 6+ Shimmerings at the start, but with careful pulling and good luring, I got them to reliably waste Spiritual Pain before dragging them back to the spirits. While it is still not a good idea to bring this to Ooze filled areas, this tactic kept the spirits safe enough, and we were able to take on the entire room of Oozes (that had split multiple times after our wipe) after carefully eliminating the Shimmerings.

Awex Mafyews · Jul 21, 2009, 06:36 PM // 18:36

Done a bit of testing on the one man build, run it through the recent z-quests on HM and it worked extremely well every time, don't think I or any of the party died once. I personally prefer it too sabway and discordway. Tried it out against Master of Damage and compared it too sabway and discordway and it came out on top by a mile and my best damage in a second was only 3 under the 2 man build at 651. So in my opinion the one man build works just as well and better than the other favoured hero teams out there.

Klotto · Jul 27, 2009, 03:52 PM // 15:52

Ive tested this build yesterday in Tahnnakai Temple mission HM and I actually liked it. Cant compare to discord thou as I never did that mission in HM before.
But after this one, Ive tried Thirsty River and failed miserably there. Main issue was priest+boss pairs standing in small room-like areas. As soon as combat started, heros summon all the spirits and since you cant pull priest off the shrine, spirits stay out of range and dont dps the priest. Also, its common that spirits may be summoned so they are LoS to the target.
In other words, if you have stationary, non-moving foes or those who drop agro and tend to run to their initial spots, you may have big issue with spirit build. Or its just me? Maybe I was doing something wrong?

Omgopolis · Jul 27, 2009, 10:38 PM // 22:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Klotto

Ive tested this build yesterday in Tahnnakai Temple mission HM and I actually liked it. Cant compare to discord thou as I never did that mission in HM before.
But after this one, Ive tried Thirsty River and failed miserably there. Main issue was priest+boss pairs standing in small room-like areas. As soon as combat started, heros summon all the spirits and since you cant pull priest off the shrine, spirits stay out of range and dont dps the priest. Also, its common that spirits may be summoned so they are LoS to the target.
In other words, if you have stationary, non-moving foes or those who drop agro and tend to run to their initial spots, you may have big issue with spirit build. Or its just me? Maybe I was doing something wrong?

You're pretty much stuck with flagging the spirit heroes closer to the enemies, and then manually casting the spirits again if they are still in range. I used a similar spirit setup when I did Thirsty River and didn't notice any problems, even without flagging, but that was probably because I was just capping skills there in NM, not HM.

fenix · Jul 27, 2009, 11:02 PM // 23:02

A way to get heroes to cast closer to an enemy is to continue to run PAST the target, and then turn around and engage. This way the heroes will follow you in your original path (away from the enemy), but as they are a distance behind you, when you turn around to attack the target, the heroes will be much closer than if you had ran straight for it.

MMSDome · Jul 27, 2009, 11:15 PM // 23:15

I was waiting for Fenix to come back from being afk last night to do a vanquish so I decided I would just scroll our way into fow since we were in ToA. It was unbelievably easy to just steamroll our way through everything and the funny thing is all our heros had minions and our build wasn't fow specific. We had no cons and made it to the tower in 5min without any of our party going below 90% health.

Quite easy.

Show Some Skin · Jul 27, 2009, 11:44 PM // 23:44

Its really cool you guys made this build, i should learn it so i can use on my rit

Can you use this build on HM missions? And can your heros run this as well?

zelgadissan · Jul 28, 2009, 12:08 AM // 00:08

Honest question - have you read a word of this thread? All the examples of use are in HM and all the builds being discussed are for heroes.