Curse

kel77 · Feb 21, 2008, 02:22 AM // 02:22

Hi, just curious if anyone has experimented building a hero's bar around the skills [skill]Locust's Fury[/skill] or [skill]Way of the Assassin[/skill]. Choosing one of the elites, you would try to max out the potential for Double strike or critical strikes respectively. My question is on a hero, just assuming auto attacking with minor runes and comparable weapons, which would provide better DPS, high chance for double strike or crits?

For the double strike build, you would use the best daggers possible and have 14 dagger mastery. So from locusts fury, you have a total double strike chance of 78%.

For the crit build, you could throw in a scythe and add[skill]Critical Eye[/skill] and [skill]Way of the Master[/skill]

At 14 critical strikes, you have a 78% chance to critical from the skills, and assuming a scythe mastery attribute of 12, our approximate chance of critical comes to 95%.

Adding attack skills at this point would just confuse the issue, so at this point we have one build with a double strike chance of 78% and one with a critical chance of 95%. Just auto attacking on the master of damage, which would do better DPS over, say 30 seconds? Also how much effect would throwing in an IAS have, and would one clearly be better then the other with an increased attack speed. Right now I'm leaning toward the crit build, but I'm not quite sure what effect double strike has on pure damage.

So if anyone has any thoughts about this, or knows some answers, please help me!

Tyla · Feb 21, 2008, 02:26 AM // 02:26

Double-Strike only occurs on normal attacks, and Dual Attacks.
Locusts Fury = absolute rubbish. Now even less use than before due to the "Fear Me!" nerf.

Way of the Assassin should be much better, by far.

Kyrein · Feb 21, 2008, 02:35 AM // 02:35

crit scythers have been around for a looooooooooooooong time

locusts fury is just plain fail

kel77 · Feb 21, 2008, 02:57 AM // 02:57

I think you guys are right, even auto attacking their is a difference of almost 20 DPS between the two builds...That huge chance to critical insures a great supply of energy as well as damage.
Questioned answered, thread can close.

kel77 · Feb 21, 2008, 02:58 AM // 02:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyrein

crit scythers have been around for a looooooooooooooong time

locusts fury is just plain fail

And ya I've seen plenty of those scythe sins, this is a build based on that idea, slightyly adapted for hero use.

Kyrein · Feb 21, 2008, 03:32 AM // 03:32

its called editing, it removes the need to double post

Cebe · Feb 21, 2008, 10:19 AM // 10:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by tyla salanari

Locusts Fury = absolute rubbish. Now even less use than before due to the "Fear Me!" nerf.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyrein

locusts fury is just plain fail

I have to completely disagree if you don't mind.

Locust's Fury's best use is on a Hero Assassin. What do as all know heroes hate doing most? Using attack skills... I've been using two assassin hero builds of late with good results:

Quote:

Anton. Double-Striking 'Sin.
Since heroes have this horrible habit of not using attack skills when they're available, I figured at least the chance to double strike would be beneficial...and it is. Locust's Fury gives Anton a nice boost to his DPS.

[skill]Critical Eye[/skill][skill]Locust's Fury[/skill][skill]Way of Perfection[/skill][skill]Golden Fox Strike[/skill][skill]Wild Strike[/skill][skill]Death Blossom[/skill][wiki]Weapon of Aggression[/wiki][skill]Death Pact Signet[/skill]

Zenmai. Deadly Spider.
Heroes don't seem bad at using hexes. This build utilises that and Zenmai uses it pretty well.

[skill]Critical Eye[/skill][skill]Black Spider Strike[/skill][skill]Disrupting Stab[/skill][skill]Wild Strike[/skill][skill]Death Blossom[/skill][skill]Siphon Strength[/skill][skill]Dark Prison[/skill][skill]Rebirth[/skill]

I did in fact test these builds on the battle isles, along with other melee heroes. To my surprise, Locust's Fury came out on top, with ~45DPS. Next up was a Dragon Slash build ran by King of the Afros which managed something like ~35DPS. Koss would sit there with D-Slash recharged for ages sometimes, 10 seconds or so, before using it, other times he would use it 5 times in a row. At least when Anton decides he doesn't like his attacks, he can sit there with the Weapon Spell on and double strike away to his hearts content. It also works well with Splinter Weapon on a Rit Hero for a super-fast splinter spike.

I came to the conclusion a while back that assassin heroes aren't all that bad, though after having played with Melonni recently I've come to the decision that I like Dervish heroes rather a lot now.

I don't see what huge difference Way of the Assassin will make to be honest. I mean...greater chance to critical is not that useful if you give him 13 Critical Strikes and Critical Eye, and don't give him spammable over-expensive skills. Unless your hero assassin is not wielding daggers, I don't see why it would be more useful than Locust's Fury. With my current Locust's Fury build, Anton has 12 + 1 Critical Strikes, 10 + 1 + 2 Dagger Mastery and 8 Channeling Magic. He generally uses Weapon of Agression on recharge and with Zealous daggers, energy isn't much of a concern, and he's pumping out plenty of damage when he's decided attack skills are for noobs. WIth heroes, I find it's better to make the most out of a bad situation than give them a good build a human can use and expect them to use it well. They wont.

kel77 · Feb 21, 2008, 02:08 PM // 14:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Celestial Beaver

Unless your hero assassin is not wielding daggers, I don't see why it would be more useful than Locust's Fury.

I did see your locust's fury build earlier soemwhere, and I decided to try it out. I did say in my originial post that for the crit build i would probably give Zenmai a scythe...
So far, I would have to say the crit build is far superior to the locust's fury one, sorry mate

Marverick · Feb 21, 2008, 02:50 PM // 14:50

Zenmai runs Moebius DB at around 50-60 DPS... not optimal at all but still better than that Locust's Fury crap and stuff...

[skill]Critical Defenses[/skill][skill]Way of Perfection[/skill][skill]Golden Phoenix Strike[/skill][skill]Death Blossom[/skill][skill]Moebius Strike[/skill][skill]Critical Eye[/skill][skill]Disrupting Dagger[/skill][skill]Resurrection Signet[/skill]

Other weapons (spear, scythe, etc.) don't really work with heroes since they have no IAS to use.

Cebe · Feb 21, 2008, 03:14 PM // 15:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marverick

Zenmai runs Moebius DB at around 50-60 DPS... not optimal at all but still better than that Locust's Fury crap and stuff...

[skill]Critical Defenses[/skill][skill]Way of Perfection[/skill][skill]Golden Phoenix Strike[/skill][skill]Death Blossom[/skill][skill]Moebius Strike[/skill][skill]Critical Eye[/skill][skill]Disrupting Dagger[/skill][skill]Resurrection Signet[/skill].

I'll have to try that out later, looks interesting, though I always thought Assassins never used Moebius Strike as intended. Do you find she spends a long time auto-attacking, or does she actually use the combo as much as she can?

brakner · Feb 21, 2008, 04:27 PM // 16:27

These are my Zenmai's

[skill]Golden Lotus Strike[/skill][skill]Golden Phoenix Strike[/skill][skill]Death Blossom[/skill][skill]Moebius Strike[/skill][skill]Aura of Thorns[/skill][skill]Vital Boon[/skill][skill]Mystic Regeneration[/skill][skill]Conviction[/skill]

I find that this build keeps her alive even in very crazy fights. Probably could go for more Assassin defense skills but I found with there short durations she didn't refresh them as often as the Derv ones.

[skill]Barrage[/skill][skill]Keen Arrow[/skill][skill]Distracting Shot[/skill][skill]Savage Shot[/skill][skill]Critical Eye[/skill][wiki]Way of the Master[/wiki][skill]Shadow Refuge[/skill][skill]Favorable Winds[/skill]

I use this when I want more AoE on my interrupter, I pair her with my R/P with "Go for the Eyes"

Marverick · Feb 21, 2008, 08:27 PM // 20:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Celestial Beaver

I'll have to try that out later, looks interesting, though I always thought Assassins never used Moebius Strike as intended. Do you find she spends a long time auto-attacking, or does she actually use the combo as much as she can?

She doesn't chain Moebius => DB => Moebius => DB => etc. continuously, usually something like Moebius => DB => auto attack => Moebius => auto attack => DB => Moebius => DB => auto attack => etc.

but it's still a whole lot better than some of the other [incredibly crappy] builds posted for dagger sin heroes.

Basically you just need to keep the chain nice and simple. 3 attack skills seems to work best for me. Multiple duals usually makes her do stupid stuff like Moebius => Critical Strike => DB.