Curse

Antithesis · Apr 28, 2008, 12:31 AM // 00:31

If you're gonna drop Power Lock, take [[drain enchantment] to help power Empathy. To make Frustration effective you need to spec into 4 att lines.

Bront · Apr 28, 2008, 12:34 AM // 00:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

do you really have that many conditions that you need to use your elite to get rid of them? and are they powerful enough to be worth putting on your foes?

In some areas, i've found myself crippled, deep wounded, bleeding, and blinded by one group of mobs, and those can be quite useful on a foe. It probably depends on the area as much as anything. In low condition areas, it's probably not a good idea, but in high condition areas, particularly with multiple different kinds, it can be quite useful, particularly when combined with Epidemic.

Chthon · Apr 28, 2008, 12:35 AM // 00:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

2) If your main character is a caster, he can use [[Shadow Sanctuary] for hp regen and armor, and your hero can spread blindness to your foes too.

Now, that is a nice idea.

Bront · Apr 28, 2008, 12:36 AM // 00:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antithesis

If you're gonna drop Power Lock, take [[drain enchantment] to help power Empathy. To make Frustration effective you need to spec into 4 att lines.

Doh, that is illusions, isn't it?

Between Hex Eater and Power Drain, energy usually isn't a big problem with this build. In hex-poor areas, [[drain enchantment] may make a good replacement for [[Hex Eater].

Antithesis · Apr 28, 2008, 12:48 AM // 00:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

If your main character is a caster, he can use [[Shadow Sanctuary] for hp regen and armor, and your hero can spread blindness to your foes too.

Completely missed that, good idea, but if i'm N/A i'll be using Assassin's Promise as the elite.

Contagion + Shadow Sanctuary or Shadow Sanctuary + Foul Feast + Plague Signet/Plague Sending + Epidemic/Fevered Dreams for AoE blind is overkill compared to something like Shadowsong.

Not worth it unless you can spread both Dazed and Blind IMHO. You could do that with Foul Feast + Contagion + Shadow Sanctuary + Headbutt (on a Hero) but it's hard work.

DarkSpirit · Apr 28, 2008, 01:20 AM // 01:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antithesis

Completely missed that, good idea, but if i'm N/A i'll be using Assassin's Promise as the elite.

Contagion + Shadow Sanctuary or Shadow Sanctuary + Foul Feast + Plague Signet/Plague Sending + Epidemic/Fevered Dreams for AoE blind is overkill compared to something like Shadowsong.

Not worth it unless you can spread both Dazed and Blind IMHO. You could do that with Foul Feast + Contagion + Shadow Sanctuary + Headbutt (on a Hero) but it's hard work.

The greatest condition against physical is Blind and the greatest condition against casters is Dazed.

Dazed is difficult to inflict and it is mostly only from certain elite skills (and 4 normal skills) of 4 classes besides Technobabble (only 2 to 6s).

Blind from Shadowsong lasts for only 5s at level 11. Blind from Shadow Sanctuary lasts 10s. This means even if the hero uses Plague Signet to transfer the condition after 5s (half) has expired, at level 14 curse, you still transfer about 9-10s of blind after extending through plague signet.

Antithesis · Apr 28, 2008, 08:55 AM // 08:55

Shadowsong reapplies 5 secs of Blind roughly every sec for 30 secs. The recharge on Shadow Sanctuary is 30 secs and Blind can only be applied once. If done properly that can equate to 18-20 secs of Blind, the target will be dead well before then. Both can be buffed with Weapon of Quickening for almost constant uptime.

Both are good options although Blind really isn't needed, however I'd be sticking with SS on a Hero rather than Plague Signet and Assassin's Promise on a Player rather than Contagion, but it is a nice option. I had previously consider Shadow Sanctuary + Foul Feast + Plague Sending, but not Contagion. It's amazing how many skills don't get a second look.

DarkSpirit · Apr 28, 2008, 09:34 AM // 09:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antithesis

Shadowsong reapplies 5 secs of Blind roughly every sec for 30 secs. The recharge on Shadow Sanctuary is 30 secs and Blind can only be applied once. If done properly that can equate to 18-20 secs of Blind, the target will be dead well before then. Both can be buffed with Weapon of Quickening for almost constant uptime.

From the way the hero cast Shadowsong, it tends to be way back which is ok, but heroes dont always kite near areas where Shadowsong would hit. And they dont seem to recast shadowsong if the old one is still alive, unless you force them to. You are right that Shadowsong is effective enough generally, and it saves an elite slot. But you dont have as much control over the application of blind.

Quote:

Both are good options although Blind really isn't needed, however I'd be sticking with SS on a Hero rather than Plague Signet and Assassin's Promise on a Player rather than Contagion, but it is a nice option. I had previously consider Shadow Sanctuary + Foul Feast + Plague Sending, but not Contagion. It's amazing how many skills don't get a second look.

Contagion + Shadow Sanctuary would apply blind on all foes in the area when your necro casts it, then Foul Feast from a hero can remove that, extend and cast it on the target.

Assassin's Promise is nice but as a necro, you probably dont need the energy return, but just the skill recharge and you should be using damaging skills that have high recharge to make AP worthwhile. My mesmer uses an AP build too.

Antithesis · Apr 28, 2008, 09:41 AM // 09:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Assassin's Promise is nice but as a necro, you probably dont need the energy return, but just the skill recharge and you should be using damaging skills that have high recharge to make AP worthwhile.

Absolutely. The recharge on a number of decent skills in the Curses line as well as PvE skills are prohibitive without Assassin's Promise on the bar. I run Moloch Vein's build, it's good fun -

[Assassin's Promise][Mark Of Pain][Rigor Mortis][Barbs][Shadow Of Fear][Ebon Vanguard Assassin Support][Finish Him!][Technobabble]

Shadow Sanctuary can definitely be slotted in that bar.

DarkSpirit · Apr 28, 2008, 09:47 AM // 09:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antithesis

Absolutely. The recharge on a number of decent skills in the Curses line as well as PvE skills are prohibitive without Assassin's Promise on the bar. I run Moloch Vein's build, it's good fun -

[Assassin's Promise][Mark Of Pain][Rigor Mortis][Barbs][Shadow Of Fear][Ebon Vanguard Assassin Support][Finish Him!][Technobabble]

Shadow Sanctuary can definitely be slotted in that bar.

Nice, but I hope you are not bringing the same hexes on your heroes. And doesn't Shadow of Fear counter the SS from your hero?

This is what I use on my mesmer:

[build box name="Painful Promise HM Mesmer Build" prof=Me/A fas=7+1 ill=4+1 dom=11+1+2 ins=8+1 dead=9][Phantom Pain][Cry of Pain][Assassin's Promise][Pain Inverter][Shatter Delusions][Shrinking Armor][Energy Burn][Ether Signet][/build]

Antithesis · Apr 28, 2008, 10:37 PM // 22:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Nice, but I hope you are not bringing the same hexes on your heroes. And doesn't Shadow of Fear counter the SS from your hero?

You really do think i'm an idiot don't you?

I don't bring the SS hero with my Nec, that's redundancy at it's finest.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

This is what I use on my mesmer:

[build box name="Painful Promise HM Mesmer Build" prof=Me/A fas=7+1 ill=4+1 dom=11+1+2 ins=8+1 dead=9][Phantom Pain][Cry of Pain][Assassin's Promise][Pain Inverter][Shatter Delusions][Shrinking Armor][Energy Burn][Ether Signet][/build]

Looks fun. I've seen a few attractive Painful Promise builds.

DarkSpirit · Apr 28, 2008, 11:06 PM // 23:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antithesis

You really do think i'm an idiot don't you?

I don't bring the SS hero with my Nec, that's redundancy at it's finest.

I thought you were trying to trick me and see if I could spot the problems.

Bront · May 07, 2008, 06:11 AM // 06:11

Been tweeking the build a bit.

[build name="Bront's MM Bomber" prof=N/Mo Dea=12+3+1 Sou=8+1 Pro=10][Jagged Bones][Animate Bone Minions][Death Nova][Blood of the Master][Putrid Bile][Aegis][extinguish][Signet of Lost Souls][/build]

This works a bit better. Found the Necro doesn't use Prot Spirit very well, and Extinguish takes pressure off a healer to remove conditions.

[build name="Bront's SS Necro Feaster" prof=N/Rt Cur=11+1+1 Sou=10+1 Res=10][Spiteful Spirit][Barbs][Mark of Pain][Enfeebling Blood][Vengeful Weapon][Mend Body and Soul][Signet of Lost Souls][Death Pact Signet][/build]

This provides some more healing, and prevents some sacrifice on the health of the SS, which also takes some pressure off the healers.

[build name="Bront's Interupt Mesmer" prof=Me/rt Dom=12+1+1 Fas=10+1 Ins=8+1 res=2][CoF][Power Lock][Power Spike][Power Drain][Hex Eater Signet][Empathy][Mantra of Recovery][Death pact signet][/build]

Vengence works better when paired with Elementalists or direct damage dealers, and this hero set doesn't have any you'd be resing. Also, Empathy helps up the damage against attackers.

Found this to be more durable, and kill faster.