Curse

Widowmaker · Aug 25, 2008, 02:43 PM // 14:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zidane Ortef

Because I wanted to make it short and simple and didn't feel like writing another book.

Shame you then added a whole block of text under it.

But if it was simply to meet the text requirement then it was just a misunderstanding. Since you were quoting me it appeared to be aimed at me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightow

I'd much rather have more prot than healing.

[Dwayna's Sorrow] is very powerful on a MM, the sheer amount of healing it generates takes a lot of pressure off your healers.

Zidane Ortef · Aug 25, 2008, 02:49 PM // 14:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Widowmaker

Shame you then added a whole block of text under it.

But if it was simply to meet the text requirement then it was just a misunderstanding. Since you were quoting me it appeared to be aimed at me.

Nah it wasn't directed to anyone sorry if it came off that way,was just show the integration of Soul Bind into a build as you stated.

As for the block of text below its just Copy pasted builds from my previous post and a added copy and paste from wiki about Soul Bind.

Nosveratau · Aug 25, 2008, 03:20 PM // 15:20

Hi All

Finally got my third necro and I am interested in Sabway, just got a few questions, whats a good Ele build for Sabway, at the moment I am setup as Searing Heat (For destroyers its a useless build).

Would Sabway work for Glints Challenge?

What areas is Sabway not good for, dungeons, missions ect?

Cheers

Nos

ajc2123 · Aug 25, 2008, 04:09 PM // 16:09

Ty for all your help.

And it's not that sabways not effective. I just like to run something other then 3 necro's all the time. It gets boring lol. I have Gwen set up as a fast casting curses mesmer with enfeebling, weaken armor, Tease, mark of pain and a couple more utilities. So I have the cracked armor and weakness down.

I'll look into some of your suggestions. EXCEPT for sabway. Vanquishing a lot made me sick of it just because of how much I relied on it. I like different spices in life ya know?

Ty all

Zidane Ortef · Aug 25, 2008, 04:30 PM // 16:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nosveratau

Hi All

Finally got my third necro and I am interested in Sabway, just got a few questions, whats a good Ele build for Sabway, at the moment I am setup as Searing Heat (For destroyers its a useless build).

Would Sabway work for Glints Challenge?

What areas is Sabway not good for, dungeons, missions ect?

Cheers

Nos

The 3 necro team aka Sabway works just about everywhere only with minor changes. No Bodies No minions so you would replace it with anything and still not be bad off. Heres a few samples:

[build prof=Necromancer/Ritualist Template Code="OAhjYwHc4Q5BCN2BlB7OYgVVJXA" box desc="Curses 12+1+3{br}Soul Reaping 12{br}Restoration Magic 3"][Spiteful Spirit][Reckless Haste][Enfeebling Blood][Barbs][Rip Enchantment][Pure Was Li Ming][Signet of Lost Souls][Death Pact Signet][/build]

[build prof=Necromancer/Ritualist Template Code="OAhiYwh8YtlmTOh3wccWVTuA" box desc="Soul Reaping 12+1+1{br}Restoration Magic 12"][Xinrae's Weapon][Mend Body and Soul][Spirit Light][Spirit Transfer][Protective Was Kaolai][Life][Signet of Lost Souls][Death Pact Signet][/build]

[build prof=Elementalist/Ritualist Template Code="OghDkpycO9iiIZ9aALQG4ikL" box desc="Fire Magic 12+1+3{br}Earth Magic 9{br}Energy Storage 9"][Rodgort's Invocation][Teinai's Heat][Savannah Heat][Maelstrom][Ward Against Melee][Glyph of Lesser Energy][Fire Attunement][Death Pact Signet][/build]

or

[build prof=Mesmer/Any Template Code="OQBDApkDP+0cgHAGkBuAWABA" box desc="Inspiration Magic 12+1+1{br}Domination Magic 9{br}Fast Casting 9"][Tease][Cry of Frustration][Diversion][Spirit of Failure][Power Drain][Power Spike][Inspired Hex][Resurrection Signet][/build]

NOTE: Xinrae's Code is not updated it should be linked to Restoration Magic and read:

For 8 seconds, the next time target ally takes damage from a foe that damage is limited to 5% of that ally's max Health and that ally steals up to 20...68 Health from that foe.

Tease: If target foe is using a skill, that foe and all foes in the area are interrupted and you steal 0...4 Energy from each interrupted foe.

Nosveratau · Aug 25, 2008, 09:53 PM // 21:53

Hi Zidane

Just tried your Sabway builds posted, I have found a few problems, but to be honest I think its more to do with me and my lack of understanding of the build and game mechanics than the builds themselves.. Hopefully you can shed some light on my problems..

My Setup
[build prof=Elementalist/Ritualist Template Code="OghDkpycO9iiIZ9aALQG4ikL" box desc="Fire Magic 12+1+3{br}Earth Magic 9{br}Energy Storage 9"][Rodgort's Invocation][Teinai's Heat][Savannah Heat][Maelstrom][Ward Against Melee][Glyph of Lesser Energy][Fire Attunement][Death Pact Signet][/build]

Hero 1 Master of Whispers
[build prof=Necromancer/Ritualist Template Code="OAhjYwHc4Q5BCN2BlB7OYgVVJXA" box desc="Curses 12+1+3{br}Soul Reaping 12{br}Restoration Magic 3"][Spiteful Spirit][Reckless Haste][Enfeebling Blood][Barbs][Rip Enchantment][Pure Was Li Ming][Signet of Lost Souls][Death Pact Signet][/build]

Hero 2 Livia
[build prof=Necromancer/Monk Template Code="OANDUsldOVB0wS1oVVVqTf0I" box desc="Death Magic 12+1+3{br}Soul Reaping 9{br}Healing Prayers 9"][Animate Bone Minions][Death Nova][Jagged Bones][Dwayna's Sorrow][Signet of Lost Souls][Feast for the Dead][Cure Hex][Resurrection Chant][/build]

Hero 3 Dunkoro
[build prof=Monk/Elementalist Template Code="OwYT02nCzRjsR20Ij7a9Y6LTAA" box desc="Healing Prayers 11+1+3{br}Protection Prayers 10{br}Divine Favor 9][Word of Healing][Dwayna's Kiss][Dismiss Condition][Glyph of Lesser Energy][Shield of Absorption][Protective Spirit][Cure Hex][Rebirth][/build]

Problem 1: I found Livia at times completly useless, she would stop, have all her minions stop around her and she would heal them, sometimes this was a problem because she would do it at the beginning of a fight, so until she had done her healing, I had no use of that hero.

Problem 2: Lack of group wide interupts (although I have just noticed your Mesmer build), if I was to take on 3 Creatures that used meteor, the one I was attacking would be interupted using maelstrom, but the other 2 managed to cast the spell, eg Gate of Madness -- Dryders.

Problem 3: I dont know if it is because I am only in Normal Mode, but I found the DPS of the build a bit lacking. I was taking on groups of lvl24 and lvl28 mobs though.

Problem 4: How does this build get over areas that the mobs dont leave corpses?

Also tried Glints challenge with my first go, erm is 4:36 a good time

I also used the 2 monk henchies and two warriors.

Cheers

Nos

Ben-A-BoO · Aug 25, 2008, 10:08 PM // 22:08

Just a quick note
Are we still talking about Destroyers here?
If so I won't recommend to use fire damage against them due to their natural resistance against it Destroyer
Although they are considered fleshy so an MM and conditions works pretty well against them ... hexes can backfire since their Mesmers carry [[Hex Eater Vortex].

I usually pack
- Hero MM (aka Jagged with either prot or sorrow)
- N/Rt heal with splinter
- Depending on my Prof either a Condition Spread build like [[Broad head Arrow] or support Melee (DA Para and the like).

joshuarodger · Aug 25, 2008, 10:58 PM // 22:58

i'm a monk primary and i took a standard WoH bar. as a rit you could probably fill the role i played fairly well.

then i took something like

gwen: [discord][cry of frust][signet of disruption][hex eater signet][putrid bile][rotting flesh][leech signet][resurrection sig]
livia: [discord][animate bone minions][animate shamb][death nova][blood of the master][scourge healing][suffering][shadow of fear]
vekk: [thunderclap][lightning orb][blinding flash][air attune][glyph of lesser][shell shock][lightning hammer][flesh of my]

gwen's attributes were something like 10 death, 9+1 dom, 9+1 insp, the rest in FC with a +1 rune

livia was 12+3+1 death, 8+1 soul reaping, 9 smite, the rest curses with a +1 rune.

vekk was 12+1+1 air, 12+1 energy storage, the rest restoration

i kind of had to watch vekks energy, though. [[lightning hammer] is way too spammable for a hero so i kind of micro'd that skill. then i took devona, lina/mhenlo, herta, and zho.

NM versus destroyers was really easy with this set-up, a few problems with destructions depths in the last room due to stupid AI over aggro. (devona decided to solo the disc of chaos before we even killed the first mob) haven't really tried HM with this same set-up, but i think it should work with maybe a few minor tweaks.

kazjun · Aug 26, 2008, 06:36 AM // 06:36

Have you tried the easiest solution of all? Stick your ele melee hate build on a necro. Blind, weakness, cracked armour and lightning orb damage. 12 air, 9+1 SR and you can run something extra like carry earth wards or go curses for more fun.

distilledwill · Aug 26, 2008, 09:10 AM // 09:10

[Soul Bind] is incredibly useful versus HM destroyers. Once their "Inner Fire" is activated, stick that on them and they will drop in a few blinks of an eye. (note that the bbCode for Soul Bind hasnt been updated yet).

MercenaryKnight · Aug 26, 2008, 09:17 AM // 09:17

Soul bind really seems like a waste of an elite. I guess if you didn't have a discord group or triple necro setup you could bring a necro with soulbind. I would prefer to slap 9-10 smiting prayers on a necro (such as a discord) and bring scourge healing. Non elite, 1 second more to cast and roughly same damage with the same recharge. Plus you can add in reversal of damage and smite condition/ smite hex for some added support/ damage.

Zidane Ortef · Aug 26, 2008, 02:34 PM // 14:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nosveratau

Hi Zidane

Just tried your Sabway builds posted, I have found a few problems, but to be honest I think its more to do with me and my lack of understanding of the build and game mechanics than the builds themselves.. Hopefully you can shed some light on my problems..

My Setup
[build prof=Elementalist/Ritualist Template Code="OghDkpycO9iiIZ9aALQG4ikL" box desc="Fire Magic 12+1+3{br}Earth Magic 9{br}Energy Storage 9"][Rodgort's Invocation][Teinai's Heat][Savannah Heat][Maelstrom][Ward Against Melee][Glyph of Lesser Energy][Fire Attunement][Death Pact Signet][/build]

Hero 1 Master of Whispers
[build prof=Necromancer/Ritualist Template Code="OAhjYwHc4Q5BCN2BlB7OYgVVJXA" box desc="Curses 12+1+3{br}Soul Reaping 12{br}Restoration Magic 3"][Spiteful Spirit][Reckless Haste][Enfeebling Blood][Barbs][Rip Enchantment][Pure Was Li Ming][Signet of Lost Souls][Death Pact Signet][/build]

Hero 2 Livia
[build prof=Necromancer/Monk Template Code="OANDUsldOVB0wS1oVVVqTf0I" box desc="Death Magic 12+1+3{br}Soul Reaping 9{br}Healing Prayers 9"][Animate Bone Minions][Death Nova][Jagged Bones][Dwayna's Sorrow][Signet of Lost Souls][Feast for the Dead][Cure Hex][Resurrection Chant][/build]

Hero 3 Dunkoro
[build prof=Monk/Elementalist Template Code="OwYT02nCzRjsR20Ij7a9Y6LTAA" box desc="Healing Prayers 11+1+3{br}Protection Prayers 10{br}Divine Favor 9][Word of Healing][Dwayna's Kiss][Dismiss Condition][Glyph of Lesser Energy][Shield of Absorption][Protective Spirit][Cure Hex][Rebirth][/build]

Problem 1: I found Livia at times completly useless, she would stop, have all her minions stop around her and she would heal them, sometimes this was a problem because she would do it at the beginning of a fight, so until she had done her healing, I had no use of that hero.

Problem 2: Lack of group wide interupts (although I have just noticed your Mesmer build), if I was to take on 3 Creatures that used meteor, the one I was attacking would be interupted using maelstrom, but the other 2 managed to cast the spell, eg Gate of Madness -- Dryders.

Problem 3: I dont know if it is because I am only in Normal Mode, but I found the DPS of the build a bit lacking. I was taking on groups of lvl24 and lvl28 mobs though.

Problem 4: How does this build get over areas that the mobs dont leave corpses?

Also tried Glints challenge with my first go, erm is 4:36 a good time

I also used the 2 monk henchies and two warriors.

Cheers

Nos

1. Im confused about you saying with Livia, she has no heals so there is no way she can stand around and heal them MM heros lag behind but with proper pulling you can make them frontline like they should.

2. Again Maelstrom has to do with pulling so that you hit more than one foe with it. Also your hero selection is off a bit to this runs into number 3

3. Jagged bomber + barbs, SS, you, and 4 heros is plenty of DPS if you set up right. Your running Dunk+2 monk hench you should never ever use 3 healers its unneeded, as for the others ones you chose 2 melee isnt the best of choices either. Fusing back into number two in Factions and EotN you have access to Zho. Zho has a interrupt in Factions [Savage Shot] but in EotN he is Godly.

Zho's EotN Bar:

[Broad Head Arrow][Disrupting Shot][Penetrating Attack][Read the Wind][Savage Shot][Troll Unguent][Resurrection Signet]

4. Not wanting to be rude but I've already answered this question where I quoted your original post. This was my reply.

The 3 necro team aka Sabway works just about everywhere only with minor changes. No Bodies No minions so you would replace it with anything and still not be bad off. Heres a few samples:

[build prof=Necromancer/Ritualist Template Code="OAhjYwHc4Q5BCN2BlB7OYgVVJXA" box desc="Curses 12+1+3{br}Soul Reaping 12{br}Restoration Magic 3"][Spiteful Spirit][Reckless Haste][Enfeebling Blood][Barbs][Rip Enchantment][Pure Was Li Ming][Signet of Lost Souls][Death Pact Signet][/build]

[build prof=Necromancer/Ritualist Template Code="OAhiYwh8YtlmTOh3wccWVTuA" box desc="Soul Reaping 12+1+1{br}Restoration Magic 12"][Xinrae's Weapon][Mend Body and Soul][Spirit Light][Spirit Transfer][Protective Was Kaolai][Life][Signet of Lost Souls][Death Pact Signet][/build]

[build prof=Elementalist/Ritualist Template Code="OghDkpycO9iiIZ9aALQG4ikL" box desc="Fire Magic 12+1+3{br}Earth Magic 9{br}Energy Storage 9"][Rodgort's Invocation][Teinai's Heat][Savannah Heat][Maelstrom][Ward Against Melee][Glyph of Lesser Energy][Fire Attunement][Death Pact Signet][/build]

or

[build prof=Mesmer/Any Template Code="OQBDApkDP+0cgHAGkBuAWABA" box desc="Inspiration Magic 12+1+1{br}Domination Magic 9{br}Fast Casting 9"][Tease][Cry of Frustration][Diversion][Spirit of Failure][Power Drain][Power Spike][Inspired Hex][Resurrection Signet][/build]

NOTE: Xinrae's Code is not updated it should be linked to Restoration Magic and read:

For 8 seconds, the next time target ally takes damage from a foe that damage is limited to 5% of that ally's max Health and that ally steals up to 20...68 Health from that foe.

Tease: If target foe is using a skill, that foe and all foes in the area are interrupted and you steal 0...4 Energy from each interrupted foe.

In your case since your running the Ele I would stick with the SS, N/Rt Healer, and the Tease Mesmer.

In closing chose your henchman wisely. When I run a caster with sabway I stick with the basic 3 necros, 1 warrior hench, 1 monk hench, 1 or 2 Ele hench also love Eve anywhere I can have Eve and I'm play a caster.

Here is a basic layout of what I would normal do

Just bout every section of Proph. I would do this.

You: Caster
Heros: SS, MM, N/Rt healer
Hench: Cynn, Devona, Mhenlo, Eve

You: Melee
Heros: SS, MM, N/Rt healer
Hench: Cynn, Mhenlo, Eve, Ranger or Mesmer henchman

You: Monk
Heros: SS, MM, N/Rt healer
Hench: Cynn, Eve, Devona, Ranger or Mesmer Henchman

As for areas in proph like undead missions and such

Gwen as the Tease Mesmer would give you enough interruption and shutdown to easily take out what ever you run into

Factions: Factions has a larger set of heros to choose from so I'm just gonna name off professions

You: Caster
Heros: SS, MM, N/Rt Healer
Hench: Warrior, Monk, Ele, Necro or Warrior, Monk, Ele, Ranger

You: Melee
Heros: SS, MM, N/Rt Healer
Hench: Monk, Ele, Necro, Ranger

You: Monk
Heros: SS, MM, N/Rt Healer
Hench: Warrior, Ele, Necro, Ranger

Factions is corpse city when playing was a friend or guildmate some areas and missions two MM's can never hurt as corpse in factions are abundant.

Nightfall:

You: Caster
Heros: SS, MM, N/Rt Healer
Hench: Devona, Eve, Mhenlo, Cynn

You: Melee
Heros: SS, MM, N/Rt Healer
Hench: Eve, Mhenlo, Cynn, Herta

You: Monk
Heros: SS, MM, N/Rt Healer
Hench: Eve, Cynn, Devona, Herta

Again Nightfall is a campaign where corpses are there but not so much that you would want to MM's like in Factions

Eye of the North:

You: Caster
Heros: SS, MM, N/Rt Healer
Hench: Cynn, Zho, Devona, Mhenlo

You: Melee
Heros: SS, MM, N/Rt Healer
Hench: Cynn, Zho, Mhenlo, Herta

You: Monk
Heros: SS, MM, N/Rt Healer
Hench: Cynn, Zho, Devona, Eve

EotN has corpses for 99% of the game but some quests/dungeons like Oola's Lab, and Shards of Orr are places where the Tease mesmer comes in handy to replace the MM.

Just pick Henchman wisely 3 monks are never needed try to keep it balance try to always have one melee, 2 healers, 3-4 dmg dealer, and a supporter. Which is what I have shown you in the examples above.

Sabway + You + The Right Henchman will make everything just a cakewalk.

Vanquished from Camp Rankor to Beacons the other day H/H no cons just literally overpowered everything.

Also here is a few tips skills,

Melee: [Asuran Scan] now that it has a instant cast its a melee's best friend
Ranged melee: [Ebon Battle Standard of Honor] the more dmg the better

Misc.
[Ebon Vanguard Sniper Support] Just a ridiculously fun skill
[Cry of Pain] Godly
["Save Yourselves!"] Good Pressure Relief
[Pain Inverter] Bosses and AoE foes worst nightmare
[Summon Ice Imp] is good for nukers because it keeps them slowed and at a stand still.
[Drunken Master] Cheap easy IAS for melee that can be maintained
["Finish Him!"] Nice dmg and deep wound good for a combo ender

Just don't resort to using this

[Ursan Blessing]

also if you want to try something different I have yet to try it out but I've heard that this works decently well.

http://www.pvxwiki.com/wiki/Build:Team_-_Discord_Spam

Hopes this helps you out a bit.

~Zidane~

Nosveratau · Aug 26, 2008, 04:36 PM // 16:36

Hi Zidane

Thanks for such a great reply, as I said i knew it wasnt the builds, was my understanding of them. You have answered all of my questions and lots of great information, it is appreciated, the skills you have posted at the end, will take me a while to figure out as I dont have the ranks to really use them yet and still to do the quests for a few. If I cant work my teams from what you have posted them I would be aswell as quiting Guildwars, your information is detailed and you have prtactically taken my hand and walked me through builds

. Thanks for the effort you have went to.

My problem with Livia was my own doing, after going back and checking it was because I was rushing into battle without waiting for her to catch up with her minions as the minions are a little slower.

Cheers

Nos

Zidane Ortef · Aug 26, 2008, 05:39 PM // 17:39

No problem. Heros make great Minion Bombers but they spam the hell out of Dwayna's and Death Nova but that's what you them to do. So in the time that you have run shes running and spamming skills at the same time.

As for those PvE skills I listed yah it's a pain going around and collecting them, but with the update a few weeks ago they gave people with lower level ranks in the rep. titles the ability to use those skills and still get a decent effect out of them. So instead of having a worthless skill you cant use full till R9-10 most are perfectly effective at R6-7.

Thnx for the comments. Much Appreciated.

~Zidane~

Cathode_Reborn · Aug 26, 2008, 07:27 PM // 19:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by timebandit

If so I won't recommend to use fire damage against them due to their natural resistance against it

It's not just fire damage - they have insane armor against everything. If all these people using ele heroes actually tried playing an ele themselves, they'd drop those heroes so fast. Even with cracked armor, they still have tons of armor.

You're better off using as much armor-ignoring damage as you can. A Discord team is one of the best things you can use against them. I'd probably even use Soul Bind.

Martin Firestorm · Aug 26, 2008, 07:45 PM // 19:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cathode_Reborn

A Discord team is one of the best things you can use against them.

Yeah, and just about everything else. For the human ele build, bring "you run like a dwarf", pain inverter, and "finish him" for their effectiveness and to set up the discords, and whatever else you like. Assassin's promise is a sweet elite for this set up.