Curse

Rence · Apr 28, 2011, 05:36 PM // 17:36

I'm having a difficult time figuring out the most effective build for my monk heroes. I've looked at several popular builds found on the internet but it seems that opinions are divided as to which is most effective

.

I usually run with 2 monks in my party which consists of the basic NF heroes for now. I tried running one monk with a variation of the UA+DH+HD+gift build and the other with WoH and I've noticed that the UA monk would refuse to cast DH/HD as long as there's only one party member dying and makes the WoH monk do all the work. So I doubled up UA but it didn't seem to force them to act differently.

I also see a variety of dedicated healer builds where most of the skills are heal spells. I don't think bringing only one monk with this type of build would be sufficient healing, but seems two pure healers would be unnecessary as well.

Finally, there's the WoH hybrid with prots on pvxwiki which I haven't tried yet. I was wondering whether heroes are able to run this properly i.e not spam PS. Would running one of these plus a WoH/HB actually give the best result?

Would be great if anybody could share their experiences with me and suggest a build or pair of builds that heroes can use properly.

majoho · Apr 28, 2011, 07:09 PM // 19:09

For normal content one healer and a half protter should be enough.

Something like

http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Mo/any_Generic_Healer
Doesn't matter that much which elite you take.

http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_Sa...er_Necromancer
The first version that is with prot prayers.

You can run your other monk as a Smiter, obviously it all depends on what skills you have unlocked.

Gard · Apr 28, 2011, 07:50 PM // 19:50

You should disable PS and micro it. Hero's tend to use it often, making them run out of energy quite fast.

Jeydra · Apr 29, 2011, 12:59 AM // 00:59

The most effective Monk hero builds are this one and its variants:

12 + 1 + 1/2/3 Smiting Prayers
12 Divine Favour

Unyielding Aura [E] (or Ray of Judgement [E])
Smite Hex
Smite Condition
Reversal of Damage
Smiter's Boon
Castigation Signet
Divine Healing
Heaven's Delight

Dedicated healers are pretty bad in PvE, but if you want to use them use either an E/Mo Infuser or N/Rt healer.

Rence · Apr 29, 2011, 01:41 AM // 01:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gard

You should disable PS and micro it. Hero's tend to use it often, making them run out of energy quite fast.

Yeah that's what I was worried about and I'm trying to avoid having to micro anything. So if I don't want to micro, then I guess a prot build isn't for me?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeydra

The most effective Monk hero builds are this one and its variants:

12 + 1 + 1/2/3 Smiting Prayers
12 Divine Favour

Unyielding Aura [E] (or Ray of Judgement [E])
Smite Hex
Smite Condition
Reversal of Damage
Smiter's Boon
Castigation Signet
Divine Healing
Heaven's Delight

Dedicated healers are pretty bad in PvE, but if you want to use them use either an E/Mo Infuser or N/Rt healer.

Like I said, I ran a variation of this (Mo/Me with interrupts) and from my experience it seems heroes are willing to let a party member die than to cast DH/HD if no one else needs healing.

Jeydra · Apr 29, 2011, 01:42 AM // 01:42

That's why Reversal of Damage is in the build ...

Rence · Apr 29, 2011, 01:59 AM // 01:59

The thing with enchantments is that I assume heroes will spam them every opportunity they get and I'm not sure if castigation with its 20 sec recharge would be enough to let them keep it up. And that's assuming they can even use it properly. Or am I thinking too much?

majoho · Apr 29, 2011, 03:12 PM // 15:12

Why not try it and watch?

hunter · Apr 29, 2011, 06:13 PM // 18:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeydra

Dedicated healers are pretty bad in PvE, but if you want to use them use either an E/Mo Infuser or N/Rt healer.

Are you nuts? UA healer (not your smite variant bullshit) is the strongest healer in the game with the strongest rez with the ability for both party (heavens delight x2) and single target heal (patient spirit, dwayna's kiss)

Combine dwaynas with a prot spamming E/MO and its supper effective

These 2 builds just took care of your backline. So now you can stack as much midline as you want.

UA
Patient spirit
Dwayna's kiss
Rejuv signet
cure hex
Heavens delight
divine healing
GOLE

Run this and tell me its in anyway inferior to N/Rt resto (lol)

Outerworld · Apr 29, 2011, 06:50 PM // 18:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by hunter

Are you nuts? UA healer (not your smite variant bullshit) is the strongest healer in the game with the strongest rez with the ability for both party (heavens delight x2) and single target heal (patient spirit, dwayna's kiss)

Combine dwaynas with a prot spamming E/MO and its supper effective

These 2 builds just took care of your backline. So now you can stack as much midline as you want.

UA
Patient spirit
Dwayna's kiss
Rejuv signet
cure hex
Heavens delight
divine healing
GOLE

Run this and tell me its in anyway inferior to N/Rt resto (lol)

It's the prots you bring that are more important, the build Jeydra showed coupled with the common SoS/Resto hyrbrid is as much healing as you will need in PvE. Not only that, the UA/Smite bar provides damage as well, albeit only a slight amount but still more than a dedicated healer would.

Wenspire · Apr 29, 2011, 08:31 PM // 20:31

SoS restore hybrid would be sufficient healing as long as you had an MM along. Without an MM, I would be skeptical that it would be enough to keep a team alive long.

EFGJack · Apr 29, 2011, 09:44 PM // 21:44

Hunter, just because pvx recommends UA doesn't make it super-effective. A N Rt healer is miles ahead of UA and it doesn't need an E Mo bonder to make it worthwhile.

Mike Jack · Apr 29, 2011, 09:59 PM // 21:59

I liked how he emphasized that UA pumps out the most heals when coupled with an emo even though an emo pumps out more heals than UA (about 250 health healed per second, very unlikely on hero though)

Bandwagon · Apr 29, 2011, 11:29 PM // 23:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by hunter

Are you nuts? UA healer (not your smite variant bullshit) is the strongest healer in the game with the strongest rez with the ability for both party (heavens delight x2) and single target heal (patient spirit, dwayna's kiss)

Combine dwaynas with a prot spamming E/MO and its supper effective

These 2 builds just took care of your backline. So now you can stack as much midline as you want.

UA
Patient spirit
Dwayna's kiss
Rejuv signet
cure hex
Heavens delight
divine healing
GOLE

Run this and tell me its in anyway inferior to N/Rt resto (lol)

Its inferior to N/Rt (lol), then again E/Mo heroes hog everything, the prot, the redbar, the energy consumption.

I love how people build bars based on the presumption that your going to die.
Self fulfilling prophecy? Honestly I only advise UA if its your first time in an elite area and you cannot stand getting party wiped from a screw up on your first few playthroughs.

Rence · Apr 30, 2011, 02:12 AM // 02:12

this is the kind of divided opinion I was talking about

so if we could all get back to the topic of a monk hero build...

I don't think one dedicated healer would be enough for my party but two would probably be inefficient. A lot of people like the UA+DH+HD build but I watch my heroes and they prefer waiting for the single target heal to recharge than to use DH/HD if only one party member needs healing. So I guess UA+HD+DH is better for areas with AoE damage?

I might try the smiter build and run 2 of them, but is RoD something I need to micro like PS? Or is the cost low enough that heroes can get away with spamming it?

Mike Jack · Apr 30, 2011, 02:44 AM // 02:44

They could get away spamming it if they gained 9 energy every time a non-spirit creature dies.

Otherwise, you'll need to run like Castigation+2 insp. skills or it kills your energy and is sadly one of the few things worth running with Smiter's Boon.

Wenspire · Apr 30, 2011, 05:05 AM // 05:05

I also noticed heroes not using DH/HD much.

Instead of running WoH or UA, try Healing Burst. The recharge is just 1 sec longer than WoH but you get the "splash" heal which helps out a lot. I'm not a big fan of healer/prot hybrids on a hero so I normally have a dedicated prot hero which seems to keep EN up very well without the use of EN management skills. The healer hero takes the brunt of the work on my hero setups.

LexTalionis · Apr 30, 2011, 05:45 AM // 05:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wenspire

I also noticed heroes not using DH/HD much.

Instead of running WoH or UA, try Healing Burst. The recharge is just 1 sec longer than WoH but you get the "splash" heal which helps out a lot. I'm not a big fan of healer/prot hybrids on a hero so I normally have a dedicated prot hero which seems to keep EN up very well without the use of EN management skills. The healer hero takes the brunt of the work on my hero setups.

Except that bit about Healing Burst you know, disabling all your smiting skills.

I wouldn't say N/Rt nor E/Mo are the "best" healers in the game - Restoration has a bad habit of being lazy with healing until the last minute and E/Mo with Infuse Health becomes a royal headache of having no concept of priority with Necromancer minions. Glyph of Lesser Energy on a hero is kind of ugh though. Personally I find it easiest just to take Blood is Power on another hero and then the main advantage of the N/Rt (Nevah runs out of energeee!) is mostly moot and I don't have to force my monks into /Me for Power Drain nor take stupid things like Signet of Castigation.

Also lets you secondary spec into Protection Prayers easily or use a few 10 energy skills. Healing Seed is surprisingly effective on heroes.

Other advantages of monks: access to strong version of Dwayna's Sorrow (probably the best cover enchantment in the game and super kiss buff), good hex removal (not a futile endeavour if you use enough mesmers).

I'm wondering if 7 heroes and the subsequent freeing up of an elite slot for the viability of Blood is Power will enable the revival of the BoonProt. Maybe I should do a test.

Edit: Boonprot still ugh.

Wenspire · Apr 30, 2011, 06:39 AM // 06:39

Easy solution... don't bring smiting skills on your healer. If you really want smite skills, put them on your protector. Healers are better off having all their energy available to perform their task of red-barring, rather than spliting it up doing something else then not having enough available to keep people from dying.

Just my $0.02...

Lodar Aric · Apr 30, 2011, 09:07 AM // 09:07

These days I tend to run Healing Burst on the monk hero, I find in most areas with a MM with prot spirit + aegis and a ST communing rit plus SOS rit with a couple of heals it works well. If I need extra healing I would probably add a necro/rit healer.

Not much of a fan of E/Mo prot/healer heroes.