Curse

Why? · Mar 22, 2011, 04:58 PM // 16:58

my current build.

i just couldn't give monks enough energy. The 2 necros can heal through almost anything. I've been filling books in Cantha, and so far this has worked great.

Deadfalk · Mar 22, 2011, 05:54 PM // 17:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Why?

my current build.

i just couldn't give monks enough energy. The 2 necros can heal through almost anything. I've been filling books in Cantha, and so far this has worked great.

A few points :
* the first Mesmer, replace Ethereal Burden and Rebirth with Wandering Eye and FomF/DPS (rit resses are the best resses)

* the necrit, Ghostmirror Light is quite bad (take Signet of lost souls instead), Lively was Naomei is EXTREMELY bad (FomF/DPS) and Spirit Light Weapon + Spirit Transfer isn't worlds best combo, SLW is some sort of regeneration, why would you do that when you've got an armada of superheals at your disposal? i'd advise you to replace SLW with Icy Veins, Xinrae's Weapon or Weapon of Remedy.

* the necmonk, since your 2nd mesmer got rebirth with FC, why get a protter that should be protting to cast a long-cast energy-killing res that also immobilises the ressed one? Besides that, not bad, would advise you to look at doing that job with the E/Mo ERprotter - the Nec serves better as necresto, orders or support than as protter.

* the MM, since it's a bomber, don't even TRY to use Bone Fiends - they will explode nicely out of enemy range, and thus deal 0 damage, use Shambling horrors (double boom, bleeding), Bone Horrors (effective grunts) or maybe even Vamp Horrors (healing talibs, always fun).
I've also got a little problem with Go For the Eyes - a Nova bombah should be casting non-stop, and not wand for adrenaline, Never Surrender and Stand your Ground are better anyways if you're not a paragon.

* the SoS channeler, again Lively was Naomei is rubbish - FomF or DPS - Spirit Rift isn't too good on heroes, Ancestor's Rage is better, that or drop Spirit to flesh for it.

* SoGM summoner, Explosive Growth seems a bit ineffective - he should be backline - so maybe it's a good idea to put Dulled Weapon or Armor of Unfeeling on that spot.

* the Esurge mesmer, well...dunno, for some reason i've got something against spiker mesmers while other classes (RoJ smiter) do the job better, but if you like it, be my guest (am advising you to look at the Panic mesmer though)

aspi · Mar 22, 2011, 06:14 PM // 18:14

deadfalk, what is so wrong with ghostmirror light? Besides the heroes using it on minions it is a pretty nice skill to bring with spirits in earshot.

Xenomortis · Mar 22, 2011, 06:20 PM // 18:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by aspi

deadfalk, what is so wrong with ghostmirror light? Besides the heroes using it on minions it is a pretty nice skill to bring with spirits in earshot.

The bar has four single target heals and Ghostmirror is the weakest of the lot.
I'd probably cut Transfer to.
Also it needs more Kaolai.

Voodoo Rage · Mar 22, 2011, 06:54 PM // 18:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deadfalk

* SoGM summoner, Explosive Growth seems a bit ineffective - he should be backline

Agreed, explosive Growth is really only effective if you are raising lots of minions in the middle of a mob of monsters. Spirits should be raised far out of range of enemies that the spell would ever damage. (plus a Communing rit isn't raising that may spirits in the first place).

Deadfalk · Mar 22, 2011, 08:09 PM // 20:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by aspi

deadfalk, what is so wrong with ghostmirror light? Besides the heroes using it on minions it is a pretty nice skill to bring with spirits in earshot.

It's weaker then it's counterparts AND other ally-targeting, THE recipe for disaster, because hero AI will force them to see GL on equal or higher foot as the other heals (Transfer, Mend, Light) that all are better, okay, GL heals two at once, but the AI wrecks the sparce use it has.

Bringer Of Fury · Mar 23, 2011, 03:07 PM // 15:07

Someone mentioned a winter + conflag build so i made a go at it, haven't tried it yet but might be fun, just need lots of +10 vs cold insignias.

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distilledwill · Mar 23, 2011, 03:18 PM // 15:18

Nice

I'd be tempted to have Spinal Shivers in there - interupts on cold damage afterall!

Deadfalk · Mar 23, 2011, 05:19 PM // 17:19

Why conwinter when there's nothing specific to ice? conflag works just as well with Mantra of flame and flamebound insigs, right?

spray04 · Mar 23, 2011, 05:31 PM // 17:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deadfalk

Why conwinter when there's nothing specific to ice? conflag works just as well with Mantra of flame and flamebound insigs, right?

Conflag converts physical to fire; winter converts elemental to cold. Without winter, you're still getting hurt by elemental stuff.

Deadfalk · Mar 23, 2011, 05:35 PM // 17:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by spray04

Conflag converts physical to fire; winter converts elemental to cold. Without winter, you're still getting hurt by elemental stuff.

oops, my mistake

- thought it was all damage -> fire xD

I'll just go to my 'lil corner now

spray04 · Mar 23, 2011, 05:47 PM // 17:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

WNWN is actually pretty reliable - heroes use it frequently enough to merit it; the only issue is that the energy gain is pretty small for 15 second recharge (better on a Mes primary though).
A target that is moving isn't attacking nor using a skill. A target that has just finished casting is not attacking nor using a skill.

And there's nothing inherently wrong with bringing SS with Ineptitude, apart from the fact you shouldn't be bringing SS.

Actually, WNWN is when the enemy is not casting a SPELL nor attacking; meaning it also works if the enemy is using a skill that's not a spell.

And how is there nothing inherently wrong with bringing SS with Ineptitude? SS does not trigger on failed attacks, so Ineptitude is preventing SS from triggering. Mutually conflicting = inherently wrong.

Xenomortis · Mar 23, 2011, 06:15 PM // 18:15

SS triggers on any attack, whether it misses or hits.
Ineptitude deals some damage and causes blind. There is no conflict.

Remember that Ineptitude does not interrupt.

I Nathanos I · Mar 23, 2011, 06:44 PM // 18:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clord

Awesome. I cleared Emperor's Palace like it was nothing with this.

Cool

I did minor changes/tweaks, here's a screenshot-FoW HM :

Cheers.

spray04 · Mar 23, 2011, 06:49 PM // 18:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

SS triggers on any attack, whether it misses or hits.
Ineptitude deals some damage and causes blind. There is no conflict.

Remember that Ineptitude does not interrupt.

SS does not trigger on interrupted attacks, go see for yourself. As for Ineptitude, we're talking about the Ineptitude Mesmer in general, who does carry plenty of attack interrupts.

Xenomortis · Mar 23, 2011, 06:52 PM // 18:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by spray04

SS does not trigger on interrupted attacks, go see for yourself. As for Ineptitude, we're talking about the Ineptitude Mesmer in general, who does carry plenty of attack interrupts.

An attack that is interrupted doesn't count as a completed action so no, SS won't trigger. But that wasn't my argument was it? Congratulations on moving the goalposts.

I'm not sure I would be bringing Clumsiness on an Illusion Mesmer, I'd have to tweak around with builds, but I wouldn't mind missing the odd SS trigger if I get more damage from Wandering Eye.

spray04 · Mar 23, 2011, 06:55 PM // 18:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

An attack that is interrupted doesn't count as a completed action so no, SS won't trigger. But that wasn't my argument was it? Congratulations on moving the goalposts.

I'm not sure I would be bringing Clumsiness on an Illusion Mesmer, I'd have to tweak around with builds, but I wouldn't mind missing the odd SS trigger if I get more damage from Wandering Eye.

Ok, so your argument was that SS and Ineptitude does not conflict; my argument is SS and Ineptitude MESMER conflicts; we're both right, good now?

There's also Signet of Clumsiness on that mesmer. Most people now are also running it alongside a Panic mesmer - way too many interrupts for SS to be good.

Deadfalk · Mar 23, 2011, 08:03 PM // 20:03

Keep in mind Wandering Eye, clumsiness and SoClumsiness deal more damage then SS does, and provide more defense, it conflicts, but it's worth the conflict; more damage, and defense on the cost of 3-6 ss triggers that together wouldn't deal as much damage as the aforementioned deal.

Xenomortis · Mar 23, 2011, 10:57 PM // 22:57

Don't beat a dead horse.
Thank you.

Aly Lightningstorm · Mar 24, 2011, 01:25 PM // 13:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deadfalk

i've got something against spiker mesmers while other classes (RoJ smiter) do the job better

Disagree. Mesmers are the strongest nukers in the game. E-surge is better than Ray of Judgement. Especially for heroes. Since they're bad at choosing targets and bad at snaring.

RoJ has adjacent range and causes scatter. E-surge has nearby range and there's no way to run from the damage it does, because all the damage comes instantly after the spell has been cast. And on top of that, RoJ has a 20 second recharge, and e-surge is about 8-11 seconds (depending on how many points you put in fast casting).

So.. I'd go with the mesmer instead of the smite monk... unless you have some reliable way of snaring the enemies inside the RoJ.