Curse

HigherMinion · Jul 20, 2012, 08:38 AM // 08:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daesu

As for Necros, I would vote it to second place. MoP damage is great but the problem with MoP is you have to ball your opponents and unless you are playing with another human melee who is good with balling, you are not going to get much balling skills from mere hero AI.

Did you notice mobs reset to a nice ball by themselves? Just a few procs with MoP and you deal more damage than any other AP bar.

Daesu · Jul 20, 2012, 03:29 PM // 15:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by HigherMinion

Did you notice mobs reset to a nice ball by themselves? Just a few procs with MoP and you deal more damage than any other AP bar.

Not really and I have tried Markway before, some foes do slip past the dervishes and into your casters. Melonni is no EFGJack.

If they ball up the enemies nicely for you everytime, then you should make a video.

HigherMinion · Jul 20, 2012, 03:52 PM // 15:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daesu

Not really and I have tried Markway before, some foes do slip past the dervishes and into your casters. Melonni is no EFGJack.

If they ball up the enemies nicely for you everytime, then you should make a video.

It doesn't require perfect balls to out-perform the other AP bars.

Daesu · Jul 20, 2012, 05:18 PM // 17:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by HigherMinion

It doesn't require perfect balls to out-perform the other AP bars.

So sometimes you may outperform, but on other times, you may not. That's the problem with melee heroes AI-dependent MoP while double CoP and EVAS DPS are more consistent.

Spiritz · Jul 20, 2012, 05:23 PM // 17:23

Personally i prefer necro - the idea of having 2 evas via mesmer i feel is a bit wasted - echo+evas uses quite a bit of energy and if you`re using ap correctly things should die quite fast and you wont need to waste energy.Also consider AP recharges skills so as a necro i can easily pull off evas on 1 foe an before the evas goes i can get another up on a new target - ive had 3 evas running around which was quite funny.
Necros are also gd for the energy pool and unless you go a bit stupid and use high cost hexes - you shouldnt really run out of energy.
Only thing i find and its nothing to do with the players class but the daft hero/hench ai - both like to stand behind you , especially if casters and often you`re in range for soulreaping ( plus the extra off AP ) and they are not and they seem to get low on energy because of that.

Daesu · Jul 20, 2012, 05:44 PM // 17:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spiritz

Personally i prefer necro - the idea of having 2 evas via mesmer i feel is a bit wasted - echo+evas uses quite a bit of energy and if you`re using ap correctly things should die quite fast and you wont need to waste energy.

Actually you don't use up a lot of energy if you know how to play an AP mesmer because Auspicious Incantation returns about 23e (with 6+1 inspiration) everytime you use it with arcane echo. Furthermore, AP recharges AI and returns 17e each kill so you can keep this up for a long time. Max EVAS stays around for up to 15s (30s for charrs), if current target dies, they continue to attack the next foe so their damage accumulates, not a waste at all.

Quote:

Also consider AP recharges skills so as a necro i can easily pull off evas on 1 foe an before the evas goes i can get another up on a new target - ive had 3 evas running around which was quite funny.

Same thing with a mesmer except double of that.

Drk Dervish · Jul 20, 2012, 05:56 PM // 17:56

Thx for the feedback YMLD it is a good skill to get for the bar going to farm some title pts hehe. I haven't try other professional other then mes and sin on AP. No doubt each profession got pro and cons as OP listed.

As mes and for echo EVAS yes it does eat energy but what i been doing is I'll echo Evas in beginning of the fight. But at the middle of it (~2 AP) round into it most of the foe is ~50-60% hp then I start Echoing AP and not EVAS. The energy coming back is just crazy. At that point its pretty much just back to back AP + EVAS. 3 EVAS.. I been getting 4-5 on average running around, and 6-7+ vs charr.

Daesu · Jul 20, 2012, 06:17 PM // 18:17

The AP mesmer build is quite flexible and there are many ways which you can vary based on the situation.

Besides what Drk Dervish posted, you can also choose to echo CoP instead of EVAS. This means that, even though it is problematic if your AP is removed, you still have many options available for you to attack. You can also choose to echo AI itself if you really need the energy. With a high fast casting level, your mesmer spells like AI and CoP would recharge faster even without AP. My mesmer has 11+2 FC so my echoed AI and CoP can be used twice before arcane echo reverts back.

Premium Unleaded · Jul 20, 2012, 06:31 PM // 18:31

I would sooner swap out YMLAD than EVAS for CoP tbh on a mes AP bar. FH is the real star of the AP caller concept because the instant ~180 damage is what effectively guarantees the chain cycles over, barring any bad luck.

Daesu · Jul 20, 2012, 07:08 PM // 19:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Premium Unleaded

I would sooner swap out YMLAD than EVAS for CoP tbh on a mes AP bar. FH is the real star of the AP caller concept because the instant ~180 damage is what effectively guarantees the chain cycles over, barring any bad luck.

I know what you mean. However, the biggest drawback of FH is the 50% hp requirement so it still needs skills like CoP and EVAS to bring hp down to half.

HigherMinion · Jul 21, 2012, 09:22 AM // 09:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daesu

I know what you mean. However, the biggest drawback of FH is the 50% hp requirement so it still needs skills like CoP and EVAS to bring hp down to half.

"You Never Fight Alone!"... Just reiterating for you.

Gabs88 · Jul 21, 2012, 10:03 AM // 10:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by HigherMinion

It doesn't require perfect balls to out-perform the other AP bars.

Bullshit lol. Markway blows, it's like rolling a dice sometimes getting a 1 or 2 and other times getting a 5 or 6. Usually something in between.

Meanwhile, there's other AP caller builds out there who get only 4's, 5's and 6's never striking out never having trouble.

Relyk · Jul 21, 2012, 10:41 AM // 10:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gabs88

Bullshit lol. Markway blows, it's like rolling a dice sometimes getting a 1 or 2 and other times getting a 5 or 6. Usually something in between.

Meanwhile, there's other AP caller builds out there who get only 4's, 5's and 6's never striking out never having trouble.

I don't think you followed through with your analogy correctly.

Kunder · Jul 21, 2012, 03:52 PM // 15:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gabs88

Bullshit lol. Markway blows, it's like rolling a dice sometimes getting a 1 or 2 and other times getting a 5 or 6. Usually something in between.

Meanwhile, there's other AP caller builds out there who get only 4's, 5's and 6's never striking out never having trouble.

No. Its more like, all normal AP builds get 6s. AP builds with Arcane Echo get 10s (in normal play I estimate about ~50% more EVAS usage, you certainly don't get 100% more due to casting time restrictions). AP builds with MoP get 7s just casting MoP at will, with the potential for 15s if you take the time to ball a bit vs very dangerous mobs.

I have no idea about what markway is, but the problem with most PvE-ways is that they are built by idiots, so that may be your problem.

Daesu · Jul 21, 2012, 05:04 PM // 17:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by HigherMinion

"You Never Fight Alone!"... Just reiterating for you.

That doesn't invalidate anything I just said.

Drk Dervish · Jul 24, 2012, 07:19 PM // 19:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kunder

No. Its more like, all normal AP builds get 6s. AP builds with Arcane Echo get 10s (in normal play I estimate about ~50% more EVAS usage, you certainly don't get 100% more due to casting time restrictions). AP builds with MoP get 7s just casting MoP at will, with the potential for 15s if you take the time to ball a bit vs very dangerous mobs.

Maybe I'm doing something wrong but I get no where close to 7s with MoP on regular play. Is it in NM or in HM reason I'm asking I'm try to see what the max possible EVAS i can pump out in different profession. 15s just the cast time of AP+EVAS alone basically making it not possible.

But I do have to say e-management is much easy and smooth due to soul reaping.

Ps I'm not doing to compare overall bar damage or anything, but just for fun and snap shot.

HigherMinion · Jul 24, 2012, 10:16 PM // 22:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kunder

I have no idea about what markway is, but the problem with most PvE-ways is that they are built by idiots, so that may be your problem.

@Gabbs; Markway is instantly better than Discordway because of the heavy AoE damage and higher armoured characters beat defensefagging which is slow (and thus requires Fall Back to compensate)

Kunder · Jul 28, 2012, 03:35 PM // 15:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drk Dervish

Maybe I'm doing something wrong but I get no where close to 7s with MoP on regular play. Is it in NM or in HM reason I'm asking I'm try to see what the max possible EVAS i can pump out in different profession. 15s just the cast time of AP+EVAS alone basically making it not possible.

But I do have to say e-management is much easy and smooth due to soul reaping.

Ps I'm not doing to compare overall bar damage or anything, but just for fun and snap shot.

I'm not sure what you are talking about. I'm just assigning arbitrary scores to the builds.

Drk Dervish · Jul 28, 2012, 06:41 PM // 18:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kunder

I'm not sure what you are talking about. I'm just assigning arbitrary scores to the builds.

You say nerco with MOP can produce on average 7s (as i take it 7 EVAS). I played around and are no where near pumping out that many EVAS onto the field.

Premium Unleaded · Jul 28, 2012, 10:41 PM // 22:41

He is literally assigning scores, as in 7 points/6 points/10 points/15 points.