Curse

teotuf · Jan 07, 2007, 03:32 AM // 03:32

very very nice build koning! but still not enough to convince me to make an ele atm lol. so if i'm not wrong, avg with this build is about 12-13min? sounds a couple minutes faster than vwk rits :P

but for me, i won't go for a solo build unless there are builds that can do all smites (and only smites) in less tahn 10 min, or smites+aatxes in less than 20 min. because a 10 min smite solo is just not as good as an 10 min duo for smite + aatxes in terms of profits and fun - more lonely and 500 more gold entry fee.

VERY IMPORTANT QUESTION THOUGH!
can you tank aatxes with this build? what about kill them? what if they had weakness?

Evilsod · Jan 07, 2007, 04:20 AM // 04:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by bored-.-bored

Time to get Sandstrom before they nerf it becasue sandstorm is in pritty much all the ele builds around atm

Why will they nerf Sandstorm? Its a nearby DoTAoE that gets its bonus damage if your dumb enough to stand in it and attack, its the ONLY spell of its type to actually be worth using. As far as PvP in concerned this is more annoying than deadly. As far as PvE is concerned Searing Flames is a better choice since it synergies with They're on Fire.

I'm gonna give this a go tomorrow, US have favour atm so i can't now

As for Aatxe..... no. They hit for ~300 to a caster on a critical. If you use Stoneflesh, aka immunity to crits they still hit for at least 100. Reduced to maybe 50 minumum through Mantra. PLus they'd never die in 1 round... too much health.

Xiaxhou of Trinity · Jan 07, 2007, 09:12 AM // 09:12

If you wanted to tank the aataxes, you could throw on kinetic and or armor of earth, but then you'd have no offense. You'd have to rely on Sandstorm to do most of your dmg, and it will take a while to wipe out all that health those aataxes have. Don't forget their natural regen= more time spent.

kicks66 · Jan 07, 2007, 09:50 AM // 09:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by teotuf

very very nice build koning! but still not enough to convince me to make an ele atm lol. so if i'm not wrong, avg with this build is about 12-13min? sounds a couple minutes faster than vwk rits :P

but for me, i won't go for a solo build unless there are builds that can do all smites (and only smites) in less tahn 10 min, or smites+aatxes in less than 20 min. because a 10 min smite solo is just not as good as an 10 min duo for smite + aatxes in terms of profits and fun - more lonely and 500 more gold entry fee.

VERY IMPORTANT QUESTION THOUGH!
can you tank aatxes with this build? what about kill them? what if they had weakness?

what build do you duo with to do aatxes+smites in 10 mins? or even 20 mins?

daraaksii · Jan 07, 2007, 10:01 AM // 10:01

Omg.... That's very nice! Will try it when I'll get my Sandstorm!

AscalonWarrior · Jan 07, 2007, 10:06 AM // 10:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by kicks66

what build do you duo with to do aatxes+smites in 10 mins? or even 20 mins?

I don't think anymore but duo monks could, Smiter and SB monk.

Koning · Jan 07, 2007, 10:18 AM // 10:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by kicks66

what build do you duo with to do aatxes+smites in 10 mins? or even 20 mins?

I think he's referring to the bodyblock tactic. Luring all the graspings+aatxes+ smites towards a tight spot, necro behind, monk b4 him making sure he blocks enemies, necro trows couple of ss in group, enemies wont run away because they see necro (but they stop attacking).

about the flame djinn's haste run skill, its not that good. its 0.75 cast time and cannot be up all the time (+ you need fire magic, alot more than air)

the aatxes hit me indeed for 30-60 with mantra stonestriker and aura on (lol know it because of the stupid rubberbanding

, never had that b4 the 'nerf')

and I think its even possible to do this around 10 minutes or less (im at 12 min now and it feels like it can be done faster), if you can do all the graspings together and get out of the labyrinth fast. its always about 4.5-5 min till i reach the smites.

AscalonWarrior · Jan 07, 2007, 10:19 AM // 10:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by kicks66

what build do you duo with to do aatxes+smites in 10 mins? or even 20 mins?

I don't think anymore but duo monks could, Smiter and SB monk.

Carboplatin · Jan 07, 2007, 10:41 AM // 10:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Koning

I think he's referring to the bodyblock tactic. Luring all the graspings+aatxes+ smites towards a tight spot, necro behind, monk b4 him making sure he blocks enemies, necro trows couple of ss in group, enemies wont run away because they see necro (but they stop attacking).

about the flame djinn's haste run skill, its not that good. its 0.75 cast time and cannot be up all the time (+ you need fire magic, alot more than air)

the aatxes hit me indeed for 30-60 with mantra stonestriker and aura on (lol know it because of the stupid rubberbanding

, never had that b4 the 'nerf')

and I think its even possible to do this around 10 minutes or less (im at 12 min now and it feels like it can be done faster), if you can do all the graspings together and get out of the labyrinth fast. its always about 4.5-5 min till i reach the smites.

definitely doable for 10 min runs. still working on pull all the darknesses at once, i usually do them in two batches. but once i pull them i have a 17 sec storm djinn that can get me to the smites in on shot, no more waiting since they loose aggro at the steps.

dont feel no pain · Jan 07, 2007, 10:48 AM // 10:48

Im working on a good (no factions or nightfall skills) only fire build..... does anyone want a new thread, so far my build has instant kill in 4 secs but i want to remove m shower for something else, im almost there on working it out. (so you dont have to wait 60 secs), there are alot of ele Uw builds, i just though using the orignal skills would be nice.

Koning · Jan 07, 2007, 12:33 PM // 12:33

I think its better to keep brainstorming here first untill you fully figured it out. (with fire you need meteor showers KD to prevent em from running i think)

I just did a very bad run in only 13 min, meaning that if things go perfect (a NM popped up so i had to use aftershock quickly, making smites run. i also had to w8 for patrols of coldfires and the grasping patrol in 2nd room which had a NM in it) its VERY doable in like 10 min. I blocked the graspings in the little spot right of the stairs (thnx to grolubao for giving those spots) which maked sure they all died in less than 10 sec without running. If somehow you could lure all the graspings that would be perfect. (i killed the first group of smites under 6 min now...)

Xethrion · Jan 07, 2007, 02:26 PM // 14:26

That sounds interesting.. Is the spot you're talking about the little niche to the right of the right set of stairs at the beginning?

And as for combining darknesses, it's kinda hard, cos you have AV/SV's duration to have to attend to..

kicks66 · Jan 07, 2007, 02:48 PM // 14:48

when you all fight graspings, do you cast SV before you aggro or as soon as youve aggroed? i always find it runs out just as they move away to regen, then i have to attempt to cast stonflesh etc whilst being interrupted.

teotuf · Jan 07, 2007, 03:26 PM // 15:26

oh also another question guys, if you aggro colds, can you get away still?

here is why i'm asking these questions:

the monk and necro duo with body block that i proposed a while ago is faster than most other duos, yet the speed is limited because colds have to be killed (and that is why I kind of abandoned that thread). with duo monks, it is IMO the fastest duo out there, which can do the run in 11 min avg if the monk brings IW instead of SB, still is only 11 min avg, about the same as prenerf.

but as most duos kill the aatxes, and all the aatxes and all of the smites drop about the same amount of ectos, it's only reasonable to use a duo build if it kills aatxes AND smites in the time a solo build kills the smite only, or, half of the time if the solo kills both the aatxes and the smites.

eles here, don't kill the aatxes, and if they can do the smite only run in 10 min on AVG, not a fluke, it is then the most profitable run out there. similarly, if there is a duo that can do both smties and aatxes in that 10 min, the the duo is more profitable (cuz you pay 500g instead of 1k, but you get the same amount of ectos.)

however, here is the key, what is limiting the speed of all these runs to about 11-12 min? i mean, prenerf, thats about the speed too. this ele build, which takes down the smites SOOOO fast, seems like still can't break the 11-12 min mark, why? because the answer is not the killing speed (though it does matter), but instead the waiting for the colds patrols.

so i'm trying now to find a duo build that each is a smite only build, but can take on the aatxes together at a profitable speed, but the main part is, that one of the two is able to aggro the colds, tank them, and yet break away from them on cue. so what then happens is that the two takes on the first two chambers, killing all the aatxes (which has the same chance of ecto drop as an entire smites only run), and then moves on to the smites. but one's job is to kill the smties (duh), but the other is to aggro the colds first, tank the colds while the other kills the smites, and break away as soon as the other finishes killing and is clear of the colds. this rids the run of the waiting time for the cold patrols.

and so far, this is the only ele build that i think is remotely capable of this idea.

Koning · Jan 07, 2007, 03:38 PM // 15:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by kicks66

when you all fight graspings, do you cast SV before you aggro or as soon as youve aggroed? i always find it runs out just as they move away to regen, then i have to attempt to cast stonflesh etc whilst being interrupted.

always cast it b4 you go in, when it runs out when they ran away, they always start with a distracting blow when they come back. so don't immediatly cast aftershock. (when you block em in the corner they die cause of sandstorm and you also won't get interrupted)

It is possible to get away with the colds, just keep running with mantra + stonestriker + storm djinn, sometimes you make it, sometimes not...

speedy21589 · Jan 07, 2007, 04:36 PM // 16:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Koning

always cast it b4 you go in, when it runs out when they ran away, they always start with a distracting blow when they come back. so don't immediatly cast aftershock. (when you block em in the corner they die cause of sandstorm and you also won't get interrupted)

It is possible to get away with the colds, just keep running with mantra + stonestriker + storm djinn, sometimes you make it, sometimes not...

Well, its time for me to hop back into the posting. Everybody seems to want to maximize efficiency on the run. Clearly one of the bottlenecks is clearing the chamber; typically you have to pull the graspings in 2 aggros, and it requires some waiting around for them to group up properly, giving an average clear time of 4 to 5 minutes. I have, however, figured out a route that allows me to aggro all 10 graspings at once, giving me a clear time of 2 minutes, give or take. This route is very risky, and I have died quite a few times trying it.

Unlike conventional wisdom, I do not put up Stoneflesh aura or SV (im using 10 illusion magic, btw), before pulling graspings for this. I start with the group on the right. After they come all the way down from the upper staircase, I give them about 3 seconds, then I put up stone striker, MoE, and storm djinns, and pull them to the center of the starting area. I let them waste distracting blows, and then put up Stoneflesh. By this point, the other two mobs have gathered on the left staircase, so now I put up storm djinns (again) and SV, and grab them, then run like hell back to the starting area. Proceed to massacre the 10.

Unfortunately, I don't believe its possible to bodyblock all of them in the crevice, because usually one of the groups won't follow me that far. Even so, much faster than 2 separate aggros that both are bodyblockable. Maybe I'll make a video of this pulling, as my explanation is probably somewhat difficult to follow.

I have yet to time a full run with this tactic, however, since I always seem to die when I start to time a run. A lot of time is still wasted waiting around for coldfire patrols in the ice wastes. In a good run I managed to clear ice wastes in about 5 minutes, i think. So I believe an 8 minute run is possible?

Edit: Just did a run with this, and some bad patrols in the ice wastes: ~11 minutes.
Edit: And another run, which I actually timed with a stopwatch: 9:34

Koning · Jan 07, 2007, 08:12 PM // 20:12

Wow I just tried what you said: Amazing. this really works very good, luring all graspings at once. It also isn't really that hard, if you keep in mind that graspings only interrupt when you come at ya. 1.30 and all graspings dead, 3 min ready to crush smites

this is cool and really shapes time off the run.

10 min runs are very doable

(if spawn are good even less)

those coldfires are still annoying me

w0lla · Jan 07, 2007, 08:50 PM // 20:50

nice build dude, used to run the VwK rit build before and after the nerf, but this is just so much faster, did a run a moment ago, took me 11mins

speedy21589 · Jan 07, 2007, 08:54 PM // 20:54

I just did some more runs, and it seems you can pull all the graspings into the right hand crevice using my technique. Now I just need to figure out how to get around the coldfires faster ><

onerabbit · Jan 07, 2007, 09:17 PM // 21:17

taking my ele through Nf so cap sand storm OMG!
may aswell cap SF aswell.
what song was that btw, was wicked xD
oh yeh, the video was evn better!
Great build.