Curse

Moonstruck Muse · Feb 12, 2009, 12:54 AM // 00:54

Ok, so Im just starting to 600. I get the idea, it's pretty basic. And I know you can't always stay alive without [Shield of Absorption].

But here is my confusion; doesn't SoA reduce the dmg the smites deal? So therefore, if SoA is kept up long enough to reduce the dmg to 0 (which isn't hard in HM) doesn't that render the smiting skills [Retribution] and [Holy Wrath] useless when SoA is that powerful?

Someone said that the reason is works is because the smites trigger before SoA. I just want to double check that that is true? What's the order all these enchantments on you take effect? (I know Spirit Bond is before Protective Spirit, at least.)

I mean.. logically, it should render them useless, right? Because I know that those two smiting skills aren't damage delt, but damage received (hence why the low armor and why people don't SF 600). But then game mechanics aren't always logical.

Sorry, I just am.. very confused on this, and my poor guildie couldn't get me to understand it well, so I thought maybe a rephrase would help.

Mice Eat Cheese · Feb 12, 2009, 01:06 AM // 01:06

From my understanding, this is the order of what happens with a 600:

1. 600 is hit by an attack, but the damage to the 600 is not dealt yet.
2. That damage is reduced to 10% of the 600's health due to [Protective Spirit]
3. 600 is healed by [Spirit Bond]
4. [Holy Wrath] and [Retribution] are triggered, causing damage to the attacker. The damage is 66% and 33% of the damage done to the 600 after [Protective Spirit].
5. The damage to the 600 (which has not been dealt yet) is reduced by [Shield of Absorption]
6. The 600 takes the reduced damage.

This also explains why Spirit Bond does not heal you to full health because you get healed before you take damage.

This is how I think it works from my own experience. Shield of Absorption is triggered last so the damage reduction happens after the damage from Holy Wrath and Retribution are dealt.

Moonstruck Muse · Feb 12, 2009, 01:10 AM // 01:10

Well, at least on the wiki it says that SB is before PS, because you can actually 600 with less than 600 hp (which is what I did on mes for a bit).

But if the smites do go up before SoA, then it would work.

Mice Eat Cheese · Feb 12, 2009, 01:13 AM // 01:13

Oh, yeah, forgot about that. SB does go before PS. Everything else seems right though.

Moonstruck Muse · Feb 12, 2009, 01:25 AM // 01:25

Okay. I actually went after some of those tengu and saw that even though I was down to 0dmg from SoA, they still died from smiting, so the smites are dealt before the SoA. So what you said was indeed right, it's just hard to notice (I think).

Thanks a lot for the help!

Speaking of the smites though... if you had a human smiter, and had them cast that [Ebon Battle Standard of Honor] (the one used on SF sins), would that increase the dmg done by Ret & HW? The idea kinda hit me just now and I figured it'd be best to ask here!

Thanks again so much!

Mice Eat Cheese · Feb 12, 2009, 01:36 AM // 01:36

This one I am not too sure about. From the wiki, it states:

"This skill does not affect armor-ignoring spell damage, but will increase other armor-ignoring damage, such as from Death Blossom's AoE."

From this, I would say that it would not work with Retribution and Holy Wrath since the damage from them is armor-ignoring.

Also, I would find it hard as a Smiter to have 10 energy to cast the spell (though I guess someone else could bring it).

Might be worth some testing though, but I don't think it'd affect them.

Spiritz · Feb 12, 2009, 02:05 AM // 02:05

it doesnt work - i tried it once before using necrosis and [["By Ural's Hammer"] - i got extra dmg only from buh , eboh didnt make any difference

Moonstruck Muse · Feb 12, 2009, 02:18 AM // 02:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spiritz

it doesnt work - i tried it once before using necrosis and by umbriels hammer - i got extra dmg only from buh , eboh didnt make any difference

Thanks for the info on Hammer though, very good.

Incandecree · Feb 12, 2009, 02:28 PM // 14:28

You definitely can increase the damage from Retribution and Holy Wrath with By Ural's Hammer.

Spiritz · Feb 12, 2009, 03:52 PM // 15:52

Ty marty - was very early in uk when i did post and 1/2 asleep and tossin a coin to its name doesnt work lol.

Buh i love using on a/e sliver sin - has its uses instead of intensity.

random.name · Feb 12, 2009, 04:44 PM // 16:44

Doesnt reversal of damage and retribution trigger shield of judgement?

Spiritz · Feb 12, 2009, 08:55 PM // 20:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by random.name

Doesnt reversal of damage and retribution trigger shield of judgement?

Where did u get reversal of damage from :S

retribution wont trigger soj - anyone striking target ally with an attack and retribution doesnt strike enemy.
think same for reversal of damage

Moonstruck Muse · Feb 13, 2009, 01:34 AM // 01:34

So now here is my question regarding the smites & Ural's.... Do you only need to have Ural's up when you cast the smites initially, or do you need it up all the time? I'm guessing all the time but I wanted to double check.

Spiritz · Feb 13, 2009, 02:37 AM // 02:37

gd question - i dont think it will work on the smiter as their bonds are pre cast , i assumed you meant for 600 to use

MisterB · Feb 13, 2009, 02:41 AM // 02:41

[By Ural's Hammer] only increases damage while it is active.