Curse

Mad5cout · Jan 25, 2007, 04:22 AM // 04:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeKnowMo

This build has been posted twice before about 2 months ago:
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10076524
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10075533

It worked fine then and it works fine now. If the new patch reduces SF burn duration that may change.

Regarding equipment: A fire offhand is essential. You won't be getting the full benefit from a shield anyway.
A +5e Furious Spear of enchanting is ideal as your attack weapon. The faster attack rate compared to a wand helps build adrenaline up faster for shouts. The occasional bonus adrenaline from the furious mod helps too.

This way you start out at 47e (w/o radiant insignias) instead of 30e.

Switch out Never Give Up for Anthem of Flame.

To the sceptics: Try running this build before you dismiss it.

Thanks for the links. I had not seen them. In any case, those threads were not linked in the builds directory and this thread was to serve as a discussion for the build I posted there.

Also, the second build doesn't look functional. I noticed the one I have posted is very close to the one you had up. I still think that Anthem of Flame is pretty useless when you got SF right there. To each their own but I hope my thought process and explainations were helpful to you.

carbajac · Jan 25, 2007, 09:48 AM // 09:48

There was a thread for a build in another forum which tried to cross professions in an extreme similar to this one, one of the mods said something to the effect that PUGs and RA has developed a sense of trying to do everything yourself in players. This seems like one of those to me. Sure, your build can probably pump out some decent damage, but it just might be more effective to take a different approach.

The paragons have so many ways to start someone aflame, if you can keep your enemies on fire, your sf ele will have a field day and output a lot more damage than your build can no matter what your numbers.

Spend your time putting up Blazing Finale, anthem of flame, and keeping "They're on Fire" on your team, and if this is for PvE, put Burning Refrain on your warrior and have him hack away at Shiro. This is a team game not "My SF Paragon is better than your SF Ele, don't believe me, let's 1v1."

Also, where's your rez? Please don't run this in RA...please.

Skylancer · Jan 25, 2007, 02:33 PM // 14:33

I use:

Attributes:
Leadership 16 (12+3+1)
Fire Magic 10
Spearmastery 8

Skills:
[card]Wild Throw[/card][card]Anthem of Flame[/card][card]"They're on Fire!"[/card][card]Fireball[/card][card]Mark of Rodgort[/card][card]Leader's Comfort[/card][card]Glowing Signet[/card][card]Signet of Return[/card]

Cast Mark of Rodgort, (fireball for mobs, can be swapped with [skill=text]Liquid Flame[/skill]), ToF, Glowing Signet etc. etc.

To keep them burning constantly at a low energy cost simply use a spear with a fiery spearhead, while they have Mark of Rodgort on them.

Simple & effective, works for me.

Skylancer

Milan-V · Jan 25, 2007, 02:56 PM // 14:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skylancer

I use:

Attributes:
Leadership 16 (12+3+1)
Fire Magic 10
Spearmastery 8

Skills:
[card]Wild Throw[/card][card]Anthem of Flame[/card][card]"They're on Fire!"[/card][card]Fireball[/card][card]Mark of Rodgort[/card][card]Leader's Comfort[/card][card]Glowing Signet[/card][card]Signet of Return[/card]

Cast Mark of Rodgort, (fireball for mobs, can be swapped with [skill=text]Liquid Flame[/skill]), ToF, Glowing Signet etc. etc.

To keep them burning constantly at a low energy cost simply use a spear with a fiery spearhead, while they have Mark of Rodgort on them.

Simple & effective, works for me.

Skylancer

Now that works better I guess.

Mad5cout · Jan 25, 2007, 03:04 PM // 15:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by carbajac

There was a thread for a build in another forum which tried to cross professions in an extreme similar to this one, one of the mods said something to the effect that PUGs and RA has developed a sense of trying to do everything yourself in players. This seems like one of those to me. Sure, your build can probably pump out some decent damage, but it just might be more effective to take a different approach.

The paragons have so many ways to start someone aflame, if you can keep your enemies on fire, your sf ele will have a field day and output a lot more damage than your build can no matter what your numbers.

Spend your time putting up Blazing Finale, anthem of flame, and keeping "They're on Fire" on your team, and if this is for PvE, put Burning Refrain on your warrior and have him hack away at Shiro. This is a team game not "My SF Paragon is better than your SF Ele, don't believe me, let's 1v1."

Also, where's your rez? Please don't run this in RA...please.

Okay, I am going to say this one last time. Even after the nerfs, there is no skill in the game that makes enemies burn longer and with a larger range with no trigger requirement than searing flames.

Values are with the maxed attribute of the skill with no runes:
Blazing Finale 3 sec, adjacent foes to target
Anthem of Flame 3 sec, only the foe attacked by allies
Mark of Rodgort 3 seconds and the enemies must be struck with fire damage first.
Mind Burn 6 seconds, WON'T WORK. Y? EXHAUSTION. You can't spam it.

SEARING FLAMES 6 seconds, NO trigger, No exhaustion, and you DO have enough energy.

How hard is that to understand. Why do all of you insist on switching out the skill for things that don't work as well? Why would I use Blazing Finale and Anthem of Flame for LESS burning, SLOWER recast time, and literally NO damage? Why use mark of rodgort when you have to cast an area fire damage skill to set it off? Mark of Rodgort cost just as much as SF does and doesn't set people on fire until you spend even more energy to cast a fire damage spell to set them on fire AND it doesn't burn them as long.

I am done explaining to people why do this instead of a pure paragon ToF build or using some other crappy ele skill to create burning for ToF. If you are dumb enough to go another route when this one does it better hands down, be my guest.

Am I really trying to do it all in one build? All this build does is create the most burning it can (in the most efficient way possible) and put ToF up... That's it. The damage from SF is a great bonus and my christmas gift to all of you.

typing big so you will actually see it this time>>> THE BUILD I POSTED HAS A SPOT FOR A RES SPELL. IT JUST DOESN'T HAVE A GRAPHIC. READ THE BUILD AND EXPLANATION BEFORE YOU COMMENT.

It would also be helpful for some of you to read the descriptions of the spells you are recommending before you assume their superiority...

Skylancer · Jan 25, 2007, 04:33 PM // 16:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mad5cout

Mark of Rodgort cost just as much as SF does and doesn't set people on fire until you spend even more energy to cast a fire damage spell to set them on fire AND it doesn't burn them as long.

Not being a smartass here, but practically Mark of Rodgort causes burning for 27 sec (10 Fire mag.) IF you have a fiery spearhead on your spear, as stated above in my build. SF requires you to cast it again after the 6 seconds 'on fire' have worn of, draining another 15e.

So the 15e you lose with Mark of Rodgort will only be once every 27 sec.
While the 15e you lose with SF will be once every 6 sec.
Same effect but costs less energy. (and you can use another elite skill)

clawofcrimson · Jan 25, 2007, 07:16 PM // 19:16

skylance,

SF>MOR... the ability to concentrate the burn is the valuable part...

besides...your build does not take advantage of any elite...

Mad5cout · Jan 25, 2007, 07:49 PM // 19:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skylancer

Not being a smartass here, but practically Mark of Rodgort causes burning for 27 sec (10 Fire mag.) IF you have a fiery spearhead on your spear, as stated above in my build. SF requires you to cast it again after the 6 seconds 'on fire' have worn of, draining another 15e.

So the 15e you lose with Mark of Rodgort will only be once every 27 sec.
While the 15e you lose with SF will be once every 6 sec.
Same effect but costs less energy. (and you can use another elite skill)

Okay, so I was unaware that MOR would start someone burning again when attacked more than once with fire damage. However, it matters not. Here is the weakness of what you propose. Using a firey spearhead would only set the one enemy you attack on fire. That defeats the purpose of the build. ToF is only effective if there are a lot of enemies on fire so that it provides the damage reduction for more than just one enemy. SF, is still a more energy efficient way to set multiple targets on fire than MOR or any other spell/skill for as long as possible.

BTW, the build accomidates to spam SF, that's the whole point. The energy is not a problem. So, again, why would you use MOR when you can do more burning and more damage and more damage reduction with SF?

Skylancer · Jan 25, 2007, 11:01 PM // 23:01

Yeah this build doesn't have an elite, but it works great without one so..

And indeed MOR only inflicts burning on 1 enemy when you hit them. I just target one enemy, hit once, target other, hit etc. etc. That way you can keep alot of foes burning even if they scatter.

But indeed energy is not the problem, only sharing thoughts ^_^

clawofcrimson · Jan 25, 2007, 11:42 PM // 23:42

i love MOR when im in pve with my heroes... works great when you can organize a team of four...

but in this build...(which already has enough micro management) I would rather take an aoe burn skill rather that ...target..switch...target ...switch...

and also ive noticed... not to repeatedly spam sf... you will quickly run out of energy... and the point is to keep burning going... so every few seconds will suffice...

Skylancer · Jan 26, 2007, 12:17 AM // 00:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by clawofcrimson

and also ive noticed... not to repeatedly spam sf... you will quickly run out of energy... and the point is to keep burning going... so every few seconds will suffice...

Hooray for MOR ^_^

I get your point.

Sutch · Jan 26, 2007, 04:14 AM // 04:14

I posted a build similar to this in another forum. It's kinda funny seeing as there were a lot of critics to ToF/SF builds there as well. Some people need to have a more open mind. You gotta understand, the main point here is to have a constant 53% party wide damage reduction. The extra damage from Searing Flames is just icing on the cake. Here's what I came up with and I seem to manage energy pretty well.

Leadership 16
Fire Magic 12
Command 4

Signet of Return
"They're on Fire"
Searing Flames
Glowing Signet
Fire Attunement
Glyph of Lesser Energy
Anthem of Flame
"Go for the Eyes"

Glyph of Lesser Energy is really important to have. You get 2 free Searing flames initially. Then you use both AoF, GftE, and Glowing Signet to maintain energy while waiting for Glyph of Lesser Energy to recharge. With this, I can spam Searing Flames pretty consistently.

Thom Bangalter · Jan 26, 2007, 05:39 AM // 05:39

Ok, I know this is going to sound crazy....

why don't you just bring a hero or 2 with searing flames, because the skill destroys mobs, instead of trying to justify running it on a character with 25 energy and 2 pips of regen? look, now you've freed up an elite spot on the paragon bar too.

Sutch · Jan 26, 2007, 06:11 AM // 06:11

I do run this build occasionally with 2 Searing Flame Heroes for even more distributed burning and tons more damage. But I don't have 30 energy, I have around 53 using attunement runes and radiant insignias. If you can combine damage reduction and good amounts of damage in one character, why not do it?
I don't see what's the problem. Mad5cout explained it pretty well already. I play in a lot of PUG's. Am I to demand there be SF Ele in every group I play with?

Thom Bangalter · Jan 26, 2007, 06:49 AM // 06:49

you mean there's not a sf ele in every group you play in?

When it gets to the point that you're using attunement runes, radiant insignia, and a caster offhand, it's time you roll an ele.

Govtmorgue · Jan 26, 2007, 07:50 AM // 07:50

Thom, you obviously have a hard time of grasping the point that a ele can not provide the damage reduction abilities of a Paragon with max leadership.

FoxBat · Jan 26, 2007, 08:23 AM // 08:23

Never give up isn't the greatest with.... 0 command.

Replace that with glyph of lesser E, obviously. Much better energy returns while you're at it.

P.S. 40/40 gear is key to SF Eles, that ups their damage output by 60%ish. And no, you don't have time to chuck a spear when the 1 second SF recharge triggers half the time, thanks to aftercast.

Necro primaries with soul reaping are a good choice in most of PvE if you're that worried about energy. Nonetheless, SF probably is the most reliable (pre-nerf) to make sure everything is burning to trigger ToF, if you are lacking SF eles for whatever reason, even if it's not the best way to pump out damage.

sumasage · Jan 27, 2007, 12:21 AM // 00:21

Can you clarify the attribute stat? I am assuming you are using 3 superior runes . That doesnt put you at that much health.

Currently raising a Paragon, i will try this build when i get all the required skills

Thom Bangalter · Jan 27, 2007, 12:28 AM // 00:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Govtmorgue

Thom, you obviously have a hard time of grasping the point that a ele can not provide the damage reduction abilities of a Paragon with max leadership.

That's why you bring a they're on fire paragon on your team if that's what you're going for, instead of running a shitty bar.

Govtmorgue · Jan 27, 2007, 10:36 PM // 22:36

We're talking PvE (I think at least), where damn near every group you get is gonna be a PUG. I can count the number of PUG's on my hand, and I play extensively, that an Ele on the team has even had SF. (If we're talking PvP, then yes get a SF ele and go more support than this build gives)