Curse

Tenebros · Apr 30, 2007, 06:45 PM // 18:45

I've been playing a Paragon/X character and have really liked its style and game play. Basically she's a ranged attacker that sets things on fire and then lowers the damage taken by her teammates from enemies on fire. I take a warrior, a monk and a pyro with me and we kick some butt.

Why do paragons rank so low on surveys? Why are there so few builds out there? I've played through the game with my other characters and think that this one is just as effective and fun (with the right team) as my others.

Anphobia · Apr 30, 2007, 06:49 PM // 18:49

Personally I've never ventured into the Paragon world because I hate all the armor apart from the FoW armor...and thats like stupidly expensive and hard to get.

If the armor isn't that good, I don't get a drive to play such a character, I like aesthetically pleasing gameplay!

Zedd Kun · Apr 30, 2007, 06:49 PM // 18:49

We already have a thread about this, go to PvE forum under Paragon, you'll find it there.

Seraphic Divinity · Apr 30, 2007, 06:58 PM // 18:58

mediocre damage out-put, mediocre defenses (unless going zergway), mediocre versatility.

All in all they're a poor choice at best... there are more effective classes out their, hence the 'para hate'.

What is a paragons ultimate purpose? To do mediocre damage while defending the team in a mediocre way? People don't generally want that. They generally want people who specialize in an area... like... damage... or... healing...

That's why people don't want the rits who specialize in damage -and- healing... they're good for all 'rit' spikes, but not much more than that.

Skuld · Apr 30, 2007, 07:08 PM // 19:08

Paragons are so damn overpowered its not funny.

Seraphic, you're an idiot.

Feathermoore Rep · Apr 30, 2007, 07:18 PM // 19:18

Paragons are basically the Cheerleaders of Guild Wars. Now seriously, how many people want to be a cheerleader.

And second i hate them because they have a low dmg weapon, yet they can hit harder and faster than a Ranger, which just isn't right. But this isn't a discussion on Rangers.

Also, they really are quite imbalanced. Anet will really need to carefully think about the Paragon skills they add in GWEN, otherwise a team of 8 Paragons maybe unstoppable again.

Is2r · Apr 30, 2007, 07:19 PM // 19:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anphobia

Personally I've never ventured into the Paragon world because I hate all the armor apart from the FoW armor...and thats like stupidly expensive and hard to get.

If the armor isn't that good, I don't get a drive to play such a character, I like aesthetically pleasing gameplay!

Ya i personally hate the armor to =/

Series · Apr 30, 2007, 07:32 PM // 19:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

Paragons are so damn overpowered its not funny.

Seraphic, you're an idiot.

Funniest thing I read all day. I literally rofl'd. If I were you, I wouldn't call others idiots.

Wildi · Apr 30, 2007, 07:32 PM // 19:32

when anet started balancing skill for 3+ paragons one paragon alone became weak, thats it

the motivation line is almost useless to a single paragon, in pve no team can bring 3+ paragons to keep your team alive and other classes have much more potential for damage with multi-target skills

bhavv · Apr 30, 2007, 07:36 PM // 19:36

Paragons are great if you know how to use them, all classes are.

Nekretaal · Apr 30, 2007, 07:37 PM // 19:37

Pargon Male armor has nipples and Paragon Female armor doesnt.

Who wants that in their group?? WHO???

Str0b0 · Apr 30, 2007, 07:37 PM // 19:37

I have yet to find a really effective paragon build. The closest I've come is the build I use on Morgahn which Zinger so kindly posted back towards the Nightfall release. It works fantastically, and is similar in concept to yours except we ditch the spear in favor of an axe. The armor is so gay I couldn't play a paragon because in the cut scenes I'd keep expecting my char to have a vicious lisp. Their damage is substandard compared to a dervish or warrior or even a ranger and their utility with shouts and chants is also substandard compared to some warrior shouts and some monk protection buffs. After the nerfs to some of the more useful shouts it's just not worth it to play one or to bring one along in a party.

Ensign · Apr 30, 2007, 07:48 PM // 19:48

Poor scalability against huge mobs of enemies.

That's really it TBH.

Peace,
-CxE

Tenebros · Apr 30, 2007, 08:05 PM // 20:05

Wow, those were some fast responses. I've played warrior and ele classes and certainly appreciate their damage skills. I grew a bit bored with the point and kill of the axe warrior and the maintain energy pyro world. I think the Paragon is an interesting mixture of the two really. While I'm not far enough into this one to determine if she will be godly, I certainly don't think she's worthless. Far from it. I'm learning more every day and can appreciate some subtleties. What's really boring is the attitudes people have against anything subtle. Point and kill gets old quick; I need a little finesse. Plus, I certainly don't put my players in based on the appearance of their armor. Besides, I think she looks pretty cute in her skimpy little outfit. I've got a burning spear or two for anyone who disagrees.

Str0b0 · Apr 30, 2007, 08:11 PM // 20:11

Finesse is one thing but there is no room for finesse when you have people shooting for masters and other such t itles. The name of the game there is efficiency which translates to DPS. Paragons don't have it and their buffs don't significantly increase it. Point and Kill gets it done in PvE where basically if you have a higher DPS output than the mob you're fighting then you win. I can assure you of one thing. She will not be godly. While the build you use, with Anthem of Flame, burning spear and They're on Fire more than likely, has some utility I can get the same thing from a protection monk and the protection monk will do a better job.

Auron of Neon · Apr 30, 2007, 08:12 PM // 20:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Series

Funniest thing I read all day. I literally rofl'd. If I were you, I wouldn't call others idiots.

Paragons have unlimited energy (to spam shit like Mirror, Shatterstorm, Rend/Gaze, Expel Hexes, etc etc), neverending IAS, mid-damage attacks easily boosted to stupid levels through insanely spammable attack skills, and to top it all off, 80 armor; allowing them to ignore the offense of the other team and wade into their backline and kill the monks. A team of 5 gons and 3 monks shouldn't be as nigh-invincible as they are. The most broken part atm is Leadership... if paragons weren't able to Mirror every single aegis that went up, they'd be balanced, but seeing as no real prot works against them, it's gg.

Skuld's right. They aren't anything near underpowered.

In PvE, 95% of their armor sucks and they get boring and ineffective unless you're running a gimmicky build like hammergon; couldn't stand playing paragon very long with nothing to look forward to.

Achilles Antony · Apr 30, 2007, 08:12 PM // 20:12

I tried a paragon during the nightfall preview event, and I ran one in HA when we tried a paragon spike. That was enough for me. In most cases, your sole purpose is to buff the other characters in your party. If you like playing that role, more power to you.

Skuld · Apr 30, 2007, 08:26 PM // 20:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Achilles Antony

I tried a paragon during the nightfall preview event, and I ran one in HA when we tried a paragon spike. That was enough for me. In most cases, your sole purpose is to buff the other characters in your party. If you like playing that role, more power to you.

A paragon is a warrior with a spear, and buffs on the side.

Series · Apr 30, 2007, 08:29 PM // 20:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auron of Neon

Paragons have unlimited energy (to spam shit like Mirror, Shatterstorm, Rend/Gaze, Expel Hexes, etc etc), neverending IAS, mid-damage attacks easily boosted to stupid levels through insanely spammable attack skills, and to top it all off, 80 armor; allowing them to ignore the offense of the other team and wade into their backline and kill the monks. A team of 5 gons and 3 monks shouldn't be as nigh-invincible as they are. The most broken part atm is Leadership... if paragons weren't able to Mirror every single aegis that went up, they'd be balanced, but seeing as no real prot works against them, it's gg.

Skuld's right. They aren't anything near underpowered.

Skuld called them insanely overpowered, not "anything near underpowered". That was what he said and it was by far the funniest thing I have read all day.

Unlimited energy? Please. Is that the new HA slander card? "OMFG THAT PROFESSION HAS UNLIMITED ENERGY IT NEEDS TO BE NERFED!!!" It seems like every profession has "unlimited" energy nowadays. Ha. Neverending IAS? Good! Spear is a crap weapon otherwise. Show me a good spear build that doesn't need an IAS of some sort. Insanely spammable attack skills? Do you have any justification in saying that they have "insanely spammable attack skills" and the other combat professions don't? What exactly makes the paragon attack skills more spammable than, say, a warrior? And you really think 80 armor lets them wade into the backline ignoring damage? Wow, thanks! I never thought of that! ...wait a minute... don't warriors have 80+ armor? Why aren't they completely invincible? Oh right, because you know nothing about the Paragon and are just pulling crap out of your ass.

Skuld and you are both wrong. All that sounds good in theory. Lets see it in practice. I have yet to see a good GvG guild run your "uber gon/monk" build. If it was invincible as you say it is, I bet people wouldn't pass up on it. But... they do. Well, the good players do at least.

SniperF0x · Apr 30, 2007, 08:34 PM // 20:34

Because a team of 8 paragons in HA means rape, they're so damn good when teamed up, but they may not be that good in PVE as a sole paragon though.
Also, their skills don't really protect from immense damage in PVE, while they can't really kill or dominate foes either, they're a bit of the midway.