Curse

LifeInfusion · May 08, 2008, 04:14 PM // 16:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by kostolomac

It's hard for the paragon to compete with warrior in dps due to the strength attribute imo , but being ranged is a good advantage.

strength only applies to attack skills.

Tyla · May 08, 2008, 04:33 PM // 16:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adja1005

I didn't suggest those two skills to remove, i suggested them as a possible way to help prevent Paragon's from using buffs. Re-read what i said.

And what do you do when the hexes get removed? Wait more time to reapply?
Paragons don't need adrenaline to be stupid with these buffs aswell.

Quote:

You assumed wrong. You stated Paragons are overpowered, i was pointing out that in groups they can be. But on their own their definately not.

This isn't the farming forum. Normal play implies you're using a full team anyway.
And since overpowered is usually a term built for builds that are too strong in PvP, since when is someone going to be using a 1 man GvG team? 1 man HA team?

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Well at this moment the "Paratrooper" build and your friends build could quite possibly be the same build, with slight variations. And when you compare Paragons to the other classes there just isn't that many solo builds for them.

That other build was using Blazing Finale as a damage tool.
And yeah, who cares about solo farming except for farmers? Make an Ele or something if you want to farm, or use a hero and use a variable.

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We've both gone semi off-topic but i wouldnt say we were ignorant for talking about farming builds in the general PvE section. Not when the OP asked for motivation to play a Paragon, some people might be more inclined to play a specific class if they knew there were working builds to solo bosses or areas as farming has become a big thing in GW.

There is a forum MADE for farming.

Quote:

Anet designed the game how they wanted it to be, what you or i think might be stupid is possibly perfectly valid for them.

My point still stands. If a company does something stupid, the playerbase will know. The playerbase decides some things for the game aswell, as without the playerbase there won't be a game.

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I didn't say that because of the two skills i mentioned Paragons are balanced, i merely mentioned them as a possible way to hinder the use of those unremovable buffs you were whining about.

Oh, so you DO agree with Paragons being overpowered!
Counters exist. Counters to those counters exist. And so on.

Quote:

Again you've missed the point. How can you say a single class is overpowered when it struggles to solo areas or bosses in the game? Yet there are plenty of classes in GW that can be highly effective at soloing and grouping. For a class to be overpowered i'd say it atleast has to be able to power through areas or bosses on its own.

It doesn't mean it's overpowered, it means the AI is stupid.
You can say Empathy, Spiteful Spirit, Backfire are overpowered in PvE because enemies cast through it aswell.

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I didn't mention they were perfect skills to use, i just pointed out that there are skills available to help hinder a Paragons buffs. And to say every team brings a hex removal in PvP is a huge assumption to make

Only because it's true. Even Sways use hex removal. Find me a team in PvP, that is decent and in a decent area that doesn't use hex removal and your point stands. Until then your argument is moot/

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Have you never heard of farming? soloing? some people enjoy playing on their own for fun or for the hope in getting rare drops. While Paragons are not totally useless on their own they have a larger disadvantage when alone compared to certain classes. I suggest you catch a Paragon on their own in AB and see how long they survive.

I suggest you stop talking bollocks. Don't forget that AB has 3 teams of 4 players.

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I think some people are ignoring the point of my posts. Paragons aren't imbalanced, its a specific build that has caused them to become hugely powerfull in PvE. And to say an entire class needs nerfing because of one build is well, stupid. If anything needs nerfing its SY! or Ursan. Because at the current moment unless you go Ursan it can be very hard to get into high end PvE groups. And the Imbagon build provides a nice counter for those wanting to go non-Ursanway in high end PvE.

It's not one build. It's the entire class.

Just because you don't understand why they're so overpowered doesn't mean that they aren't overpowered. If you play PvP, or understand the game at all, or even read the positive things they give, with a semi-decent understanding of the game you'll know that.

I understand that you're quite bad when it comes to this sort of stuff.

The Meth · May 08, 2008, 05:05 PM // 17:05

Paragons may kill about 80% effectively as a warrior. Their attacks are also unkiteable and they have a permanent IAS.
Paragons can throw around party wide prot/heal, say, 70% as well as a monk. These buffs are unstrippable and some of them only need to be cast once in a match.
And they can do both of these at the same time in most cases. Their only downfall is they are weak in splits, but the number of times you split in PvE can be counted on one hand. With Leprosy. In PvP this weakness for splits has prevented us from seeing 8 paragon teams winning everything, but they are still good enough that you most often see 1 paragon in an 8 person team.

MasterSasori · May 08, 2008, 11:24 PM // 23:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by lustnlood

this is hilarious... even to read...

paragons? overpowered...? lol?

erm.. first off everyone has his own good points... and i stress this for the gazillianth time. paragons just happen to be a great front to midliner... pvp? comon you have to be joking... unless they are in HA or GvG they are erm.... retarded...

try them in AB and Ta or HB or RA... then pls let me know when you have edited the thing... thnx...

some ppl really do talk out of their behinds...

ummm epic fail.

Mist Walker Skarloc · May 09, 2008, 07:02 AM // 07:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by MasterSasori

ummm epic fail.

Agreed.

Anyways, I've made my paragon, it's awesome, I'm sticking with it, I'm grateful for the first page or so which had what I asked for in it. I appreciate the ideas people gave me, but this thread has become a flamewar between the "AMAGAD PARGUNZ R SO IMBA!!!!11!1intergerwhichprecedes2andexcedes1" gang and the "actuly i fink paragans need bufs" crew.

I predict Arkantos will lock this thread soon unless we start looking respectful and make nice helpful posts (in fact, no more are really needed). Thank you, anyone who has actually made such a post, by the way.

lustnlood · May 09, 2008, 08:17 AM // 08:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by MasterSasori

ummm epic fail.

if you really wanna know why epic fail here you go...

when fightinh mobs 3 at a time and you have 7 or 8 all of which block like crazy no mater how imba your para is.... you cant get anything down and a timer sends ythe teams so imba OR NO IMBa ... the big centaur archers and warriors and shamans and hunters imba-ated me themselves

Tyla · May 09, 2008, 04:52 PM // 16:52

Rigor Mortis. It's quite sexy sometimes, and if there are enemies not blocking, targetswitch gogo. And just because of the Imbagon's huge defensive power, it doesn't mean that you can leeroy every group in the area.

And Mist, sorry your thread degenerated into a flamewar.
I'll leave it at this, if you really believe Paragons aren't imba, make a thread in Gladiator's Arena.
Asking whether or not Paragons are imbalanced or not.

Bobby2 · May 09, 2008, 07:46 PM // 19:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by lustnlood

if you really wanna know why epic fail here you go...

when fightinh mobs 3 at a time and you have 7 or 8 all of which block like crazy no mater how imba your para is.... you cant get anything down and a timer sends ythe teams so imba OR NO IMBa ... the big centaur archers and warriors and shamans and hunters imba-ated me themselves

Can you plz start to make sense?

xxx wraith xxx · May 10, 2008, 10:16 PM // 22:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Meth

In PvP this weakness for splits has prevented us from seeing 8 paragon teams winning everything, but they are still good enough that you most often see 1 paragon in an 8 person team.

with the release of NF there was a thing called paraspike...8 paras wich pwned every team cause of the awsome armor stacking stuff and such. At the moment Team Everfrost (rank 180 atm or such) use a 5 man para [email protected] and they win quite a lot so dont tell me a 'full' para team is no good. Parateams in gvg are a bit risky at maps in wich you can split a lot but pretty pwnage in halls like: Isle of the dread, Imperial Isle and Burning Isle. Also para teams are good @ HA since theres no real splitting there (cept for that capmap with 5 cap pts but paras should be able to handle that with mass party wide running skills). anyway go on with the thread

Tyla · May 11, 2008, 08:36 AM // 08:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by xxx wraith xxx

At the moment Team Everfrost (rank 180 atm or such) use a 5 man para [email protected] and they win quite a lot so dont tell me a 'full' para team is no good.

eF are bad. They got bought over by PvE'ers that are absolute crap, don't GvG anymore and are just...bad.
Heck, I don't even think they have GvG'd since it was bought, and if they did I believe they would've lost every single match they played to lose their rank.
And yeah, just because teams win doesn't mean they are good all the time, HoH has been won by a team with an SF 'Sin, and a gold cape is permanent, and can be bought and kept forever.

And every now and then I see a joke GvG team on observe...

Quote:

Parateams in gvg are a bit risky at maps in wich you can split a lot but pretty pwnage in halls like: Isle of the dread, Imperial Isle and Burning Isle.

The majority of maps include splitting, if not all. The flag.

Div · May 11, 2008, 09:26 AM // 09:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

Heck, I don't even think they have GvG'd since it was bought, and if they did I believe they would've lost every single match they played to lose their rank.

They tanked it from rank ~30 to wherever they are now when it got sold. I remember getting a champ point or two out of that.

The fact that Anet nerfed paragons since they released nightfall and continues to nerf paragons now shows just how overpowered paragons were, are, and will be.

Eru Valenehtar · May 12, 2008, 06:23 PM // 18:23

Mmmm...
Cheerleaders are so good.