Curse

Gennadios · Aug 16, 2009, 08:40 PM // 20:40

Mind you it never seemed like a worthwhile elite for my paragon, but a few days ago I've had the inspiration to slot it into a my warrior's Save Yourselves! spear build.

It's low attribute requirements, and good non-elite IAS skills from the strength line seemed like a worthwhile experiment.

Well, I ended up /w a skill that needs to be hit at ~3 second intervals without any of the SY! satisfaction or much benefit to the casters in my party.

The only thing I can think of is that the Live Team wanted to make this skill double as an energy management skill, much like Go For the Eyes!, but who the hell would bother to use their elite slot as energy management?

The skill needs some combination of an increased adrenaline cost, increased duration, and possibly extra pips of energy at higher Motivation attributes.

zelgadissan · Aug 16, 2009, 08:44 PM // 20:44

You realize this skill being abused in GvG is pretty much the sole reason why Finale of Restoration got nerfed, right?

It is useless in PvE, I will certainly give you that.

Reverend Dr · Aug 16, 2009, 10:12 PM // 22:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gennadios

but who the hell would bother to use their elite slot as energy management?

Glyph Energy mes/ele
Ether prodigy E/mo's
Ether prism E/Rt
OoV Boon prots
Mantra Resolve Boon Prots
Energy Drain Boon Prots
Melandru's Resilient Boon prots
Warrior's Endurance Warriors
Blood Is Power
Prepared Shot Rangers
Ether Renewal smiters
Air of Enchantment smiters
Master of Magic smiters
Elemental attunment me/e spike
Lyssa's Aura me/e fastcast water, or fastcast air spike
Mind Blast eles

I'm sure there are more I've missed.

MisterB · Aug 16, 2009, 10:33 PM // 22:33

This is a terrible elite to run on warrior. TPiY drains your adrenaline and does no damage; the only good reason to use it is Leadership and shout triggers. And GftE does it better in PvE.

Ccat · Aug 16, 2009, 10:50 PM // 22:50

I'd use it at +3 energy regeneration, but +1? Come on, that's like the old Peace and Harmony. 1 energy every three seconds is shameful not to mention everyone should be managing themselves without you throwing on skills to support them.

I liked the old TPiY better to be honest. 10 energy to the party with the click of a button, but still sucked alongside "Never Give Up!". The skill effectively got nerfed. They just thought they were buffing it.

The skill should be something like 'For 3...7...10 seconds, all party members do 25% more damage with attacks and spells'. Fits the name well enough. It might seem overpowered but not when compared to Focused anger and 'By Ural's Hammer!'.

kedde · Aug 16, 2009, 11:25 PM // 23:25

Lol 3 eregen.
You know how much that is?

Partywide uncounterable bloodritual that doubles as an even stronger source of emanagement for yourself, and will trigger all echoes and chants the party has.

Gennadios · Aug 17, 2009, 12:18 AM // 00:18

@Reverend Dr

Let me rephrase that, TPIY! is basically GFTE! /w a 1 extra energy gain over 3 seconds and no spike assist for the user and a similarly negligible effect on the party.

Anything TPIY can do can be done with GFTE, even at 0 command and a full motivation build, the +30% crit chance /w a 4 sec. recharge (0 in PvE) is worth more than a lost elite slot and 1 pip of energy.

@MisterB

There's already a shortage of reasons to bring multiple melees into a party. I was playing around with my options in an attempt to come up /w some kind of partial support role. I'll admit that I should have just brought Stunning Strike instead.

The fact that it's a terrible elite to run has already been established, I was simply disappointed because it didn't have to be a particularly terrible option.

Reverend Dr · Aug 17, 2009, 02:26 AM // 02:26

Oh its definitely terribly underpowered for PvE. It wasn't so bad before when GftE had a recharge, but it wasn't particularly great then either. But in the same respect, Anthem of Guidance is useless in PvE, many other skills and elites fall into the same category.

Lishy · Aug 17, 2009, 06:11 AM // 06:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by kedde

Lol 3 eregen.
You know how much that is?

Partywide uncounterable bloodritual that doubles as an even stronger source of emanagement for yourself, and will trigger all echoes and chants the party has.

It's an elite though.
Just give it +3 regen as a pve version.
Also, echos suck.

Tenebrae · Aug 17, 2009, 07:39 AM // 07:39

Its a total BS elite and you should never use it in PvE. Maybe if its version was +3 regen for a 6 adrenaline cost .... some ppl will think about it but mainly for a hero ( human casters ) .

Reverend Dr · Aug 18, 2009, 12:59 AM // 00:59

Hasty Refrain, Mending Refrain, and Bladeturn Refrain say sup.

Ccat · Aug 18, 2009, 09:35 AM // 09:35

Due to the Paragon's natural lack of skills, running refrains basically forces you to run ToF and to a lesser extent, "Help Me!". I could get very creative with Paragons if all echos lasted a minimum of 22 seconds. I'd require nothing more.

wilebill · Aug 18, 2009, 09:47 PM // 21:47

Running this on a para hero has a barely noticeable effect. Another example of an ANet "balance" that is more like a skill shutdown.

Lishy · Aug 19, 2009, 04:42 AM // 04:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reverend Dr

Hasty Refrain, Mending Refrain, and Bladeturn Refrain say sup.

Bladeturn refrain never activates enough for what it's worth, Hasty Refrain is no use in the heat of combat, and Mending Refrain is a joke.

Sorry. I don't see your point.

Reverend Dr · Aug 19, 2009, 05:04 AM // 05:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kain Fz

Sorry. I don't see your point.

Those three are awesome skills that effectively have no cost other than bringing them on your bar. Really, if you think they are that bad, then you just don't understand this game much at all.

Hasty is great for offensive catching of targets and for defensive kiting. Bladeturn's unremovable % block isn't a replacement for guardian/aegis, but it stacks amazingly well in a defensive net. Mending Refrain relieves tons of pressure damage.

Ccat · Aug 19, 2009, 10:53 AM // 10:53

I use Mending Refrain alot when I feel like running ToF. Combined with Recuperation and Rejuvenation, it gives 10< health regeneration. Bladeturn Refrain is also nice to have with a Displacement and Aegis. When melees in HM can do 200 a hit it's worth overdoing it this way. You shouldn't need to concern yourself with them when there's casters around. Thus Bladeturn finds its place here. I did prefer the old version, mind.

Sorry, but Hasty does suck. HM enemies already run faster thus Hasty would probably equal out your speeds or still leave you at a disadvantage.

I digress, tPiY! is still useless when GftE is around.

Carboplatin · Aug 20, 2009, 11:53 PM // 23:53

I've tried hard to incorporate that into a teambuild, without overloading on paragons and its not worth the effort.