Curse

iToasterHD · Nov 28, 2009, 01:11 AM // 01:11

So, you're in a party and there's another Paragon. And surprise! He's an Imabagon like you! What do you do? Anyone have any suggestions on how to coordinate? I am thinking of attempting to make a motivation build that can help. I am relatively new to Paragon, and a virgin to Motivation! But I want wings... Discuss!

(I don't use EotN PvE skills; so if you suggest anything to me try to keep that in mind. BUT! If you do mention it, everyone else please let it slide. We don't need a discussion of what is considered arrogant or unthoughtful. Stay on topic!)

P.S. Anyone else getting deja vu?

zelgadissan · Nov 28, 2009, 01:23 AM // 01:23

If I was running a second paragon in PvE, without question it'd be Stunning Strike with some buffs that your imbagon won't be bringing - things like "Find Their Weakness!", Anthem of Envy, maybe something like Hexbreaker Aria.

If you definitively want to use Motivation, I'd bring Song of Purification with things like Ballad of Restoration to mop up the minimal damage getting through with adrenaline spear attacks since your imbagon's adrenaline is going to Save Yourselves. Things like Wild Throw, Merciless Spear, etc.

Gennadios · Nov 28, 2009, 01:49 AM // 01:49

There's nothing wrong with having two imbas in a party. Just coordinate who uses There's Nothing To Fear!/Save Yourselves! first, then the other para can use theirs once that runs out. That way you offer twice the protection, and your gimped imba attack skills will almost do the damage of a single ranger. Just make sure that one of you carries Anthem of Flame and the other Anthem of weakness so you don't overlap the burning too much.

Aside from that. One of you can just take stick to spear chucking entirely. Bring an IAS and a non-casting time shout or two like Go for the eyes! so your DPS isn't hampered by having to activate a slow casting skill ever few seconds, and then load up on spear skills. Just remember that you still need to bring There's Nothing To fear. It's just too over powered to leave behind, even if another para already has it.

PS: The entire Motivation tree is useles in PvE for the following reasons:

Balanced for PvP (too long recharge for PvE, low benefit for PvE, etc)
Very conditional effects, making it hard to apply them when necessary.
"Ends when you move your mouse"

I've spent a year with a para as my primary, and the only motivation skill that ever made it on to my bar without me regretting it in the mission was Aria of Zeal. Your monks will love you with that skill.

iToasterHD · Nov 28, 2009, 01:50 AM // 01:50

This is what I came up with. Motivation is tricky, so for now I focused on Leadership, Spear and Command.

Anthem of Flame
They're on Fire
Blazing Finale
Focused Anger
Aggressive Refrain
Signet of Return
Blazing Spear
Spear of Fury

Basically, set fire to everything and enjoy the benefits of They're on Fire.

zelgadissan · Nov 28, 2009, 01:56 AM // 01:56

First - there's no point in bringing They're on Fire and an imbagon, ever. Normally, you have an imbagon so there's no need for ToF. When you're fighting massive amounts of armor-ignoring damage, there's no need for an imbagon.

Second - Focused Anger and Aggressive Refrain on the same bar? You know IAS can't stack past 33%, which is what FA gives you, right?

EDIT: I'm an idiot, I confused FA and Soldier's Fury for a minute. I'll leave it so everybody can point and laugh

iToasterHD · Nov 28, 2009, 02:02 AM // 02:02

Focused Anger isn't an IAS, however, you are probably right about having an Imbagon means you don't need this. Plus, it was also pointed out the tremendous energy issues. So, scratch my build. I think Gennadios gets the cookie this time.

P.S. On my bar I use "Go for the Eyes!" Should I be using something else? I know once in HM it won't help much, but until then I figure it is best option. I was looking at Anthem of Envy or Anthem of Weariness. Or does it just depend on the situation such that there is no general rule (and I mean that VERY loosely)?

My build.

Xenex Xclame · Nov 28, 2009, 03:12 AM // 03:12

@Zelgadissan, i was reading and wondering wtf you were talking about lol.

Like zelga said dont take ToF,there is just no need for it

I would say replace blazing finale with either anthem of flame or envy,dont take weariness its again just not needed.I would go with flame because its not adrenaline based, so doesnt take away from SY.

Also your not using your 3rd pve skill,So you could take spear of fury instead of swift (unless your gonna be enchanted almost everytime) It has huge damage and has the chance of giving your adrenaline for your shouts.

Anthem of Flame+GFT-vicious attack>spear of fury=nice

Lishy · Nov 28, 2009, 03:16 AM // 03:16

Either go GFTEScythe paragon, or Stunning Strike for uber daze spam.

If you're curious, this is what I remember I use to run with GFTEScythe

Soldier's Fury
Can't touch this <-- Fuels Soldier's Fury
Aura of Holy Might
Go for the Eyes
*Other Skills*

No other profession is capable of spamming Go for the Eyes with increased adrenaline and IAS as much as the paragon.
Alternatively, if a miracle happens and you figure out a solution to the Para's cracked armor, you can take Focused Anger with Aggressive Refrain. That, or Drunken Master if you have a bunch of beer as I do.
This build really does work, as leadership +GFTE provides great energy management as well as critical spam

I don't think anyone else used this build but me though, so expect PuGs to be skeptical.
However, it is amazing when teamed with something like an Orders Dervish to increase adrenaline.
This build is also great for spamming burn as you are melee and will be spamming GFTE. So Blazing finale happens a lot. Great for activating Glowing Signet and spamming expensive PvE skills too.
Burn is 14 damage per second, so combined with, oet's say, 104 damage on an hm enemy, that is 104x #hits + 14x6 over a duration of 6 seconds when you hit the enemy.

GFTEScythe is exactly what its name says. GFTE and scythe. So you can support while also dealing very high damage. Very efficient when paired with dervishes or warriors. Okay when paired with Critscythe, though they gain not much benefit.

How much longer until Scytheway as the new SC gimmick?

mistokibbles · Nov 28, 2009, 04:52 AM // 04:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kain Fz

How much longer until Scytheway as the new SC gimmick?

It's the new UWSC kind of. But please, please, PLEASE don't go scythe with paragons. other classes play it a lot better. just bring utilities, an ias, dw and maybe daze

Lishy · Nov 28, 2009, 05:46 AM // 05:46

mistokibbles, you have not red my post.
I just explained a whole build revolving around Scythegons. And know what? They work!!!

Try the build out before judging.
I'm convinced that through this decent means of melee high damage, this is one of the best way to spam some of the longest duration burn in the game, AoE too. From that, allows many synergy. For one, it would provide conditions for an Imbagon's Spear of Fury, and amongst many other things.
And while you're dealing this means of high damage, if you use glowing signet, it will allow you to afford energy for TNTF while striking damage over 100 which you can use during the downtime of the imbagon's tntf.
Did I mention that with your AoE burn, it stacks with the poison caused by the team's minion bomber's death nova? Causing pretty much max degen to the whole enemy mob

roysland · Nov 28, 2009, 06:36 AM // 06:36

Your team will also love you if you bring Fall back and Incoming. I know Incoming isn't really worth the elite slot, but you'll get to the next battle way before adrenaline runs out. Anthem of Fury is a good option if you also have other paragon or warriors with you.

You will have to consider what threats your team is up against, and what your team strengths are.

paddymew · Nov 28, 2009, 11:12 AM // 11:12

Defensive Anthem or Song of Restoration are two very good non-imbagon skills, although Defensive Anthem only if you have a caster team.
Ballad of Restoration is good for some party wide healing when needed, and Energizing Chorus if there are more paragons than yourself in the party.

iToasterHD · Nov 28, 2009, 02:10 PM // 14:10

Is stunning strike worth looking in to? Misto subtly mentioned it, and I've heard it around the forums a bit. As Gennadios said, nothing wrong with having two Imbagons, but using Stunning Strike would result in NOT using Focused Anger. So you would not be using Save Yourselves! as often. Which with another Imbagon might not be bad, but what about as a build in itself, rather then as a sidekick?

When I started playing the Ritualist a few weeks later they came out with a massive update for them. I am hoping that happens again with Paragon.

Lishy · Nov 28, 2009, 06:35 PM // 18:35

Enduring Harmony+FGJ= Whut? What do you mean no SY spam on an SS build? I iz fine!

Flame A · Dec 11, 2009, 12:08 PM // 12:08

IMHO, theres no point in bringing more than one Imba. If you have a good Imba, with decent allegiance, he can keep up SY indefinetly in battle.

Smarty · Dec 12, 2009, 01:21 AM // 01:21

http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:Team_-_Racway

It's now supposedly outdated but I still like running it on my imba's heroes when I party with my friend and his discorders. The stunning strike hero build would work fine as a replacement for your usual one when you find yourself partied with another imba IMO.

Bewn · Dec 12, 2009, 02:30 AM // 02:30

You could ask the other Paragon in the team whether he uses the Kurzick oder Luxon version of SY! and bring the other one. Though they won't stack, they won't overwrite each other either.

Or what about Assassin's Promise + Ballad of Restoration, Aria of Zeal/Restoration and/or Zealous Anthem?

MasterSasori · Dec 28, 2009, 06:11 AM // 06:11

It's true that having two imbagons wouldn't hurt defensively, but you will prolly clear slower compared to classes that can clear crowds faster. Takes more time, so only 1 imbagon should be in a group.

Yes I know imbagons are decent in damage, but not compared to say scythe sins or SoS rits.

dr love · Jan 06, 2010, 01:51 AM // 01:51

i got to try the scythe para lol!

the motivation line is pretty sucky tho. i would just stick with double imbagons so you can give each other SY, maintain GFTE and shout at each other.

Athrun Feya · Jan 12, 2010, 08:39 PM // 20:39

scythe para, unless youre a fan of autoattacking, has some pretty significant energy problems. Here is a build that doesnt:

http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:P/A_Dagger_Spammer

near constant +1 energy regen for your party and a para builds that actually does damage. Requires pve skills to make it effective though.

Taking two imbas is really, really unproductive