Curse

olydog · Mar 31, 2006, 01:19 AM // 01:19

well..I see this can be done in many many different ways...as for speed I will admit that it boils down to the monk and how he pulls...butI think the best option would be using the FFS or anything with a 20% longer enchants and putting more then 9 points in Illusion. Then just echoing SS after you cast SV which should last about 18 to 19 seconds. I personally use a +15 energy -1 regen 20% chance of recharge to curses 8 req blood magic truncheon and never ever have a problem with energy with soul reaping at 10. I just switch to my collectors curses req truncheon for the times i need to wand the dieing nightmares. My system seems to work very fast and I have no complaints...

Thanks for the great info Sno ..i definately will try other options..i'm always open for new things

lord_shar · Mar 31, 2006, 01:49 AM // 01:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sha Noran

Why you would ever have only 1 or 2 smites is beyond me. Even if the fighting smite group that agros on whatever it wants slims down a group to that number there should still be another group near enough to agro that raises the number to 5+.

:-)

There's a known agro-bug in UW where smites and coldfires will occasionally fight each other, sometimes leaving 1-2 lone smites once the cloud clears.

sno · Mar 31, 2006, 02:41 AM // 02:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by lord_shar

There's a known agro-bug in UW where smites and coldfires will occasionally fight each other, sometimes leaving 1-2 lone smites once the cloud clears.

He mentioned that already, and I really don't think it's a bug. It happens every single run, there is always one group of smites that is 100% aggro to everything (smites, colds, people.) I think it was intended

Quote:

All your arguments are regarding the Monk and problems with him, not the Necro.

That's a huge part of the necros responsibility, to adapt to the monk. The run is almost solely determined by the skill of the monk, as long as the necro can adapt to him efficiently. If the monk was always perfect, then aggros would never need 'error-proofing' or 'plan b', which is what cover and bait hexes are for, respectively. In an ideal run you won't ever fight 1-2 smites at a time, that's very true. That in absolutely no way means that it will never happen. The job of the necro is to be able to kill whatever the monk aggros with insanely fast speed and reliability, without having to make the monk wait. Theres no excuse for not being able to kill a group, so no matter what you should have an adequate way to kill whatever you may be presented with.

lord_shar · Mar 31, 2006, 02:53 AM // 02:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by sno

He mentioned that already, and I really don't think it's a bug. It happens every single run, there is always one group of smites that is 100% aggro to everything (smites, colds, people.) I think it was intended

Given the above, I think it's an ANET developer's inside joke designed to tease ecto farmers

Quote:

Originally Posted by sno

That's a huge part of the necros responsibility, to adapt to the monk. The run is almost solely determined by the skill of the monk, as long as the necro can adapt to him efficiently. If the monk was always perfect, then aggros would never need 'error-proofing' or 'plan b', which is what cover and bait hexes are for, respectively. In an ideal run you won't ever fight 1-2 smites at a time, that's very true. That in absolutely no way means that it will never happen. The job of the necro is to be able to kill whatever the monk aggros with insanely fast speed and reliability, without having to make the monk wait. Theres no excuse for not being able to kill a group, so no matter what you should have an adequate way to kill whatever you may be presented with.

The above is true... your style of pulling aaxte is very different from normal PUG 55-monks -- this REALLY threw me off (in addition to just waking up, lol). I didn't realize that the Ice King quest was another viable ecto source. Thanks for the quick UW runs this morning... we'll have to try it again soon (I'll try to be conscious next time).

Worthington · Mar 31, 2006, 04:51 AM // 04:51

Speaking of the Ice King quest ( a little off topic of the recent posts but not the thread in general).. how do you protect the King and the Reaper at the same time.

I've picked it up the last few times on our UW runs (me=necro) and while the monk can tank and I can kill the Terror Webs all day long that attack the reaper always about 2-3 mins in we lose. I can only assume the Ice king is dying.

Does the monk aggro the incoming webs, then move to webs attacking the ice king, taking the whole lot?

cerb · Mar 31, 2006, 12:25 PM // 12:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Worthington

Speaking of the Ice King quest ( a little off topic of the recent posts but not the thread in general).. how do you protect the King and the Reaper at the same time.

I've picked it up the last few times on our UW runs (me=necro) and while the monk can tank and I can kill the Terror Webs all day long that attack the reaper always about 2-3 mins in we lose. I can only assume the Ice king is dying.

Does the monk aggro the incoming webs, then move to webs attacking the ice king, taking the whole lot?

Monk has to stay in range of dryders spawn and not run away (dodging meteor showers is only running you may do)

Watch out... this weekend you'll get to see Me & Sno vs L I N S Y S & Sha Noran 2-man UW video speed-run contest with quests (Wrathful Spirits, Unwanted Guests, Escort of Souls, Servants of Grenth - aka Ice King -)

Worthington · Mar 31, 2006, 03:41 PM // 15:41

sweet. I'll be looking forward to seeing those.

thanks for the tip.

bobrath · Mar 31, 2006, 03:46 PM // 15:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by cerb

Watch out... this weekend you'll get to see Me & Sno vs L I N S Y S & Sha Noran 2-man UW video speed-run contest with quests (Wrathful Spirits, Unwanted Guests, Escort of Souls, Servants of Grenth - aka Ice King -)

Please post these up in these forums... perhaps as a new thread. It will be very educational to see the approaches two succesful N / Mo teams take.

sno · Mar 31, 2006, 06:47 PM // 18:47

For anyone interested, the 2man Underworld Challenge can be found here.

Sha Noran · Mar 31, 2006, 10:27 PM // 22:27

Incorrect Cerb. I do not have a Necro and therefore will not be the other half of LINSYS' team... don't worry, he has many competant partners to choose from. :-)

cerb · Mar 31, 2006, 11:31 PM // 23:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sha Noran

Incorrect Cerb. I do not have a Necro and therefore will not be the other half of LINSYS' team... don't worry, he has many competant partners to choose from. :-)

Funny how you're the one that got him involved and aren't even playing.

Anyways, from now on keep the discussion thread-related only, please.

jordon106 · Apr 06, 2006, 04:08 AM // 04:08

hey thanks for posting this build it is great

and have been using it for a while now it neaver gets old

great farming and thanks man

RadeonDJ9600 · Apr 08, 2006, 01:49 PM // 13:49

Wow Cerb, excellent guide...and by looking at your guide I guess I'm not the average "Pug monk"

lord_shar · Apr 14, 2006, 02:09 AM // 02:09

Just a few minor updates from more experimentation:

I managed to get my illusion to 9 by find a lower req trunch:

As a result, I'm now running

Illusion - 9
Blood Magic 9 (8 + 1)
Curses - 16 (12 + 3 + 1)
Soul Reaping 6 (5 + 1)

Based on further tests, I'm finding that extending arcane echo vs. smites is NOT a good thing... it usually adds +4 seconds to arcane echo's duration, thereby slowing your necro's ability to recover for the next smite pull. An update to the casting sequence I posted above would be:

1) switch to 20% enchant one hander
2) cast AtB during 55-monk's smite pull to allow your nec to fully recharge
3) cast SV on 55-monk once all smites are agro'd
4) switch to +5 energy trunch w/ Vilnar's Glove
5) cast arcane echo
6) at ~8 seconds after SV was cast, cast SS on smite #1
7) cast SS on smite #2. Cover hex with PB if want an extra safety margin and health recovery
8) cast desicrate for flop

Slightly more complicated steps, but the benefit is an increase in available energy to combat smites, along with reduced wait time for arcane echo to recharge.

GZS_FREK · Apr 17, 2006, 07:50 PM // 19:50

great thread guys keep up the good work on bringing info to the cummonity

bobrath · Apr 17, 2006, 09:02 PM // 21:02

Just wanted to drop in here to thank all the contributors. I switch back and forth from my MM to the SS/SV builds located in this thread.

I don't know how many comments I've gotten from PuG monks, but they all run something like:

"Why can't more necros be competent like you?"
"Wow, most PUG necros just fail at this step"
"How did you do that?" or "You're ready already??"

I was especially proud when I managed to pull it out with a monk that managed to aggro Dryders, Aataxes, and Grasps (oh and a nightmare). I'm not sure who was more suprised, him or me, but needless to say it felt good.

Its all due to you guys. Thanks a ton for opening my eyes to a more active build then my MM. I still love raising (and hating the brainless) minions, but this is now a close second.

Cheers!

squan · Jul 26, 2006, 09:22 AM // 09:22

N/Me

Attributes:
Illusion Magic: 11
Blood Magic: 3 (minor rune)
Soul Reaping: 7 (minor rune)
Curses: 16 (superior rune+scar pattern)

1 Arcane Echo - Enchantment Spell
If you cast a "spell" in the next 20 seconds, Arcane Echo is replaced with that spell for 20 seconds. Arcane Echo ends prematurely if you use a non-spell skill.

2 Spiteful Spirit {Elite} - Hex Spell damage 37 duration 21
For 8-18 seconds, whenever target foe attacks or uses a skill, Spiteful Spirit deals 5-29 shadow damage to that foe and all adjacent foes.

3 Reckless Haste - Hex Spell duration 21 % miss 52
For 5-17 seconds, target foe and all adjacent foes are Hexed with Reckless Haste. While Hexed, they attack 25% faster but have a 15-43% chance to miss with attacks.

4 Sympathetic Visage - Enchantment Spell duration 17 sec
For 8-18 seconds, whenever target ally is hit by a melee attack, all adjacent foes lose all adrenaline and 3 energy.

5 Ancestor's Visage - Enchantment Spell duration 17 sec
For 8-18 seconds, whenever target ally is hit by a melee attack, all adjacent foes lose all adrenaline and 3 Energy.

6 Desecrate Enchantments - Spell shadow dam 64 shadow dam each ench 21
Target foe and all nearby foes take 6-49 shadow damage and 4-17 shadow damage for each enchantment on them.

7 Blood Ritual - Enchantment Spell 9 sec
Sacrafice 17% max health. For 8-13 seconds, target touched ally gains +3 energy regeneration. Blood Ritual can not be used on the caster.

8 rez signet

enemies in UW

Dying Nightmare
skills:
Rend Enchantments

Bladed Aatxe
skills:
Deadly Riposte
Gash
Riposte
Savage Slash
Sever Artery

drop rates:
Gold: 29%
Equippable Item: 19%
Piles of glittering Dust: 12%
Glob of Ectoplasm: 4%
Demonic Remains: 28%

Grasping Darkness
skills:
"Fear Me!"
Distracting Blow
Flurry
Skull Crack

drop rates:
Gold: 31%
Equippable Item: 23%
Demonic Remains: 43%

Smite Crawler
skills:
Divine Intervention
Mend Condition
Reversal of Fortune
Shield of Judgment
Smite Hex
Zealot's Fire

drop rates:
Gold: 27%
Equippable Item: 41%
Piles of glittering Dust: 9%
Glob of Ectoplasm: <2%
Phantom Residue: 20%

Coldfire Night
skills:
Aura of Restoration
Frozen Burst
Maelstrom
Rust
Shard Storm
Ward Against Harm

drop rates:
Gold: 29%
Equippable Item: 43%
Demonic Remains: 26%

this is how i use my skills to kill enemies

Dying Nightmare
wand them to death
you must kill them A.S.A.P because they can strip enchantments from monk. monk can cover it with Spell Breaker but kill them when you can

Bladed Aatxe
use skills in following order
1-2-1-3-6
mostly this is enough and the monk can agro the next group.

Grasping Darkness
use skills in following order
cast 4-5 on monk so the grasps can not steal energy from monk
then cast 1-2-1-6

Smite Crawler

use skills in following order
cast 4-5 on monk
then cast 1-2-1-6
because you used 4-5 on monk the smites can not use Smite Hex. so when you cast the second SS you can sit and wait till they are dead.

when echo is still recharging then use skill in next order
cast 4-5 on monk
then cast 2-3-6-2 (when recharged)
because you use reckless haste the smites attack faster so SS damage does its work very well.

Coldfire Night
use skills in following order
1-2-1-3-6-1-2
you got to act quick when monk agro's coldsfire nights, monk mostly use Spell Breaker after that the monk gets interupted lots of times. exp monks will find it not hard, but there are enough monks who die vs coldfire nights.

well thats it. i got a 55 monk and a SS. when playing with my SS i kill many in a short time. specially smites. if the monk is a exp monk and agro's 3 groups i give them 15 sec and all are dead if i use the skills mentioned above.

the quicker the kill the faster you can go for your next run. remember time is money.

good luck

Yanman.be · Jul 26, 2006, 09:39 AM // 09:39

Wouldn't wreckless haste mess with the monk's energy management sometimes?

squan · Jul 26, 2006, 09:43 AM // 09:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yanman.be

Wouldn't wreckless haste mess with the monk's energy management sometimes?

not really. a friend uses same skills when i go with my 55 monk. and i never ever have energy problems. btw enemy attacks faster so you get faster +1 energy with baltz spirit.

btw, necro can kill lots of enemies in a short time. so then i agro big time to make the trip shorter.

squan · Jul 26, 2006, 10:04 AM // 10:04

i noticed many necro's in the game use a axe or sword with +20% enchants. they think SS also has the 20% bonus.

i never do this because

Arcane Echo
Sympathetic Visage
Ancestor's Visage
Blood Ritual

are enchantments so +20% longer and

SS, Reckless haste and Desecrate Enchantments

are no enchants.

i prefer to use my truncheon or vilnar wand because vilnar has halves casting time 20%
and i got a trucheon with +15 energy and a off hand item with +25 energy

i only use last set when i have no energy because both has -1 energy recharge.

btw if you do want longer enchantments just ask your monk to cast blessed aura on you. monk will get more energy to if he use blessed signet.