Curse

Matsumi · Sep 30, 2006, 02:47 AM // 02:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franco

lol I know, I just BiP both monks in the party, then obviously sacrificed 140hp. So I got atacked... and all the 2 monks could do for me is give me a healing breeze ? wtf , Healing breeze is a useless skill in monk bar ><.

Am I misreading BiP?

Kali Magdalene · Sep 30, 2006, 05:36 AM // 05:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franco

Im a SS, my main job is to hex. I take BR just to aid monks spamming healing party.[sarcasm]
GG

EDIT: Oh and read my post before making comments , I said I use BR, I didnt say I was a BiP necro.

You dis say you used BiP:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franco

lol I know, I just BiP both monks in the party, then obviously sacrificed 140hp. So I got atacked... and all the 2 monks could do for me is give me a healing breeze ? wtf , Healing breeze is a useless skill in monk bar ><.

Personally, I hate when monks heal me after I use BiP. I carry more than sufficient means to keep myself healed when I do battery work.

xiao1985 · Sep 30, 2006, 05:46 AM // 05:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kali Magdalene

You dis say you used BiP:

Personally, I hate when monks heal me after I use BiP. I carry more than sufficient means to keep myself healed when I do battery work.

when monks learnt nrg mgmt but yet to learn how to move the eyes away from the red bar, they do that :S

well i used to do that...

VorianVader · Oct 01, 2006, 08:15 PM // 20:15

I have been playing my monk more often in the last week and have come across a lot of monks who spam heal party and healing breeze and blow out their energy. They then get pissed at me for not healing the team. This seems to be a recent trend in the game. Guess a lot of people are making monks to get into groups easily without having the first idea about how to heal (heal party = lazy mans heal, healing breeze = loved by wammos who also think its right for their monk chars). I am not saying that healing breeze is nooby......it can be a counter to constant pressure degen but should not be used to "heal".

I use WoH, DK, RoF, Orison, Mend Ailment, Remove Hex and Heal Touch (all 5 energy spells which heal for quite a bit with max DF). The only 15 energy spell I have on my skill bar at times is usually aegis and I have never had energy problems.

Whats even worse is quite a few Mo/W actually turn out to be 55'ers and its hilarious seeing them bite the bullet in Abaddons etc.

But then again, this madness is not just limited to monks. I have seen wammos, with 12 points in healing plus equipped with healing hands, healing seed and healing breeze who do crap damage. Came across N/W carrying a sword and shield who charge a bunch of hands/fists of titans, die in a second and blame the monk (60 AL armor + ripotse idiots!).

Go figure!

Ensign · Oct 01, 2006, 10:47 PM // 22:47

Without saying much more, I have to say that I am endlessly amused by the counter to the "Healing Breeze is AWESUM!!!1" argument is to compare it to Orison.

As though comparing the two worst healing spells in the game to each other somehow accomplishes anything.

I am also amused to see all of these builds posted with 5-6 skills that do nothing other than make red bars go up. All of those skills are on short recharges, just what exactly do you think the 5th vanilla heal on your bar is actually doing?

Peace,
-CxE

LagunaCid · Oct 02, 2006, 05:39 AM // 05:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

Without saying much more, I have to say that I am endlessly amused by the counter to the "Healing Breeze is AWESUM!!!1" argument is to compare it to Orison.

As though comparing the two worst healing spells in the game to each other somehow accomplishes anything.

I am also amused to see all of these builds posted with 5-6 skills that do nothing other than make red bars go up. All of those skills are on short recharges, just what exactly do you think the 5th vanilla heal on your bar is actually doing?

Peace,
-CxE

So you advocate wasting energy casting Banish? ;]

gamecube187 · Oct 02, 2006, 05:44 AM // 05:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by waarph

Beside, it is a really nice to spam heals without ever worrying about energy. It is such a change from the monk side of thing. Also, no one blames you

nor thank you for the healing

(except the monks that usually say gg to me at the end... but between healers we are more polite

)

O_O You know of a ritualist healing build that doesnt make you worry about energy?!?! Can you please tell me it? Or link me to it or something?

Quote:

Originally Posted by cataphract

Wuss.

As a monk, you're always right and on top of that - you have the means to impose your will unto others. Ofcourse, you keep this as your last resort and use it only on those who have proven worthy of it; i.e. a/w using frenzy, minion masters with lvl 5 minions, e/mo echo nukers, OMG-HEAL-MY-PET rangers, I-HEAL-BETTER-THAN-yu0 ritualists, w/n's with ss that say they'll keep their energy up with balthazar's and alike. PvE is lots of fun when you reach the Zen of not losing your nerves to random idiots.

True. But then again, a good monk that watches aggro and positions himself accordingly will not need any additional self-heals. Orison will do the job every time.

Just because the monk can watch his agro, doesn't mean the tanks know how to hold agro, and in pvp, there is no agro. That is where healing poke comes in..uh..healing touch....

Also, it is a monks job (at least when they are healing, which is 99% of the time) to heal everyone. If you are one of those monks who thinks people with certain classes, builds, or pets that need healing, don't need healing, then please don't play on your monk. When a monk has a healing build, it is so they can try to heal everyone, including pets, with as few deaths as possible. As long as you accually heal everyone, all of pve will be fun with a monk because, guess what? No one will yell at you for them dieing or anything like that, becuase they won't be dieing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

Without saying much more, I have to say that I am endlessly amused by the counter to the "Healing Breeze is AWESUM!!!1" argument is to compare it to Orison.

As though comparing the two worst healing spells in the game to each other somehow accomplishes anything.
-CxE

Hmm...orision of healing bad? Lets see...low energy cost, low recharge time, and low cast time, plus it heals pretty good. Seems to be a good skill to me. In fact, its is literally in every one of my healing monk builds, and accually probably one of the most used spells in all of those builds, and I often can heal better than the other monks I see in the parties I'm in...

And healing breeze can be a really good counter to degen, as long as you don't spam it...

Man, reading this really makes me wonder why we don't have a new one of those guides that end up on the Guru home page, exept this one is for how to be a good monk. Or is there already one of those and its just that no one reads it?

cataphract · Oct 02, 2006, 06:06 AM // 06:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by gamecube187

Just because the monk can watch his agro, doesn't mean the tanks know how to hold agro, and in pvp, there is no agro. That is where healing poke comes in..uh..healing touch....

Well, we were talking about PvE. Even if the warriors can't hold their aggro (which is the fault of a ranger in most cases as explained in one of Healbot's comics) that doesn't mean you have to stand there and take hits. I mean, you're not bound to the ground (omg, it rhymes!) so that you can't take a couple of steps back. <yoda>When aggro lost, kiting essential is; MMMMM?</yoda>

Quote:

Originally Posted by gamecube187

Also, it is a monks job (at least when they are healing, which is 99% of the time) to heal everyone. If you are one of those monks who thinks people with certain classes, builds, or pets that need healing, don't need healing, then please don't play on your monk. When a monk has a healing build, it is so they can try to heal everyone, including pets, with as few deaths as possible. As long as you accually heal everyone, all of pve will be fun with a monk because, guess what? No one will yell at you for them dieing or anything like that, becuase they won't be dieing.

Heal everyone, you say? That sounds like wasting the good ol' energy reserve. I mean, I don't heal pets because there are party members to heal. On top of that - rangers have some good skills for keeping their pets alive, provided they are beastmasters. If the pet is here just for the show, he won't get healed. He neither does any damage and he just gets in the warrior's way. He's of better use to the team eating dirt.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gamecube187

Hmm...orision of healing bad? Lets see...low energy cost, low recharge time, and low cast time, plus it heals pretty good. Seems to be a good skill to me. In fact, its is literally in every one of my healing monk builds, and accually probably one of the most used spells in all of those builds, and I often can heal better than the other monks I see in the parties I'm in...

True. I just cycle orison and kiss. Seed the rambo assasin, heal party every now and then and it's all good for every PvE enviroment. Provided you don't spam heal party and have a means of energy management. Yesterday I went to Mineral Springs as mo/r and brought my pet along just for the fun of it. He's a white tiger and likes to play in the snow very much.

What I want to say is: PvE is so smegging easy when people in your group are not random idiots.

idiosyncratic · Oct 02, 2006, 08:52 AM // 08:52

nah the best monk has 0 healing 0 prot, and just grabs a hammer and attacks

Zui · Oct 02, 2006, 09:05 AM // 09:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by LagunaCid

So you advocate wasting energy casting Banish? ;]

I'm pretty sure Ensign does not advocate the use of "Healing" Monks in PvP taking somthing like Banish...

He's saying that instead of having 5-6 heals that all serve the same purpose and have very low recharge times, so low that you could cut out 1-3 of those skills and still be able to continously chain the remaining skills(No, that's usualy not a good idea, but just for arguements sake...). He's saying, ditch the junk you're not getting any real use out of, and bring somthing that's useful, like condition removal, or some protection, or some hex removal, or maybe somthing like Heal Party.

After all, I'd venture to guess that a monk that can not only heal, but remove conditions, hexes, and even mitigate damage with prot is better than one that mashes keys 1 through 6 all of which are set to skills that serve the same purpose, but by the time he hits key #3 the first skill is already recharged.

Hopefuly someone can understand that mess. It's 5 AM and I need sleep... Badly.

Kais Unduli · Oct 02, 2006, 09:05 AM // 09:05

I'm finding lately that not only do monks spam healing breeze and heal party, many of these new monks don't bring any kind of condition or hex removal either. The reason why they don't bring mend ailment/condtion: I'm a healer, not a prot monk.

I don't trust a monk who doesn't bring condition removal. It's just wrong.

torquemada · Oct 02, 2006, 09:10 AM // 09:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zui

He's saying, ditch the junk you're not getting any real use out of, and bring somthing that's useful, like condition removal, or some protection, or some hex removal, or maybe somthing like Heal Party.

Don't bother, I was already suggested by someone to take Plague Touch or switch to /Mo to heal myself. Redundant healing ftw.

EDIT: And yeah, you don't remove hex, you breeze.

Crowlley · Oct 02, 2006, 12:01 PM // 12:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kais Unduli

I don't trust a monk who doesn't bring condition removal. It's just wrong.

Quoted in agreement. When healing as my monk I always bring along mend condition, there is very little reason not to.

EPO Bot · Oct 02, 2006, 12:04 PM // 12:04

Mend condition is your friend, but draw conditions combined with purge is sometimes even better.

Extinguish can help wile crossing pits of lava, and Restore condition can sometimes hea lmore then WoH.

Yeah, i never leave home without one of those.

Smile Like Umean It · Oct 02, 2006, 01:50 PM // 13:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kais Unduli

I'm finding lately that not only do monks spam healing breeze and heal party, many of these new monks don't bring any kind of condition or hex removal either. The reason why they don't bring mend ailment/condtion: I'm a healer, not a prot monk.

I don't trust a monk who doesn't bring condition removal. It's just wrong.

I don't bring a condition remover in favor of a hex remover and double res (rebirth and restore, just in case. usually for FoW, if we have a party wipe out)

However, if I'm doing something like THK, I'll drop rebirth for a condition removal.

Vincaro · Oct 02, 2006, 02:22 PM // 14:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Former Ruling

And give them the skill "Heal Party" so he'll blow through the energy in aminute and sit at 0.

EDIT: Heal Party is an awesome monk spell for PvE, I'm not knocking it, I carry it on healing monk pve builds. But These people, and AI, cannot handle when to use it.

I equip it in PVE myself, along with Healing Breeze, but I do try to use them sparingly, the main three heals I use are Orison of Healing, Ethereal Light, and Word of Healing, each only uses 5 energy and has short casting and recharge times.

Spamming skills with more than 5 energy cost just isn't smart for any class... Ele's can do it a little bit because of their large pool of energy, but I laugh at ele's in PVE that kill their energy by spaming exhaustion causing skills at the first battle then are near useless for the next two.

zelira · Oct 02, 2006, 03:20 PM // 15:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by idiosyncratic

nah the best monk has 0 healing 0 prot, and just grabs a hammer and attacks

That's how I started out...... wait that's not something to be proud of.

*hopes no one sees the guild name*

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crowlley

Quoted in agreement. When healing as my monk I always bring along mend condition, there is very little reason not to.

Agreed, always take a condition remover. I bring it even with 0 in prot, and here are my 3 reasons to bring it: blinded warrior, dazed casters, and does the other pug monk and his tats have it?

Viruzzz · Oct 02, 2006, 04:25 PM // 16:25

at first i thought this was a complaint about how monks suck from someone who has never played a monk.

I play a monk form time to time. and i'm not completely worthless as that role. but a lot of the time your teammates make it really had to monk. splitting up in 4 different directions. attacking 7 groups of monsters at a time, and so on.

i guess what i'm trying to say is that the monk isn't always the cause of a groups demise

Remmy · Oct 02, 2006, 05:28 PM // 17:28

I frequently monk for PuGs. I run a WoH build with 5 heal skills, mend condition, remove hex, and rebirth. I do have some energy problems now and again, but usually not a problem. Energy problems usually stem from another party member doing something stupid. By no means am I the perfect monk and am still learning each time out, but would offer these observations.

PuGs are like a box of chocolates - you never know what kind you're gonna get. Sometimes decadence... sometimes nuts. Combining unknown players with unknown skills with unknown levels of mastery of those skills and trying to accomplish a goal. By very definition a challenge. Don't expect success every time. Manage your OWN expectations or don't PuG.

Worry about your own backyard first. Expect the worst. If you do get a 'bad monk' are you as prepared as you can be to deal with it? Or do you play your build expecting a 'good monk' every time?

It's not always the monks fault. A couple of examples from yesterday's adventures.

Farming greens in Eternal Grove with a tank, mm, ss, monk (me) team. First outing, we breeze through the bosses twice. Good team, good coordination, smart play. Everyone says 'great monking'. 'Stick with us for another round'. Second outing, different players, but also a tank, mm, ss and myself. Warrior doesn't know how to aggro/pull properly, MM can't keep a decent army of minions, and thus failure to which I receive a barrage of 'hey monk, your build is bad or you don't know how to play it'. Hmmm.... worked the first time.

Second example. Unwaking Waters Mission. Tank heavy group and an Elementalist who thinks she's a tank. Never had a chance from the get-go. Doomed from the word 'go'. Monks blasted for ineptitude.

Sure, I've had my share of screw-ups and failures and let my PuG down. 'Doh, I forgot to heal Danika'.

In summary, give your PuG monk a break. Try to educate them. If you can't, then they are probably a lost cause anyway. If the mission/quest fails, don't always blame the monk. Unfortunately, we don't carry 'Infuse Intelligence' or 'Remove Stupidity' on our bars.

Ajoo · Oct 02, 2006, 05:45 PM // 17:45

Once, I was playing monk on a PUG and i asked the other monk what he was. He said he was prot and i asked him if he was using divine boon, otherwise the healing would be kinda weak. He then told me he was a bonder.

We started the mission and the monk whispers me saying that he had just found out that afterall he was not a bonder, only prot.
I kept an eye on him to see what he was using and he basically only had 2 skills: extinguish and protective spirit. I asked him why and all he tells me is that he should have gone healing instead of prot.

WTF????????