Curse

Grammar · Jan 18, 2008, 12:32 AM // 00:32

* Divine Healing/Heaven's Delight: increased the area of effect to earshot.
* Patient Spirit: decreased duration to 2 seconds; increased healing to 30..120 Health.
* Restore Life: decreased casting time to 4 seconds.
* Renew Life: decreased casting time to 4 seconds.
* Vengeance: increased damage bonus to +25%; decreased recharge time to 30 seconds.
* Aura of Stability: decreased duration to 1..16 seconds.

Any bites?
Does this change anyone's opinions about rez skills? Hero rez skills maybe?

My initial reaction is "meh", but I thought I'd open it up a bit of discussion, if there is any to be had here.

Tyla · Jan 18, 2008, 12:35 AM // 00:35

I got the same reaction as you.

Stormlord Alex · Jan 18, 2008, 12:49 AM // 00:49

Myeh. Divine and Heaven's still suck. That 2sec cast is asking for a PLeak or something.

I'm still not gonna run hard res on me monk, even less resses that require me to run up and touch the corpse. And for other chars, DPSig is still /win.

Aura of Stability could've done with a hit, it was far too strong on /Mo midliners with a puny Prot spec.

Vengeance is still a waste of a skill slot and is never gonna touch my bar.

The only one I'm interested in is Patient Spirit. When I first saw it during the GW:EN trials, I lol'd and discarded it. Then, after looking at it some more, the time-delay makes for a fairly interesting skill, especially combined with the puny cast time and self-targeting ability.
Now with a shorter wait before the heal, and a stronger heal that isn't laughed at by Kiss, I might just play around with it. It definately has potential uses.

Jan 18, 2008, 12:56 AM // 00:56

Eh, a lot of the monk skills I don't use anyway. I usually use res chant on my heroes as a hard res, but now I'm gonna give them restore life for the decreased cast time. Other than that patient is the only other one I care about.

Grammar · Jan 18, 2008, 02:12 AM // 02:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex

The only one I'm interested in is Patient Spirit. When I first saw it during the GW:EN trials, I lol'd and discarded it. Then, after looking at it some more, the time-delay makes for a fairly interesting skill, especially combined with the puny cast time and self-targeting ability.
Now with a shorter wait before the heal, and a stronger heal that isn't laughed at by Kiss, I might just play around with it. It definately has potential uses.

Patient Spirit's heal is really only 1.25 seconds slower than a 1 sec cast time heal like Kiss (assuming no fast cast) when you consider the 1/4 cast. Still kind of slow (2.25 seconds total to Kiss's 1), but much better than before.

Problem is, I have no idea what role Patient Spirit would fill; or more specifically, which skill it would replace on monk's bar.

Arkantos · Jan 18, 2008, 02:17 AM // 02:17

Patient spirit is meh, still don't see it going on my bar. Aura of stability is still viable, the rest are still crap.

Kwan Xi · Jan 18, 2008, 02:21 AM // 02:21

The Restore and Renew Life changes I guess gives you more of an instinctive to use them over Resurrection Chant I guess.... if you want to run up and touch the corpse and take fire along the way.

I always thought of Patient Spirit was more useful for a Dervish then a monk as the enchantment means a almost free heal for them, probably more useful now since the boost.

Everything else is alright I guess though these are still skills my monk almost never use.

Turtle222 · Jan 18, 2008, 03:00 AM // 03:00

actually restore life is a very nice ress now

Chthon · Jan 18, 2008, 03:19 AM // 03:19

Quote:

* Divine Healing/Heaven's Delight: increased the area of effect to earshot.

Almost viable alternatives to heal party, if not for that awful recharge. (Not that anybody but me thinks heal party is an essential skill...)

Quote:

* Patient Spirit: decreased duration to 2 seconds; increased healing to 30..120 Health.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grammar

Problem is, I have no idea what role Patient Spirit would fill; or more specifically, which skill it would replace on monk's bar.

Patient Spirit is the healing prayers version of RoF. It offers a very similar "time-compression" functionality as RoF, allowing you to respond to a damage event before it happens -- which is useful if damage events are spread out enough that post-event cast time is more valuable than pre-event cast time. You also gain the certainty of a straight heal (sometimes RoF doesn't trigger at all) and the certainty of a fixed heal amount, one that happens to be numerically superior to RoF on average (except against some overpowered PvE monsters, the odds of getting RoF in front of a 57-damage hit on average are pretty darned low). You lose some speed. And you lose the safety net for targets at very low life of negating damage instead of taking the damage then healing it back. All in all, I'd be tempted to use patient spirit over RoF in a lot of situations.

(That said, I still think DKiss is better than either RoF or Patient Spirit in most cases.)

Quote:

Restore Life: decreased casting time to 4 seconds.
* Renew Life: decreased casting time to 4 seconds.

Plus HBoon that's a 2sec cast, with a chance to drop to 1sec with HCT gear. That could make for a truly functional battle rez, at least for the backline (or for everyone if you believe in "the duality"). (If folks around here could get over the mantra of "monks never bring rez," that is...) Definite contenders for the hero rez role.

Quote:

* Vengeance: increased damage bonus to +25%; decreased recharge time to 30 seconds.

Maybe this made vengeance gimmick builds more powerful in RA/TA? IDK. Seriously though, I don't think any amount of buffing the numbers is going to make a fundamentally unwise mechanic into a good choice.

Quote:

* Aura of Stability: decreased duration to 1..16 seconds.

I didn't know anyone was even using this skill, so I have no idea why it gets a nerf.

xDusT II · Jan 18, 2008, 03:50 AM // 03:50

Aura of Stability was nerfed because it allowed a permanent immunity to KD's with a comfortable spec in Protection. Considering KD's are a crucial component to making kills, the nerf was aimed to make mainting this enchantment alot more difficult.

horseradish · Jan 18, 2008, 04:56 AM // 04:56

Patient Spirit --> Dwayna's Kiss could be nice, but it's a bit clunky. I do agree with Chthon about it though. I will have to test it out.

Aura of Stability is a bit nerfed, but it needed one. I figure it's still viable.

I don't care for the other skills.

Syntonic · Jan 18, 2008, 05:45 AM // 05:45

With the Patient Spirit buff, why would you use Gift of Health at all now especially since you can self cast it? Faster recharge, can preprot, 1/4th cast. While I haven't done extensive testing, this particular skill looks far more promising than what you guys are giving it credit for. I'm not sure it's enough to change my builds all that much but there is some potential play with signet of removal and the like though I'm not so sure it'll really change the current monk meta.

Div · Jan 18, 2008, 08:02 AM // 08:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Syntonic

With the Patient Spirit buff, why would you use Gift of Health at all now especially since you can self cast it? Faster recharge, can preprot, 1/4th cast. While I haven't done extensive testing, this particular skill looks far more promising than what you guys are giving it credit for. I'm not sure it's enough to change my builds all that much but there is some potential play with signet of removal and the like though I'm not so sure it'll really change the current monk meta.

Gift heals for 96-114 depending on if you run 9, 10, or 11 heal. Patient spirit heals for 84-96, which is much lower. Most of the times you use gift, you want the bar to go up right away anyways. The only advantage this has is self-targeting, but I don't see it being used over gift. It may serve as a replacement for RoF on WoH bars though.

Ensign · Jan 18, 2008, 09:48 AM // 09:48

Divine Healing is actually pretty good in PvE. I don't think it can be the only party heal on your team, but if you already have some sort of top off heal (Song of Restoration, TNTF, Breath of the Great Dwarf, Protective Was Kaolai, etc), Divine Healing works very well as the second party heal; when used it moves everyone back up to full. It has felt a bit stronger than the two generic party heals I was running before.

For PvP, its extreme vulnerability to interruption, combined with its time sensitivity, make it extremely questionable in my estimation.

Aura of Stability is less dumb as a 3 spec Prot on any /Monk you want, but is still insane on any primary Monk - this nerf didn't go far enough. PvP-only skill though.

Patient Spirit and RoF serve completely different roles - RoF is something that you use when you aren't sure that you would have time to land the spell that would actually save your target, so RoF is used to stabilize him until you have time to land your business spell. It's invaluable in that role. Patient Spirit doesn't do that at all; it's possibly the worst skill on your bar to use on someone at very low health. Patient Spirit, in my evaluation, is like a Signet of Devotion or Signet of Rejuvenation that costs energy instead of time to use. It's a top off heal.

As I generally only use direct healing skills on people at dangerously low health, and otherwise let party healing and other incidental heals clean up the rest, I'm not impressed by Patient Spirit at all. If I wanted to spend energy on a top off skill, I would be using Vigorous Spirit, not Patient Spirit.

Syntonic · Jan 18, 2008, 02:21 PM // 14:21

I agree that it won't really affect many 8v8 bars very much and considering the meta revolves around that, I don't think my statement was completely inaccurate. I still think I'd prefer patient spirit over GoH in 4v4 at this point in time especially due to the self targeting factor. GoH does net you about a 20 point life difference per heal which really stacks up in the long run. I should have chosen my words a bit more carefully though.

Burst Cancel · Jan 18, 2008, 02:48 PM // 14:48

I think the monk change that made the biggest difference was the ability to hotkey hero skills. This allows you to put prots on your hero monks, disable them, and cast on-demand from the keyboard.

ender6 · Jan 18, 2008, 03:48 PM // 15:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

Patient Spirit and RoF serve completely different roles - RoF is something that you use when you aren't sure that you would have time to land the spell that would actually save your target, so RoF is used to stabilize him until you have time to land your business spell. It's invaluable in that role.

Agreed. 12345

Dr Strangelove · Jan 18, 2008, 05:00 PM // 17:00

The only reason I could think of to use patient spirit is [skill]healer's covenant[/skill]. However, that clogs up your elite, and doesn't work very well with much else on your bar. (healing breeze monk, go!)

Grammar · Jan 18, 2008, 06:32 PM // 18:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burst Cancel

I think the monk change that made the biggest difference was the ability to hotkey hero skills. This allows you to put prots on your hero monks, disable them, and cast on-demand from the keyboard.

I have to agree with you here. Makes Aegis chaining much easier.

And I played around a bit with Patient Spirit and the touch rez skills.......still not a fan.

JoeKnowMo · Jan 18, 2008, 07:53 PM // 19:53

I tried Patient Spirit in HM and didn't like the results. I often ended up overhealing because the hench heals would take effect first. And it usually didn't save a target with low health.