Curse

Helcaraxe · Apr 20, 2007, 04:10 AM // 04:10

So with the release of hard mode mesmer were supposed to receive a bit of a buff. Well, it's safe to say I see it a little bit. While doing HM Fort Ranik all of the Charr Maryrs are packing Shield of Judgement which raped our MM and warrior... luckily for them there was a mesmer in the party with an enchant removal. They all thanked me for coming along and not sucking... and I told them to make sure they tell all their friend that a mesmer actually served a purpose in PvE.

I have to say I'm extrememly happy right now. If anyone else has a similar experience go ahead and post it here, I's like to see if HM changes things like we hoped it would in the long run.

Mesmer in Need · Apr 20, 2007, 04:13 AM // 04:13

The graws on great norther wall have healing hands... my dream has come true... time to interrupt some shiat.

XvArchonvX · Apr 20, 2007, 04:44 AM // 04:44

Yup, E-denial is now a viable strategy in PvE!!

Carboplatin · Apr 20, 2007, 04:58 AM // 04:58

mesmers as enchant strippers? i would think they made them more useful then that. necros are much better enchant strippers, i hope mesmers have other uses..

ume kurosaki · Apr 20, 2007, 04:59 AM // 04:59

Not to mention that with the increased cast and attack speeds, Empathy and Backfire are even more powerful than before.

Guardian of the Light · Apr 20, 2007, 05:46 AM // 05:46

I've noticed you need someone in the party to disarm casters. While this doesn't always mean having to bring a mesmer (ranger with broadheaded arrow can fill the postition), Mesmers are a clear option and most likely best to fit this.

LONGA · Apr 20, 2007, 08:02 AM // 08:02

Dont forget that mesmer have a pre-Interupt spells. Like guilt,shame and mistrust. Work so good draining down Ele's energy.

fripple · Apr 20, 2007, 09:40 AM // 09:40

Except that SS is vastly more powerful than either empathy or backfire for the simple reasons that it triggers more often and also hits other enemies. And, you know, costs less than backfire and the same as empathy, and necros have the energy to spread it to multiple targets much more easily.

And how you need to further gimp your bar with a mandatory slowdown hex just to catch basic spells because all mobs now have a 16 in fast cast and personal skill went out the window.

And how shutdown is largely ineffective since all mobs are also operating with a permanent, unstrippable mantra of recall.

Not to say mesmers aren't helpful; they are. But it's not really an improvement so much as this time the cheap-ass gimmicks they decided on are things mesmers can actually effect, instead of doing nothing like in DoA. I think this will be of much more benefit to necros, who can do all the important things on a larger scale, than to mesmers.

Winstar · Apr 20, 2007, 09:43 AM // 09:43

If Shield of Judgement rapes your warrior get another warrior.

Patrick Smit · Apr 20, 2007, 09:54 AM // 09:54

Try somewhat more challenging areas and then see if your judgment will still hold. An upgraded "GrawlYak" is too simple to pass judgement to my opinion. And the damage in these areas is still very limited.

I'm curious how mm's are holding out?

Pwny Ride · Apr 20, 2007, 12:30 PM // 12:30

Shame that 'holy trinity' still exists at all

Patrick Smit · Apr 20, 2007, 12:54 PM // 12:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by XvArchonvX

Yup, E-denial is now a viable strategy in PvE!!

Yup you will most likely feel it very well when the mobs apply it to you at attribute lvl 20

Terra Xin · Apr 20, 2007, 01:28 PM // 13:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by fripple

And how you need to further gimp your bar with a mandatory slowdown hex just to catch basic spells because all mobs now have a 16 in fast cast and personal skill went out the window.

And how shutdown is largely ineffective since all mobs are also operating with a permanent, unstrippable mantra of recall.

Not to say mesmers aren't helpful; they are. But it's not really an improvement so much as this time the cheap-ass gimmicks they decided on are things mesmers can actually effect, instead of doing nothing like in DoA. I think this will be of much more benefit to necros, who can do all the important things on a larger scale, than to mesmers.

Why is this guy only talking about mesmer mobs, and assuming that every mob in hard mode is a mesmer???

And Mantra of Recall isn't strippable?? Have you even tried shutdown in hardmode?? It makes a very big difference when you have an enemy monk using an actual skillbar.

I don't like it when people provide a 5 minute judgement on the Mesmer class, without actually testing them out in most of the areas.

Quote:

I'm curious how mm's are holding out?

Well I did some parts in Maguuma Jungle with Olias as my MM, and he got raped by his own minions because the skales carry verata's gaze. :P

Redfeather1975 · Apr 20, 2007, 05:22 PM // 17:22

Terra Xin, I thought he was referring to how all mobs have half cast and half recharge and comparing them to the equivalent to having a 16 in FC and having a free Mantra of Recovery (although he said Recall).

XvArchonvX · Apr 20, 2007, 05:22 PM // 17:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrick Smit

I'm curious how mm's are holding out?

They are still a viable build in many areas, but they definately don't work everywhere. I would say that MMs are now more balanced with HM and not a perfect end-all damage dealer like they were in a lot of PvE previously.

Redfeather1975 · Apr 20, 2007, 05:25 PM // 17:25

Has anyone tried the trail by Seitung Harbour? The ones with the Mantids.
It's so insanely hard.

Skarigon · Apr 20, 2007, 05:32 PM // 17:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redfeather1975

Has anyone tried the trail by Seitung Harbour? The ones with the Mantids.
It's so insanely hard.

I agree, I even tryed that and barely killed the first group =P

fripple · Apr 20, 2007, 06:20 PM // 18:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skarigon

I agree, I even tryed that and barely killed the first group =P

It's not difficult; very little about 'hard mode' is difficult once you know what cheap-ass tricks they've applied. Just bring a ton of anti-cast skills and start from Seitung.

But yes, my earlier point was that all monsters cast and recharge faster (d'oh about the recall/recovery mixup; I'm always doing that), not just the mesmer ones, thus making things more difficult specifically for mesmers and interrupt rangers, who are supposed to be able to control enemy casting.

XvArchonvX · Apr 20, 2007, 06:31 PM // 18:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by fripple

But yes, my earlier point was that all monsters cast and recharge faster (d'oh about the recall/recovery mixup; I'm always doing that), not just the mesmer ones, thus making things more difficult specifically for mesmers and interrupt rangers, who are supposed to be able to control enemy casting.

Twitch interupts are harder to use now, but there are still plenty of interuption options to mesmers such as [skill]Mistrust[/skill], [skill]Guilt[/skill], [skill]Shame[/skill], [skill]Clumsiness[/skill], [skill]Ineptitude[/skill], etc. Rangers still have [skill]Broad Head Arrow[/skill] and spammable interupts like [skill]Practiced Stance[/skill] + [skill]Choking Gas[/skill] or [skill]Serpent's Quickness[/skill] + [skill]Incendiary Arrows[/skill].

fripple · Apr 20, 2007, 06:39 PM // 18:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by XvArchonvX

Twitch interupts are harder to use now, but there are still plenty of interuption options to mesmers such as [skill]Mistrust[/skill], [skill]Guilt[/skill], [skill]Shame[/skill], [skill]Clumsiness[/skill], [skill]Ineptitude[/skill], etc. Rangers still have [skill]Broad Head Arrow[/skill] and spammable interupts like [skill]Practiced Stance[/skill] + [skill]Choking Gas[/skill] or [skill]Serpent's Quickness[/skill] + [skill]Incendiary Arrows[/skill].

Yes, I know how to play the game, thank you. My point was the actual skill involved in interrupting in pve has been all but eliminated because you either have to rely on fire-and-forget effects like Guilt (which is a stupid skill to bring because you can only use once in 30 seconds and it doesn't even do proper shutdown with halved recharges) or a daze/slowcast hex to bring proper interrupts, which are supposed to be viably powerful, to bear.

I'd note also that those rangers skills are infinitely better at spammable interrupts; the mesmer ones, aside from clumsiness, have too much recharge to be properly useful as replacements for things like power drain/spike/cof. Ineptitude still serves the purpose it did in regular mode, and is about the same level of usefulness.

This also effects e-management, since drain and leech are much harder to use (unless you get lucky and they cast a 2-3-second spell) without wasting another 10 energy slowing the caster down.