Curse

lundis · Nov 17, 2008, 09:22 AM // 09:22

I've had a break from GW for a while, but returned recently. Last night I was vanquishing and doing the Shiro's Return(HM) book together with a friend that played Dervish. We were laughing at all the noobs (yes, this is a personal attack) who thinks that Mesmers suck in PvE.

Today I thought I should check gwguru if anyone had figured out any new builds, but nothing has changed in the past 6 months it seems, I clicked my way to this forum and as usual I find some Wammo (gotta be one, anyway) saying that Mesmers don't deal any dmg in PvE. Lol? I can't stand playing other classes in HM because of their lack of dmg and fastcasting. There's no use arguing with idiots, so I'll just post my current build here.

By the way, I'm a 100% PvE Mesmer (done like 10 ABs though) and have played it for 1400 hours, call me a noob or anything, I don't care, Mesmers will still rock in PvE. Now, HM is the place where we do most good, if you think Mesmers are bad in low-lvl areas such as Kourna, play HM.

Attributes & Armor
Fast casting - 10+1
Domination - 11+1+3 (yes I'm using a sup rune and love it)
Inspiration - 10+1

As for armor I use prodigy's insignias (+armor while skills are recharging).

[build prof=Mesmer/Necromancer][Drain Enchantment][Necrosis][Optional][Backfire][Empathy][Visions of Regret][Ether Signet][Sunspear Rebirth Signet][/build]

You can swap Ether Signet for [skill]Auspicious Incantation[/skill]. It should be better in most cases and will enable you to use [skill]Cry of Pain[/skill] as optional effectively.

The optional skill should be area-dependent. Skills I often use are [skill]Mistrust[/skill][skill]Power Spike[/skill][skill]Cry of Frustration[/skill] and the Ebon Battle Standards. [skill]Pain Inverter[/skill] is a bit overkill but is useful every now and then. For Wardens in the Kurzick forest [skill]Spiritual Pain[/skill] is really good, and should be combined with [skill]Waste Not, Want Not[/skill] (target the spirits). There are many more good skills, but I can't mention everything here.

Random Tactics (seeing as this is a very important aspect of being successful as a Mesmer, I just had to add it

)

Avoid Party Wipes. If there will be many foes dealing very high dmg in an area, bring a hero using [skill]Protective Spirit[/skill] and [skill]Spirit Bond[/skill], flag your heroes outside aggro range and cast protective spirit and spirit bond on yourself, then aggro. You will negate all the spikes, while you cast visions of regret and backfire to hopefully eliminate the threat before the rest of your party rushes in.

Use the Terrain, this is a basic skill that nearly 80% of the players ignore. Don't let the foes attack you if you could be standing behind a rock/wall/whatever. Always strive to be on a higher ground than your enemy, this will increase your party's critical hit ratio.

Know Your Enemies. If you don't enjoy learning what skills your enemies use, PvE-Mesmer probably isn't the right thing for you. if there won't be any enchantments, replace Drain Enchantment for something else. And if you're in a party where no one uses any hexes nor conditions, using another build might be the best option. Most important, learn which foe is most dangerous to your party and kill it, usually it's Eles but Mesmers and Ritualists can also be tough, not to mention the monks who heals them.

Use Your Build Well. Do not cast all skills on one foe, then you will have no energy and a bunch of living enemies. For example you can cast Empathy on a warrior, Backfire on a monk and VoR on whoever is standing close to each other. For those who has only played melee classes, who often stick to one foe, this might seem confusing. Remember, you want your hexes to do as much dmg as possible, if a foe is almost dead, don't cast backfire on it, unless it's critical for the mission's success.

upier · Nov 17, 2008, 10:58 AM // 10:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by lundis

Attributes & Armor
Fast casting - 10+1
Domination - 11+1+3 (yes I'm using a sup rune and love it)
Inspiration - 10+1

As for armor I use prodigy's insignias (+armor while skills are recharging).

[build prof=Mesmer/Necromancer][Drain Enchantment][Necrosis][Optional][Backfire][Empathy][Visions of Regret][Ether Signet][Sunspear Rebirth Signet][/build]

Or you could run:
Dom 12
SR 11 ( or alternatively 10)
Curses 9 ( depending on your SR investment - 10)
[Rip enchantment][Backfire][Empathy][Visions of Regret][Necrosis][Sunspear Rebirth Signet][mindbender][Enfeebling Blood]
(Mindbender/SRS are of course the most optional skills here. They can easily be replaced by some godly Curses or any of the Domination skills you listed. Run a 40/40 set.)

Despite what you think - we are not bad.
But it's nice you are having fun with your mesmer!

lundis · Nov 17, 2008, 11:57 AM // 11:57

Lol that completely killed all practical purposes of my build

And I didn't said you were bad (not in that way, anyway), just that mesmers are good in PvE as well, unlike some ppl, who spams the mesmer forums with negativity, states.

Rise mesmers, rise!

Daisuko · Nov 17, 2008, 01:08 PM // 13:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by lundis

Lol that completely killed all practical purposes of my build

And I didn't said you were bad (not in that way, anyway), just that mesmers are good in PvE as well, unlike some ppl, who spams the mesmer forums with negativity, states.

Rise mesmers, rise!

Actually, mesmers are pretty terribad in PvE. Not to say you can't use them, just other things would be better

Only thing mesmer's especially good at is Signet of Illusions for gimmicky stuff. Anything else, and you could run a very similar (or better) build on some other class. (Again, not to say you COULDN'T use a mesmer, just that others would be better)

upier · Nov 17, 2008, 01:58 PM // 13:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daisuko

Actually, mesmers are pretty terribad in PvE. Not to say you can't use them, just other things would be better

Only thing mesmer's especially good at is Signet of Illusions for gimmicky stuff. Anything else, and you could run a very similar (or better) build on some other class. (Again, not to say you COULDN'T use a mesmer, just that others would be better)

No wonder you think mesmers are bad.
If a person thinks that the best thing a mesmer can do in PvE is SoI - it's really not surprising that your verdict on them is so negative.

Say it with me:
Mesmers aren't bad in PvE.
That really doesn't have to do much with the class itself - it has more to do with PvE itself. PvE is designed to allow a playstyle that SHOULD fail to not do so. You can still win PvE as long as you don't overdo it in the failing department.
And considering that the defectiveness of the class is measured on the skill of the better players, who do NOT fail, the class can NOT be bad.

The problem arises when you look at the fact that GW has 10 classes, 8 party slots and that one isn't limited to running just one party member of the specific class. So the fact that something is not bad isn't enough - you want the best. And the best mesmer options aren't exclusive to the mesmer primary.

They aren't bad - they just aren't among the best.
But like I said - that is completely and utterly sufficient for PvE.
Fun above all.

kostolomac · Nov 17, 2008, 02:30 PM // 14:30

Mesmers can do some nice damage , but only with pve skills and CoP.
We should get an AP clone elite so that we don't have to spec in DA and be a Me/A.
And why does everyone use backfire when that skill isn't that good.
Here's my build: [build=PvE mes;OQdUAQxOG/SLQGg2gbAmO2kxkCAA]

The Arching Healer · Nov 17, 2008, 02:43 PM // 14:43

Actually the build that the topic starter copied from pvx wiki fails badly in PvE. Why woudl you ever use a 20 recharge hex in pve where mobs die in 3 seconds? \o/ Don't call other people noob plxz okthnxbai.

lundis · Nov 17, 2008, 03:18 PM // 15:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Arching Healer

Actually the build that the topic starter copied from pvx wiki fails badly in PvE. Why woudl you ever use a 20 recharge hex in pve where mobs die in 3 seconds? \o/ Don't call other people noob plxz okthnxbai.

Well, too bad for you, I made the build up myself through trial and error (and don't come whining stuff like "how are you going to prove that?", I'll just ask the same right back at you).

Why do ppl use meteor shower? 60s cooldown sucks 3x more....

Backfire is used to take out casters quickly

Quote:

Originally Posted by kostolomac

Mesmers can do some nice damage , but only with pve skills and CoP.

Did you try my build? You can swap necrosis for overload for a non-pve-only build, the 320dmg spikes are great.

wind fire and ice · Nov 17, 2008, 03:26 PM // 15:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by kostolomac

Mesmers can do some nice damage , but only with pve skills and CoP.
We should get an AP clone elite so that we don't have to spec in DA and be a Me/A.
And why does everyone use backfire when that skill isn't that good.
Here's my build: [build=PvE mes;OQdUAQxOG/SLQGg2gbAmO2kxkCAA]

His build is one of the better ones you will find for a mez-long recharges kill mesmers in pve.

petrorabbit · Nov 17, 2008, 03:34 PM // 15:34

I'm surprised you don't have [Cry of Pain] in your build or in its variants.

Any reason why?

Painbringer · Nov 17, 2008, 03:56 PM // 15:56

No sins?

[assassins promise] (optional hex of choice) [cry of pain][Auspicious Incantation] [Ebon Vanguard Assassin Support] Repeat Repeat Repeat

Throw enough at them and its win win win

Why the ether signet? Auspicious has better recharge and no requirements to use

lundis · Nov 17, 2008, 04:22 PM // 16:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by petrorabbit

I'm surprised you don't have [Cry of Pain] in your build or in its variants.

Any reason why?

I did use it before, but I couldn't use it properly due to energy management issues. Unless you improve the energy management it's not really worth it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Painbringer

No sins?

[assassins promise] (optional hex of choice) [cry of pain][Auspicious Incantation] [Ebon Vanguard Assassin Support] Repeat Repeat Repeat

Throw enough at them and its win win win

Why the ether signet? Auspicious has better recharge and no requirements to use

I find that build rather booring ^^

EDIT: I misunderstood Auspicious Incantation a bit, it's much better than ether signet, I'll start using it right away

ac1inferno · Nov 17, 2008, 04:49 PM // 16:49

[build name= prof=mesme/eleme fastca=11+1+2 domination=11+2 inspi=8+1][Mantra of Recovery][Backfire][Empathy][Cry of Pain][Optional][Power Drain][Glyph of Lesser Energy][Resurrection Signet][/build]
[[Cry of Frustration]
[[Alkar's Alchemical Acid] if fighting Destroyers.
Ebon Battle Standards, or [[Great Dwarf Armor] and [[Great Dwarf Weapon] for buffing allies.
Many other skills, keep in mind they recharge 33% faster.

kostolomac · Nov 17, 2008, 07:02 PM // 19:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by lundis

Did you try my build? You can swap necrosis for overload for a non-pve-only build, the 320dmg spikes are great.

Yeah , necrosis is neat. Also VoR, backfire and empathy are nice but they are too conditional for my taste. The only time I would take backfire is for those sandstorm crags because they spam stone daggers.

petrorabbit · Nov 17, 2008, 07:25 PM // 19:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by lundis

I did use it before, but I couldn't use it properly due to energy management issues. Unless you improve the energy management it's not really worth it.

Quote:

EDIT: I misunderstood Auspicious Incantation a bit, it's much better than ether signet, I'll start using it right away

Problem solved?

Pwny Ride · Nov 18, 2008, 07:39 AM // 07:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by kostolomac

Yeah , necrosis is neat. Also VoR, backfire and empathy are nice but they are too conditional for my taste. The only time I would take backfire is for those sandstorm crags because they spam stone daggers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kostolomac

too conditional for my taste.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kostolomac

too conditional

Im not sure if mesmer is the right way to go then?

lundis · Nov 18, 2008, 11:07 AM // 11:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by petrorabbit

Problem solved?

It might be solved, indeed. But when using AI you need to keep your energy at 10-15 to use it effectively, thus decreasing your ability to spike. And the extra recharge is annoying sometimes, but I guess that once you get used to it, it'll be great.

kostolomac, VoR damages the foes whatever skills they use and it's AoE. The chance that none of the hexed foes would use any skills is extremely low. As for Empathy and Backfire, spellcasters always cast spells(unless their hp is below 140, then they won't cast to avoid dying by Backfire) and warriors/assas/rangers/etc attacks until they die. To me these skills are less conditional than Assassin dual strikes.

kostolomac · Nov 18, 2008, 02:52 PM // 14:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pwny Ride

Im not sure if mesmer is the right way to go then?

Yeah it is , I like the armor , skill icons and everything about the class , but in HM I can't wait for the monster to attack and deal damage to itself and hurt my teammates , I need to take the matter in my own hands and that's why CoP nuking rocks

But I still use VoR on a hero since it's sweet

@lundis:
I know how VoR is AoE and backfire and empathy. The thing about backfire is that you need to use it before the caster starts casting spells since the AI just uses all the skills without much thought , if you miss that interval backfire isn't that effective.And in HM the cast speeds of the enemy is fast as hell so you best use it as an opening skill. About empathy , many times the hexed monster just jumps from one target to another not attacking rending empathy useles. VoR is sweet , but it's only better than Ap because of the awesome skill icon.

In the end personal preference decides. I like blowing shi*t up with CoP and someone likes to look how the enemy kills himself , to each his own

lundis · Nov 18, 2008, 09:27 PM // 21:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by kostolomac

but it's only better than Ap because of the awesome skill icon.

Lol, that sounds just like something I would say. And it's nice to see that I'm not the only one who likes the skill icons.

Shooshu · Nov 18, 2008, 09:36 PM // 21:36

[ineptitude][wandering eye][clumsiness][signet of clumsiness][pain inverter][never surrender][fall back][ressurection signet]

used this to vanquish alot of places. it rocks.