Curse

s73ve_o · Feb 18, 2009, 07:55 PM // 19:55

starting a mes for the fisrt time, inda thought degen might be ok for PvE (non HM of course)

[Arcane Echo][Life Transfer][Life Siphon][Conjure Phantasm][Kitah's Burden][Ether Nightmare][Signet of Corruption][Sunspear Rebirth Signet]

what do you guys think, i know its gonna have some energy problems most likely.

zelgadissan · Feb 18, 2009, 08:04 PM // 20:04

Degen caps at 10, which is the equivalent of 20dps, so having Signet of Corruption as your most damaging skill is...awful. Not to mention your only energy management is through Signet of Corruption on a 20s recharge.

Degen builds can be fun as long as you're not expecting it to be ridiculously damaging - I ran an [[Illusion of Pain] build for ages - but this isn't exactly the best way to go about it.

Edit: dropping Conjure Nightmare for Kitah's Burden will help with energy, but not the fact that all your damage is coming from only drains.

s73ve_o · Feb 18, 2009, 08:17 PM // 20:17

yeah im not hexing 1 guy, id hex, tab, hex, tab, etc

Painbringer · Feb 18, 2009, 09:20 PM // 21:20

I would suggest [blood drinker] [Angorodon's Gaze] it is a good tandem mixed with all the health you will be getting from [life transfer]
no need for [life siphon] IMO

[ether nightmare] [cry of pain] [Auspicious incantation] Would work well to if PVE

ac1inferno · Feb 18, 2009, 09:25 PM // 21:25

I would think a Necro is better for degening, but just for the sake of it, here's a degen Mesmer build that might work decently.

[build prof=me/e ill=11+1 fast=10+1+1 ins=10+1][fevered dreams][shrinking armor][accumulated pain][drain delusions][glyph of lesser energy][ether nightmare][cry of pain][sunspear rebirth signet][/build]

Zodiac Meteor · Feb 18, 2009, 09:29 PM // 21:29

Degen fails, regen fails.

[healing breeze] is horrible along with [conjure phantasm]. The top is -10 degen along with +10 regen. -20 damage a second right?

MATH TIME!
[[email protected]]
105 damage.

[conjure [email protected]]
14 seconds.

10x14 = 140 damage in 14 seconds.
105 damage in 2 seconds.

Hmmmm, 14 or 2?

Now lets include recharge and casting time!
[fireball] casts in 8 seconds (Including casting time)
In 16 seconds with one spell you do 210 damage.

Now lets spam [[email protected]]!
60 damage in 1 second.
vs.
Lets say 15 seconds of -10 degen.

20x15 = 300 damage.
Casting flare 15 times = 900 damage.

You get it? With a weak spell like flare you do more damage than -10 degen.

own age myname · Feb 18, 2009, 09:32 PM // 21:32

I'd put [Cry of Pain] somewhere in their personally.

lewis91 · Feb 18, 2009, 09:44 PM // 21:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zodiac Meteor

Degen fails, regen fails.

[healing breeze] is horrible along with [conjure phantasm]. The top is -10 degen along with +10 regen. -20 damage a second right?

MATH TIME!
[[email protected]]
105 damage.

[conjure [email protected]]
14 seconds.

10x14 = 140 damage in 14 seconds.
105 damage in 2 seconds.

Hmmmm, 14 or 2?

Now lets include recharge and casting time!
[fireball] casts in 8 seconds (Including casting time)
In 16 seconds with one spell you do 210 damage.

Now lets spam [[email protected]]!
60 damage in 1 second.
vs.
Lets say 15 seconds of -10 degen.

20x15 = 300 damage.
Casting flare 15 times = 900 damage.

You get it? With a weak spell like flare you do more damage than -10 degen.

I have to agree with this guy. Plus degen is very easy to heal because it takes a long time to do a damaging effect. Whereas spamming fireball or any other high dmg skills is hard to heal. And in my mind i prefere VoR, i know i know, everyone uses that, but c'mon, ball'd up enemy groups...you go cast it on one, itl cast on all, being crazily effective.

Icy The Mage · Feb 18, 2009, 10:09 PM // 22:09

[Cry of Pain] is a useful skill to have with all the Mesmer hexes you're throwing around.

MasterSasori · Feb 18, 2009, 10:14 PM // 22:14

Degen mesmers are pretty bad in general. If you run a mesmer, you should probably stick to shutting down which is the traditional mesmer role.

If you want damage, think of useful skills that do damage in addition to a useful ability such as Power Spike or Energy surge.

zelgadissan · Feb 18, 2009, 10:17 PM // 22:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zodiac Meteor

skill math

While forgetting to account for .75 aftercast, the general point of this post is correct and more or less what I was trying to gently imply in my first post.

If you find degen fun, run degen, but just realize it's horribly inefficient.

kostolomac · Feb 18, 2009, 10:20 PM // 22:20

Degen sucks 90% of the time in pve. The illusion line has [Wandering Eye] and [Clumsiness] which is way better than degen. With a necro secondary [Enfeebling Blood] and the curses line is a good choice too rather than blood magic.

Steps_Descending · Feb 18, 2009, 10:23 PM // 22:23

To the OP, in PvE degen is ineficient. If you want DoT's you,d better look at [empathy]/[backfire ](along with (arcane)echo and the elite versions you'll find later).

If you already have some experience throught the game tought, in PvP, a degen mesmer can be of some use. But you will probably be half degen, mostly with with secondary effects ([Shrinking Armor]&others), and the other half being damage or disruption skills.

Antares Ascending · Feb 18, 2009, 10:45 PM // 22:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zodiac Meteor

Degen fails, regen fails.

[healing breeze] is horrible along with [conjure phantasm]. The top is -10 degen along with +10 regen. -20 damage a second right?

MATH TIME!
[[email protected]]
105 damage.

[conjure [email protected]]
14 seconds.

10x14 = 140 damage in 14 seconds.
105 damage in 2 seconds.

Hmmmm, 14 or 2?

Now lets include recharge and casting time!
[fireball] casts in 8 seconds (Including casting time)
In 16 seconds with one spell you do 210 damage.

Now lets spam [[email protected]]!
60 damage in 1 second.
vs.
Lets say 15 seconds of -10 degen.

20x15 = 300 damage.
Casting flare 15 times = 900 damage.

You get it? With a weak spell like flare you do more damage than -10 degen.

While I agree degen isn't my favorite (it does have its place tho) you can't compare spell damage which has to go through armor to degen or armor ignoring skills.

Try fireball, flare..whatever, and check out the actual damage done

MasterSasori · Feb 18, 2009, 10:56 PM // 22:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zodiac Meteor

Degen fails, regen fails.

[healing breeze] is horrible along with [conjure phantasm]. The top is -10 degen along with +10 regen. -20 damage a second right?

MATH TIME!
[[email protected]]
105 damage.

[conjure [email protected]]
14 seconds.

10x14 = 140 damage in 14 seconds.
105 damage in 2 seconds.

Hmmmm, 14 or 2?

Now lets include recharge and casting time!
[fireball] casts in 8 seconds (Including casting time)
In 16 seconds with one spell you do 210 damage.

Now lets spam [[email protected]]!
60 damage in 1 second.
vs.
Lets say 15 seconds of -10 degen.

20x15 = 300 damage.
Casting flare 15 times = 900 damage.

You get it? With a weak spell like flare you do more damage than -10 degen.

conjure phantasm > flare spam. At least using conjure phantasm won't occupy all 15 seconds of time.

But this post is right: Degen is epic fail.

Antares Ascending · Feb 18, 2009, 11:05 PM // 23:05

. As stated, degen has a place but is not my fav..although it does have its place.

THE point was that degen damage is unconditional while spell damage is not.

And realy

no one spams flare for 15 seconds. hmm, at least I hope not!

If you don't like using Flare ( bad choice) then use fireball which does't have a single target damage equal to degen mentioned but does have the ability to do damage to adjacent foes

There are places degen works well..Dragon's Lair is one of many.
Do I use it..sparingly.

Never,Never go with a skill bar loaded with degen.

pingu666 · Feb 19, 2009, 06:19 AM // 06:19

limit yourself to one or 2 degen spells, unless you can do aoe degen, then your accululative dps wont be too shabby

Stealth Bomberman · Feb 19, 2009, 05:24 PM // 17:24

only degen i would find useful in pve is [ether nightmare]. other than that, illusion is more or less a tactical line than domination.

refer · Feb 23, 2009, 04:16 AM // 04:16

Maybe if they removed the cap for illusion magic or did something. Make a skill that allows stacking multiple copies of the same hex on a person or breaking the -10 limit... I mean it is called ILLUSION MAGIC.

Taisayacho · Feb 23, 2009, 04:19 AM // 04:19

life transfer is bad. degen is bad.

end of story.