Curse

haine111 · Nov 15, 2009, 07:05 AM // 07:05

Ok, I've been hearing how Mesmer=good for nothing in PvE... well I beg to differ and just wanted to share my build that i've found successfull from Pre-searing to Hell's Precipice.

To start off the attributes I find useful.. keep in mind this is at level 20.

Fast Casting (13)
Illusion Magic (0)
Domination Magic (16)
Inspiration Magic (4)
*note*
I personally dont use Secondary skills or attributes.

Fast Casting and Domination Magic are runed at +3 with a
+1 domination mask.

Skills used are:

Empathy (used on melee and casters alike, just a great added DPS)

Energy Burn (a DD used for the dead moments when other skills are on cooldown)

Backfire (used for casters... a wicked damage dealer)

Ether Feast (for some of those hairy moments)

Power Spike (another anti-caster shutdown-damage spell.. to be used on priority spells. I.E. Meteor on hydra)

Filler Spell (I use Mind Wrack)

Chaos Storm (used when both DDs are used and mobs are almost dead.. most likely not used if you dont have 3+ mobs)

*Elite Skill* (not required) Energy Surge (another DD and AoE for used just like Energy Burn)

This as worked for me and hope it works for you.. Enjoy and feel free to ask questions.

MercenaryKnight · Nov 15, 2009, 07:28 AM // 07:28

You need a lot of energy to cast all those spells. Chaos storm would trigger the aoe scatter I believe. Most likely you'd want to run Visions of Regret if you are focusing on damage.

The problem is that the mesmer can't dish out non stop damage as easily as a spiteful spirit/ mark of pain necromancer. Or insert other random high damage casters.

Best thing you can use a hero for is godly interrupts (but were not using a hero).

Very limited in good high damage/ useful mesmer builds that are worth not using something else.

Lifestyle · Nov 15, 2009, 09:00 AM // 09:00

I'd personaly just run an elite like RoJ or something and echo chain it. ;>

subarucar · Nov 15, 2009, 11:25 AM // 11:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by haine111

Fast Casting and Domination Magic are runed at +3 with a
+1 domination mask.

Double superiors ewww. Maybe use one for dom, but nothing more. FC should only ned a minor.

AlexanderMorpheus · Nov 15, 2009, 01:05 PM // 13:05

Who says mesmers are good for nothing in pve ?
Anyways IMO Illusion is better for pve, i run

Fragility
Fevered Dreams
You Move Like A Dwarf
You Are All Weaklings
Phantom Pain
Drain Delusions
Necrosis
Drain Enchant or some other e management

^ That with 3 discord heroes will get you good for most pve (except elite areas) , also the AP spike build for mes works well

Yuna Matsumarui · Nov 15, 2009, 01:15 PM // 13:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by haine111

)
...
Filler Spell (I use Mind Wrack)
...
Chaos Storm (used when both DDs are used and mobs are almost dead.. most likely not used if you dont have 3+ mobs)
...

no offense, but you're bad. empathy as an added DPS I can understand, Backfire does great damage, but most of us run 1 player parties with heroes and henchman. the moment you cast empathy on something, it will probably be killed pretty soon as the h/h will target it and use skills.

Mind wrack as a filler hex. wth? you're only using 2 spells which drain energy, 2 bad ones. unless spamming necrosis mind wrack is bad.

also, Chaos storm is a lame AoE spell, granted it deal armor ignoring damage, but most of the time non-armor ignoring damage deals more.

as said before, Visions of Regret will probably outdamage this build..

(not even mentioning the fact that this is a stand-alone build, I can't come up with a team that synergises well with this.)

Gift3d · Nov 15, 2009, 01:23 PM // 13:23

mind wrack (or any expendable hex for cop)
cry of pain
power spike
cry of frustration
you move like a dwarf
finish him
assassin's promise
guilt

just about the only pve bar that i find doesn't blow rancid ass for a mesmer. second being echo, necrosis, 6 random skills

visions of regret is particularly bad cause if you're running anything close to a decent build it'll pop maybe 1-2 times before whatever you're casting it on dies.

Xenomortis · Nov 15, 2009, 03:04 PM // 15:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexanderMorpheus

Who says mesmers are good for nothing in pve ?
Anyways IMO Illusion is better for pve, i run

Fragility
Fevered Dreams
You Move Like A Dwarf
You Are All Weaklings
Phantom Pain
Drain Delusions
Necrosis
Drain Enchant or some other e management

^ That with 3 discord heroes will get you good for most pve (except elite areas) , also the AP spike build for mes works well

Finish Him over Necrosis and I prefer Ash Blast for Blind over Phantom Pain.
Drain Delusions can be used on Fragility without problems.

Chthon · Nov 15, 2009, 03:58 PM // 15:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

Finish Him over Necrosis and I prefer Ash Blast for Blind over Phantom Pain.
Drain Delusions can be used on Fragility without problems.

This.

And strongly consider whether Extend Conditions might serve you better than Fevered Dreams.

Also, historical note: Mesmers did have a couple of other decent builds that revolved around CoP before it got nerfed to heck.

And, not to be mean, but OP, your build is truly, profoundly awful. Since going through what all is wrong with it would take quite a bit of time and be of little benefit to anyone else, I'm not going to make the effort unless you tell me that you're interested in hearing it.

Xenomortis · Nov 15, 2009, 04:12 PM // 16:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chthon

This.

And strongly consider whether Extend Conditions might serve you better than Fevered Dreams.

I cannot think why EC would be better than FD. FD has greater range, acts preemptively and causes Dazed.
The downside is having to cast a 2 second hex first, but that's rarely a problem.

Chthon · Nov 15, 2009, 04:43 PM // 16:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

I cannot think why EC would be better than FD. FD has greater range, acts preemptively and causes Dazed.
The downside is having to cast a 2 second hex first, but that's rarely a problem.

FD locks you into one target and requires you to successfully execute the condition stack, before the target dies, without the target getting too far away from other things you want conditioned. If any one of those factors goes wrong, you need to wait out the recharge on every skill you used in order to restart the process. That's going to be 8-10 sec at minimum.

Conversely, EC can be used after a successful condition stack - or even in the middle of the process if the target is dying too quickly. While the per-cast range is smaller, EC can be daisy-chained to spread over a greater total distance so long as there are intermediate monsters within nearby range. Perhaps most importantly, you only have to get the condition stack right ONCE. After that, it's just EC, EC, EC to keep everything locked down indefinitely.

Bottom line: If your primary objective is doing damage with Frag, use FD. If your primary goal is locking down the monsters, use EC.

(On the topic of doing damage with Frag, why not GoI+Steam in place of Ash Blast?)

Xenomortis · Nov 15, 2009, 04:55 PM // 16:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chthon

FD locks you into one target and requires you to successfully execute the condition stack, before the target dies, without the target getting too far away from other things you want conditioned. If any one of those factors goes wrong, you need to wait out the recharge on every skill you used in order to restart the process. That's going to be 8-10 sec at minimum.

Conversely, EC can be used after a successful condition stack - or even in the middle of the process if the target is dying too quickly. While the per-cast range is smaller, EC can be daisy-chained to spread over a greater total distance so long as there are intermediate monsters within nearby range. Perhaps most importantly, you only have to get the condition stack right ONCE. After that, it's just EC, EC, EC to keep everything locked down indefinitely.

Bottom line: If your primary objective is doing damage with Frag, use FD. If your primary goal is locking down the monsters, use EC.

(On the topic of doing damage with Frag, why not GoI+Steam in place of Ash Blast?)

Bleh.
Without Dazed, you basically piss off physicals only. FD is really useful because of Dazed - you interrupt half of the nasty stuff casters can get off.
Damage from fragility is too weak for me to bother trying to capitalise on it.

Getting it right the first time with FD isn't hard. Mobs start up nicely packed and won't really react until you're done casting FD.
On my necro I will use YMLAD as soon as I think they're in danger of separating before I've laid down the rest of my nasty conditions. Mesmers get Fast Casting so this is less of an issue.
The conditions generally last longer than the relevant skill recharges and usually outlast the majority of the mob anyway.

The biggest threat to FD is FD being interrupted, but this is avoidable and less of a threat to my Mesmer than it is my Necromancer.

As for Ash Blast - it uses YMLAD for the KD (which should be in your build regardless in my view).
Steam requires a source of burning, meaning either you depend on your heroes for burning or bring an extra skill - GoI to provide a condition with no utility effect.
Obviously it's silly to bring Ash Blast when in an area where the majority of enemies cannot be knocked down, but oh well. Build wars away!

IronSheik · Nov 15, 2009, 05:39 PM // 17:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by haine111

Ok, I've been hearing how Mesmer=good for nothing in PvE

Fast Casting (13)
Illusion Magic (0)
Domination Magic (16)
Inspiration Magic (4)
*note*
I personally dont use Secondary skills or attributes.

Fast Casting and Domination Magic are runed at +3 with a
+1 domination mask.

Skills used are:

Empathy (used on melee and casters alike, just a great added DPS)

Energy Burn (a DD used for the dead moments when other skills are on cooldown)

Backfire (used for casters... a wicked damage dealer)

Ether Feast (for some of those hairy moments)

Power Spike (another anti-caster shutdown-damage spell.. to be used on priority spells. I.E. Meteor on hydra)

Filler Spell (I use Mind Wrack)

Chaos Storm (used when both DDs are used and mobs are almost dead.. most likely not used if you dont have 3+ mobs)

*Elite Skill* (not required) Energy Surge (another DD and AoE for used just like Energy Burn)

interrupts suck in PvE in hardmode and there is no point of interrupting in NM. Chaos Storm sucks, enemies have too much MP for it to be useful. Mind Wrack sucks because of reason above, and is only ever used to supply CoP with a hex.

Energy Burn is OK, free damage spell. Ether feast is bad, monks job to keep you alive. Backfire is single target so it has limited uses.

I basically disagree with the whole bar.

Mesmer skills are generally bad at PvE yes, but mesmers themselves are excellent.

AP
Auspicious
Arcane Echo
EVAS
FH!
Blah
Blah
Blah

Probably one of the best single targeting builds in PvE.

And elite skill not required...? Mesmer elites are one of the few things they have that are decent, esurge, VoR, Mantra Of Casting (33% recharge one),

Chthon · Nov 15, 2009, 05:59 PM // 17:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

Bleh.
Without Dazed, you basically piss off physicals only.

EC does dazed too. EC can string out technobbable longer than its recharge. If you've got a BHA ranger along, you can coordinate targets once at the start of a mob and keep the dazed going indefinitely.

Quote:

As for Ash Blast - it uses YMLAD for the KD (which should be in your build regardless in my view).
Steam requires a source of burning, meaning either you depend on your heroes for burning or bring an extra skill - GoI to provide a condition with no utility effect.

Yep, GoI would be there for raw damage only -- burning plus 2 rapid triggers of Frag. That's not spectacular, but it's not bad damage for a mesmer either .

Quote:

Damage from fragility is too weak for me to bother trying to capitalise on it.

~20 armor-ignoring AoE per pulse. (At least, it's AoE in a FD context.) With FD, YMLAD, GoI, Steam, Finish Him you could expect 8 pulses for ~160 AoE damage. It's certainly not MoP, but it may well be one of the strongest direct damage options left to post-CoP mesmers.

Xenomortis · Nov 15, 2009, 08:29 PM // 20:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chthon

EC does dazed too. EC can string out technobbable longer than its recharge. If you've got a BHA ranger along, you can coordinate targets once at the start of a mob and keep the dazed going indefinitely.

Necessitating another skill slot on an already pressured bar.
In that regard, FD is bar compression and repeated dazed. Remember the Dazed condition interrupts upon application. But I'm not so sure on renewal - if it does interrupt then, then EC has one more thing going for it, but FD still has two.