Curse

prism2525 · Sep 23, 2006, 06:29 AM // 06:29

Eles are kicked down easily by spikes, so why do you want to nerf the only good defense they have?? Even distortion (e/me) or a mist form ele can't reduce damage from spells. Anet finally gives us a chance and you want to nerf it? WTHell??

Riotgear · Sep 23, 2006, 07:07 AM // 07:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phades

I also had to laugh a little at the attempt at replacing the current "flashbot" with the new eliete blinding surge.

I dunno, spamming it with lightning strike is fairly effective in.... ahem.... certain places.

Steam may have other uses, mainly because there's a LOT of new stuff that uses the burning condition.

frojack · Sep 23, 2006, 09:02 AM // 09:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

Stoneflesh Aura is pretty silly at this point and has a nerf coming. With some armor buffs it's basically god mode.

Peace,
-CxE

That is exactly what I thought. Armour of Earth + Stoneflesh Aura = near enough, a mid-battle tea break. I mean -33 damage reduction makes Shielding Hands seem a like a very poor alternative. I'm not sure any type of raw damage reduction should do that (granted SH is -19 maxed out).
The ability to out last it's recharge seems over-powered considering the benefit's (haha, I can kite warriors all day and no auto-crit for me) though I suppose SA is caster only. Then there's the cost and cast-time difference.
SA's 2 second cast is just asking for interruption, while SH's 1/4 second cast say's 'just wait for the next bus'.

I know it's gonna' get nerfed. I feel upset already as I love the thing, but then of course I would wouldn't I? It's like continuing to date a girl with awesome breasts who isn't really right for you. I know I'm shallow but I just can't seem to move my hands

.

Ebon Hawke is potentially very sexy indeed with it's 95 earth damage and great utility(no more need to split my attributes for Enervating charge>Stoning>Ash Blast anymore). The 2 second cast-time is a little worrying though. I imagine to achieve the desired effect, you'll have to kite your aggressor a little then use it (Water Trident) but that's gonna be impossible with a 2 second cast. In retrospect, Enervating is still the better option by far.
GlowStone will also be interesting but 53 earth damage is pretty rubbish. Ash Blast's low damage wasn't too bad as it was more for utility (Whirlwind>Ash Blast etc.), but the energy gain from GlowStone almost isn't worth it, costing the same as the return. You'd need to run attunements or Master Of Magic or something to get anything from it. If the recharge was lower, it could be a softie pressure tool. Right under Stone Daggers. As it is however, it's something I probably won't use often.

Stone Striker is kinda weird. I suppose Geomancer armour might be of some use now. Or maybe if you plan to use Elemental Resistance. More of a Ranger skill me thinks.

Stone Sheath sounds pretty weird. I wish I had the Balthazar to try it out. Has anyone used it? How exactly does it work? I mean, using your elite slot to make all your foes deal earth damage is kinda' ridiculous. Or does it work like Sliver Armour and actually make them take 37 earth damage when they attack?

Glyph of Restoration is very sexy. The elementalist Heal Signet

. I like the recharge and the fact that it's glyph. It's a great way to help casting through Backfire if you find you really have to. I'm not sure which hit's first, Backfire or GoR so I can't say if it'll save you from death or not. A good addition regardless.

All in all, I'm pretty happy with things. I'm a huge earth fan and it's great to see some more interesting options. Factions brought Sliver Armour, Ash Blast and Ward of Stability, but I'm liking the new damage and defence options a lot more.
My only concern is with the increase in enchantment hate, I will have to think twice about using some of these new ones (perhaps that's the reason StoneFlesh Aura is so powerful). I only really ever use an Attune and Aura as a cover (occasionally Armour of Earth which is inherently spammable anyways) so if I get stripped completely it's not so bad. I'm not a huge fan of Prodigy despite it's power (I've been stung by strips before when I cast it at around 30%. Not very nice).
Plus I don't like the exhaustion. I prefer exhaustion from skills I can live without using that often or when I need to front-load power. Since I generally always carry an exhausting spell (Obs Flame, Maelstrom, and more recently Mind Shock/freeze etc.) In an extended confrontation, Prodigy as e-management just doesn't suit my tastes, despite being the best there is. I'm weird I know...

Why_Me · Sep 23, 2006, 01:16 PM // 13:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

Stoneflesh Aura is pretty silly at this point and has a nerf coming. With some armor buffs it's basically god mode.

Dont give them any ideas

But yeah, even as a geomancer myself, it deserves a nerf, its way too powerful. 33 absorbtion? I just hope they nerf the damage reduction, not the recharge. At 16 earth, with obsidian flesh, kinetic armor, armor of earth, and SA, you could sit around tanking the entire chamber of aatxes without every taking a single point of damage.

Quote:

Originally Posted by frojack

Stone Striker is kinda weird. I suppose Geomancer armour might be of some use now. Or maybe if you plan to use Elemental Resistance. More of a Ranger skill me thinks.

This is actually a great skill, 5 energy, 1/4 second cast, enough duration/recharge to keep up indefinitely. Used with mantra of earth or ele resistance, its a lot of damage reduction. However, the main reason it excites me is that now I will be able to clear 90% of the FoW without ever having to worry about energy.

Overall, the nightfall skills are really good, we get spared from exhaustion, get some decent non elite energy manage ment, and finally some low recharge pressure skills. Thank you, Anet!

prism2525 · Sep 23, 2006, 01:32 PM // 13:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

Stoneflesh Aura is pretty silly at this point and has a nerf coming. With some armor buffs it's basically god mode.

Peace,
-CxE

Sorry Ensign, but did you forget degen by any chance? Not to mention all the enchant hate going around now.

frojack · Sep 23, 2006, 01:36 PM // 13:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Why_Me

This is actually a great skill, 5 energy, 1/4 second cast, enough duration/recharge to keep up indefinitely. Used with mantra of earth or ele resistance, its a lot of damage reduction. However, the main reason it excites me is that now I will be able to clear 90% of the FoW without ever having to worry about energy.

Now that's a very interesting idea. Be even more of a rock and get free e-management thrown. Coupled with Channeling, that's a lot of energy. It's fragile but very interesting. Just like the entire earth line at the moment.

Zuranthium · Sep 23, 2006, 02:05 PM // 14:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

The thing about Mind Blast is that you never get the full return from it - you're always casting stuff in between uses of it, so you get a practical 3-4 pips of regen out of it.

What on Earth are you trying to cast in between? With Immolate, Glowing Gaze, Mind Blast, and Fire Attunement you should never be running out of energy.

Phades · Sep 23, 2006, 04:08 PM // 16:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riotgear

I dunno, spamming it with lightning strike is fairly effective in.... ahem.... certain places.

Yes, spam that thing on those naughty mending warriors you mean person you.

The Great Al · Sep 23, 2006, 06:22 PM // 18:22

master of magic should not be an elite.

prism2525 · Sep 23, 2006, 06:31 PM // 18:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Great Al

master of magic should not be an elite.

May I invite you to read the skill again? protecting it and using a couple of relatively high-recharge spells and then spamming all the way to the recharge is not something to be underestimated.

Eg. Mark of Rodgort, Meteor Shower, Rodgort's Invocation, Flare spam.

With the mark your target will be kept on fire until the hex expires (at which time you will just have to reapply it)

The Great Al · Sep 23, 2006, 06:52 PM // 18:52

I fail to see why it is better than Elemental Attunement. I think Ether Prism may be useful in areas that are heavy with enchant strippers, but I've never found myself to have energy problems using elem attune.

Master Fuhon · Sep 24, 2006, 04:18 AM // 04:18

I'll be playing Paragon this weekend, but I was curious about the introduction of two skills and the effects on the class. The elite versions of Blinding Flash and Heal Party were most likely created based on the statistical analysis taken from the skill usage reports, so it's kind of funny that most people aren't thinking of changing the builds still.

Classic E/Mo runs something like Heal Party, Lightning Orb, Blinding Flash, Ether Prodigy... If the new skills worked perfectly, it's a tradeoff of saving 10 energy on 1, while still paying the full 15 on the other two. But you can't just swap Glyph of Lesser Energy in and cast it before either of the others because then you lose the clutch timing. 100% odds that the rest of the skills on the bar cost 5-10 energy, so it still makes the E-Management skill the best choice.

Heal Party - heal topoffer, degen counter, life saver heal on out of range teammate
Lightning Orb - spike assist w/ team, finish off base ganking assassins skill (letting NPCs do most of the work), reason why warrior's don't stay in Frenzy 24/7
Blinding Flash - self defense, temporary physical character shutdown

I'm more interested in watching some of the new nasty combinations of skills that the other classes are getting that make a base ganker more difficult to deal with (You're all alone, Barbed Arrows). The classic E/Mo just "buys time" for someone else to come over and help. Based on particular team playing styles (i.e. not sending back help) some teams should have already swapped out this character for someone with dueling power. Basically monks everywhere are starting to panic (and packing Restore Conditions), so I say it's kill or be killed.

I think most of the new elites look terrible compared to the changes to the Mind Skills. I think the non-elites are far better than the Faction's new crop, with the exception of Elemental Flame. But I'm only getting to look at those skills on paper and from anything I watch in observer (out of faction). I've only gotten to test Mind Burn/Immolate--> Glowing Gaze/Steam. And I'd like to add that I am going to get owned so bad if I take the henchies to cap Savannah Heat and Sandstorm... those two skills on half cast time and boosted damage... wow.

Ensign · Sep 24, 2006, 05:45 AM // 05:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zuranthium

What on Earth are you trying to cast in between?

Anything that you cast in between Mind Surges cuts down the practical energy returns that you get from it. 1s casts in between each one cut you down to 4.3 pips of regen...2s casts put you down to 3.33 pips. There's nothing wrong with the skill, it's just really never 5 pips of energy in practice like the true energy elites are. The way it spaces out your casts, and the synergy with Fire Attunement make your energy flow nicely however.

Quote:

Originally Posted by prism2525

Sorry Ensign, but did you forget degen by any chance?

They might have a vampiric or lifesteal too!

Peace,
-CxE

Hyprodimus Prime · Sep 24, 2006, 07:12 AM // 07:12

I smell the new E/Mo 420 Ele! Stone Striker+Mantra of Earth+Aura of Restoration+Kenetic Armor+Obsidian Flesh+Whirlwind+Aftershock+Geomancer robes=185 armor AND 50% damage reduction, not to mention +2 energy every hit...dam thats the new UW tank right there lol. And all you need is ele primary with some nice runes, +60 health and you're good. I think maybe more healing since 1 aatxe can deal 300 damage to a 60 AL guy, that turn out to 17 damage after 185 armor and -50%. 17x4 can be a lot still, so maybe more healing, just replace the 2 offenceive skills with better healng since you got a SS partner. Or put everything into illusion, energy storage (like you need it anymore lol) Earth and inspiration, replace the 2 offenceive skills with 2 visages, and there, takes care of the savage slash and any other skilled attackes they got. Your SS partner doesnt need visage anymore, he can focus on damage dealing.

At 100 damage the attack does 8. without obsidian flesh.

A 70% sundering attack with a critical hit (20% from penatrating blow, 10% from strength, 20% from 20/20 sundering wep and 20% from judge's insight)=40 max base damage (like all that is going to be posible at once) and that translates to 24 damage. nice eh?

I also smell a new E/Me The Last Samurai! All you have to add is IW and there you go a tank that hurts very much. What to do with all the energy though?

prism2525 · Sep 26, 2006, 06:38 AM // 06:38

Don't think it will happen Hyprodimus, 55s work great and there's no need to find a better build.

Maria Moon · Sep 26, 2006, 09:12 PM // 21:12

i think just to end this off without all the hostile tone,Is that we all can agree that the new skills have some major advantages and disadvantages (which is just like any other skill in guild wars)

Hella Good · Sep 26, 2006, 09:42 PM // 21:42

I like how they did not include Exhaustion skills. And I like the fact that some regular skills can be used for nrg management (Glowing Gaze, Mind Blast). But apart from a handfull of skills I am not too impressed. At least Eles got a couple of useful elites. More than you can say for some profs (*cough* Mesmers *cough*).

trialist · Sep 26, 2006, 11:05 PM // 23:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by prism2525

May I invite you to read the skill again? protecting it and using a couple of relatively high-recharge spells and then spamming all the way to the recharge is not something to be underestimated.

Eg. Mark of Rodgort, Meteor Shower, Rodgort's Invocation, Flare spam.

With the mark your target will be kept on fire until the hex expires (at which time you will just have to reapply it)

Erm, actually i think you are the one who got it wrong. As someone who actually bothered to unlock this worthless elite to test, its so underwhelming i could cry.

Master Of Magic:
For 20 seconds, whenever you cast a Spell, you gain 0...2 Energy for each recharging Skill that shares this Spell's attribute.

I bolded the key word there. The sad thing is that the skill does exactly what its description says, it gives you up to 2 energy for each recharging skill of Energy Storage.

Yes, thats right, by this, it meant Master Of Magic's attribute. Which means it is virtually immune to abuse unless i missed something, as the only other spell that is non-elite in Energy Storage is Aura Of Restoration with a 5s recharge, good luck trying to spam in a 5s timeframe to abuse this skill.

It can only really be used by someone wanting to play a primary ele but with other class skills since Master Of Magic works on other non ele spells as well, but if you want to use ele spells, i see no reason to choose this elite over elemental attunement.

Mysterial · Sep 27, 2006, 12:50 AM // 00:50

Wow, really? Heh. I assumed the description was wrong and it was supposed to say "that" instead of "this", which is still mostly worthless except maybe to spam smite skills, but at least makes sense. I didn't have enough time to test that particular skill when there were so many others that actually looked promising.

trialist · Sep 27, 2006, 01:07 AM // 01:07

Yes, really, lol. I only unlocked this on a whim during the last hours of the extented event to see if it had any use, i would have cried then but was too tired to care heh. The only reason it could be used with other classes skills was because on casting it, Master Of Magic starts recharging and you use that recharge to trigger the effect for other classes spells. I almost thought it was a bug when i couldn't get the energy gain any higher than 2 no matter how many spells i had on recharge until i tried just casting Aura Of Restoration along with Master Of Magic and spamming during that time, only then did i see +4s, i almost died then. Can't remember if Glyph Of Restoration triggered as well but even so, factoring all the cast times needed and the aftercasts, you won't have more than just a few seconds to try to spam as much as you can.