Curse

ZenRgy · Mar 13, 2008, 01:43 AM // 01:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

it ruins any timed spike (not important in PvE) and provides a bonus that is only marginally effective. certainly not as effective as something like 20% +1 attribute.

Why bring up the importance of timed spikes which you claim are not important in PvE, on a PvE board?

So you're saying getting an extra 4 to 6 damage on your Rodgort's Invocation is better than pumping out an extra Rodgort's Invocation (faster/more often?

How can the damage/efficiency even be comapred?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inferno Link

And how much will a 40/40 set cost me?

If you actually make a gold 40/40 set, then it might cost you a bit since the "Forgot me not" 20% HSR inscription for focii is roughly 25k.

However there are many collectors/crafters that will make you a 40/40 set for probably no more than 10k (including materials). Collectors would cost you even less.

Marverick · Mar 13, 2008, 01:45 AM // 01:45

+1 20% is a useless mod on eles. Only thing it would be significant on is an MM.

Nyktos · Mar 13, 2008, 02:34 AM // 02:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inferno Link

And how much will a 40/40 set cost me?

If you're patient, nothing. Get the wand by beating EotN and the focus from a collector (you can find collectors offering 20/20 fire foci in Prophecies and Factions). Note that you CAN get the focus from beating EotN, but the wand isn't offered by any collectors. If you're impatient, both the wand and focus can be crafted for 5k+mats in Vasburg Armory/Leviathan Pits (toward the end of Factions).

the kurzick eater · Mar 13, 2008, 03:02 AM // 03:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam of Tyria

Please sticky.

=QFT

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marverick

+1 20% is a useless mod on eles. Only thing it would be significant on is an MM.

and even in this case... its not

Dr Strangelove · Mar 13, 2008, 03:17 AM // 03:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by the kurzick eater

and even in this case... its not

For minion masters, it's not a bad deal when all your minions have relatively short recharge times, since the limiting factor iss corpses, not recharge times. +1 there adds quite a bit of effectiveness, since it adds a level.

For eles, it amount to something like a 1% damage bonus, hardly enough to care about.

Grammar · Mar 13, 2008, 04:50 AM // 04:50

I've said it before and I'll say it again.....

sometimes a universal 20% HSR > single-element 36% HSR.

Certain builds benefit from a 40/20 staff (with a bonus +30hp or 20% enchantment mod) over the standard 40/40 wand+focus. It all depends on the build. This is especially the case these days with PvE spells in the game now.

In other news, thinking > blanket statements like the OP.

Sacratus Ignis · Mar 13, 2008, 05:29 AM // 05:29

yeah... grammar read my post last page which all proponents of 40/40 somehow conveniently didn't see

i said the exact same thing - i agree 100%.

Dr Strangelove · Mar 13, 2008, 05:52 AM // 05:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grammar

I've said it before and I'll say it again.....

sometimes a universal 20% HSR > single-element 36% HSR.

Certain builds benefit from a 40/20 staff (with a bonus +30hp or 20% enchantment mod) over the standard 40/40 wand+focus. It all depends on the build. This is especially the case these days with PvE spells in the game now.

In other news, thinking > blanket statements like the OP.

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymasamune

A 40/20/20ench staff swap would be ideal for casting most enchantments. The lack of +health simply doesn't matter because when under attack, you can always switch to a sword+shield set for additional armor and +60 health. There's no point in wasting the utility of a staff or weapon+offhand by having +30 or +energy mods.

Pretty sure he said that. The most commons setup is a 40/40 set, a 40/20/20 enchanting staff, a defensive set, and a high energy set.

Elementalist enchantments generally have a long enough recharge/duration that it's not a big deal to switch sets whenever you cast one. Even if you don't, it's not the end of the world.

tmakinen · Mar 13, 2008, 06:37 AM // 06:37

As has been pointed out loudly and repeatedly, everything works in PvE. Hence there are other considerations to be taken into account than just raw power. Personally, I've found that storage space is a rare commodity to be conserved at any cost. Another important aspect is versatility - I must be able to switch freely between elements or even run secondary profession builds with Energy Storage the only applied attribute line from my primary. A Swift Staff of Enchanting (r9 Energy Storage) with a "Don't Think Twice" inscription (10% HCT of spells) works reasonably well with any normal (i.e., not a solo farming) build I've ever encountered, so for me it's made of pure win. What little I lose in spell throughput I can more than compensate by playing smart

JR · Mar 13, 2008, 10:48 AM // 10:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marverick

I use 40% HCT, 20% HSR, and +30hp Staves for PvE.

Reason? The universal HSR 20% works for all spells, including PvE-only ones and such. 40% HCT helps get more Mind Blasts out. +30hp is to offset the usage of major runes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grammar

I've said it before and I'll say it again.....

sometimes a universal 20% HSR > single-element 36% HSR.

"Hi, I'm too lazy to press F1/F2/F3/F4 so I cut into my efficiency by sitting on one mediocre weapon set."

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

it ruins any timed spike (not important in PvE) and provides a bonus that is only marginally effective. certainly not as effective as something like 20% +1 attribute.

You are wrong.

qazwersder · Mar 13, 2008, 06:02 PM // 18:02

I think the whole point in the original post was simply to state that pretty much most of the time these are the best weapon set.

For any general PvE build which any random is running they will suffice. You generally run single element team builds.

If you are running a dual element build, I dont imagine you'd be on here asking what the best weapon set is.

If you are running a terratank farming build, I dont imagine you'd be on here asking what the best weapon set is neither.

Beaver of celestial qualities made me laugh.

LifeInfusion · Mar 14, 2008, 01:36 AM // 01:36

You're wrong because it is 36/36 ... though if you're saying 20/20 wand and 20/20 focus...yeh

I don't know why people keep saying 40/40. It isn't additive.

Div · Mar 14, 2008, 02:55 AM // 02:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by LifeInfusion

You're wrong because it is 36/36 ... though if you're saying 20/20 wand and 20/20 focus...yeh

I don't know why people keep saying 40/40. It isn't additive.

I think it's actually 32% HCT and 4% QCT. So if that's the case it works out to be 39% or something. But people are lazy so they say 40/40 instead of 32/4/64/32/4/64.

Savio · Mar 14, 2008, 02:59 AM // 02:59

Recharge is capped at half, so no quarter skill recharge.

People say 40/40 because they know it means two 20/20s. They (hopefully) already understand how they stack.

Ensign · Mar 15, 2008, 02:12 AM // 02:12

38% net HCT (19% reduction overall); 36% net HSR (18% reduction overall).

LifeInfusion · Mar 15, 2008, 03:15 PM // 15:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

38% net HCT (19% reduction overall); 36% net HSR (18% reduction overall).

It still doesn't explain why people keep calling it 40/40...

wasn't 1/4 cast removed?

Savio · Mar 15, 2008, 03:29 PM // 15:29

Recharge is limited to 50%, cast time has no lower limit.

40/40 is easier to write than 38/36, and it's more apparent what people are talking about.

Chthon · Mar 15, 2008, 04:39 PM // 16:39

I think "dual 20/20" is a safer and more accurate notation, and it's not that much harder to type out.

On topic:
Yes, dual 20/20 is pretty much ideal for most ele builds. The only other things I'd ever consider would be (1) a staff (inherent 20% faster recharge for all spells) with faster cast for all spells mod(s), if I had a build with a critical spell that was PvE-only or in an off-attribute, or (2) a staff/spear with 20% enchanting if I had a build that needed it to keep a critical enchant up full time.

Ensign · Mar 15, 2008, 04:45 PM // 16:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by LifeInfusion

It still doesn't explain why people keep calling it 40/40...

Are you saying that it isn't abundantly clear what item set someone is referring to when they say 40/40?

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmakinen

Personally, I've found that storage space is a rare commodity to be conserved at any cost.

This is one of the main reasons not to use 'optimal' weapon setups - cost and storage space, depending on where you stand financially in game. Back when my PvE-ele was PvP ready, her entire inventory was filled with equipment, and my storage was as well - and I still didn't have everything I'd want for every build. Having 0 free inventory spaces is fine for PvP but not PvE. Increased storage has helped somewhat, but if you carry around optimal equipment for all the builds you can run you're not going to have room to store the goodies you'll pick up playing the game.

From that perspective, generally good weapons are much more valuable than a bunch of specialized 40/40 sets; +health generic attribute staves, for instance, are great things to have in inventory for when you switch to a new build and don't want to be scrounging for any equipment that works.

Dodo The Extinct · Mar 16, 2008, 03:41 PM // 15:41

As a Bsurge with a Melee Ward, what weapon sets should I bring into a gvg?