Curse

-Lotus- · Jul 30, 2008, 04:15 PM // 16:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mouse at Large

lol. Direct fire damage+constant degen>direct fire damage alone. hahaha. Learn to play.

youve got it backwards. youd be better off using the energy you waste on degen to do a decent amount of damage.

Mouse at Large · Jul 30, 2008, 07:34 PM // 19:34

[mark of [email protected]] - less energy return from attune.

Every fire spell and even wanding (with a fire damage wand) triggers it. Degen is armour ignoring. Just see how much fire damage some of the higher lvl mobs actually take.

So exactly who is wasting energy??????

-Lotus- · Jul 30, 2008, 09:11 PM // 21:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mouse at Large

[mark of [email protected]] - less energy return from attune.

Every fire spell and even wanding (with a fire damage wand) triggers it. Degen is armour ignoring. Just see how much fire damage some of the higher lvl mobs actually take.

So exactly who is wasting energy??????

casting non-armor ignoring things like fire nukes agains high level/armor/HM foes is stupid, but degen is even worse.

degen/regen can reach, at maximum, 20 DPS/HPS. thats nothing...

Mouse at Large · Jul 31, 2008, 06:50 AM // 06:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by -Lotus-

degen/regen can reach, at maximum, 20 DPS/HPS. thats nothing...

As you so eloquently put it in a previous post " do some math".

Anyhow, I've made my point and I'm not going to labour it further. Play the game your way and I'll play it mine. Anyone looking for advice can try out our different approaches and decide for themselves which is more effective.

-Lotus- · Jul 31, 2008, 06:53 AM // 06:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mouse at Large

As you so eloquently put it in a previous post " do some math".

1 pip health degen = 2 DPS
max pips of health degen = 10

10 * 2 = 20

Gaia_Hunter · Aug 06, 2008, 02:00 PM // 14:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Celestial Beaver

It may "work" but there are still much more efficient, and quicker ways to kill a mob.

Quote:

Originally Posted by -Lotus-

MS takes 8 seconds to do anything if you hard cast it. if there is still enough of a mob left for you to need an AoE spell after that much time you obviously shouldnt be playing anyways.

MS isn't something to use to kill a mob. Is something to use against mobs balanced enough to need disruption.

You can reduce MS cast with your weapons and stuff like mind bender.

And if h/h MS is an easy enough disruption for heroes to use opposed to stuff they can't use like YMLD.

Cebe · Aug 06, 2008, 02:12 PM // 14:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaia_Hunter

MS isn't something to use to kill a mob. Is something to use against mobs balanced enough to need disruption.

Mesmers say "Hi!"

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaia_Hunter

You can reduce MS cast with your weapons and stuff like mind bender.

Why would you want to devote a quarter of your skill bar, essentially, to one spell with a 60 second recharge?

And what if the foes run out of your precious Meteor Shower? 25 energy wasted, a skill recharging for 60 seconds and exhaustion to boot. Win? I think not.

Dzjudz · Aug 06, 2008, 02:50 PM // 14:50

The energy and exhaustion are not a problem at all. Personally, I use a 40/20/+30hp fire Staff and a 40/20/20 fire Staff in the build I posted. With the dual attunement, energy really is not a problem, nor is the exhaustion, since MS is the only one on the skillbar causing it and the exhaustion will be gone once it's recharged. I have found that mobs in general don't really run away from MS if you have a proper tank aggro. Casting [meteor shower] -> [searing heat] -> [rodgort's invocation] -> [fireball] works like a charm in 95% of the cases. With weaker mobs or mobs that don't need the occasional knockdown not casting MS will suffice as well.

Tyla · Aug 06, 2008, 02:53 PM // 14:53

You know, that's 14 seconds worth of casting you have there.

Dzjudz · Aug 06, 2008, 07:24 PM // 19:24

I don't know about 14 seconds, especially with a 40/20/20 staff. But I was thinking of adding [mindbender] instead of Fireball. Don't have that skill yet though. I'll go do O Brave New World then

.

Question: does Mindbender stack with half or quarter casting time by the staff?
Edit: wiki says it does, so that answers my question.

Tyla · Aug 06, 2008, 07:34 PM // 19:34

Chance is chance, and with Mindbender it's still 8.5 seconds worth of casting. If you're replacing Fireball with Mindbender, it's still roughly 7.5 seconds.

MisterT69 · Aug 06, 2008, 07:36 PM // 19:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dzjudz

I don't know about 14 seconds, especially with a 40/20/20 staff. But I was thinking of adding [mindbender] instead of Fireball. Don't have that skill yet though. I'll go do O Brave New World then

.

Question: does Mindbender stack with half or quarter casting time by the staff?
Edit: wiki says it does, so that answers my question.

Yeah...it stacks. I've pulled off 1.25 sec Meteor shower casts b4. Mindbender is definitely a great skill when using long cast time spells like that.

Dzjudz · Aug 06, 2008, 07:44 PM // 19:44

Nice, that would mean a 4% chance of 0.625s MS cast

. Tyla, what's your problem with about 10 seconds of total casting? Are you saying that that is waay to long because you and your awesome builds have entire mobs dead in less than 5 seconds? Don't think so. Taking a snare hero, an MM and this nuke build certainly works. Snaring is not even needed if you have proper aggro. Instead of only talking our builds down, why don't you post a 1337 build that would have a casting time of under 10 seconds and still nuke the hell out of mobs?

Gaia_Hunter · Aug 06, 2008, 09:24 PM // 21:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Celestial Beaver

Mesmers say "Hi!"

Why would you want to devote a quarter of your skill bar, essentially, to one spell with a 60 second recharge?

And what if the foes run out of your precious Meteor Shower? 25 energy wasted, a skill recharging for 60 seconds and exhaustion to boot. Win? I think not.

Last time I checked mindbender worked for all the spells.

Meteor Shower isn't awesome, but its solid. You can have a mesmer there to disrupt or you can have an ele that can bring a ward and meteor shower, doing damage and disrupting.

I like mesmers but they are on the weak side for PvE

Dzjudz · Aug 07, 2008, 02:26 AM // 02:26

Hmm, I've run into a slight problem. The following build works:
[fireball][rodgort's invocation][searing heat][meteor shower][mindbender][fire attunement][elemental attunement][empty]

However, the casting, with 40HCT and Mindbender is now way too fast for recharges to keep up, even with 40HSR. So I was thinking of removing the res skill (that takes the place of the empty slot above), and take another skill instead, seeing as I rarely (almost never) need it. I can't remember the last time I was the sole survivor in a group. Therefore, I was thinking of changing my secondary from monk to, for example, mesmer, and without sacrifising attribute points get something like:

[immolate][rodgort's invocation][searing heat][meteor shower][arcane echo][mindbender][fire attunement][elemental attunement]

I'm not sure about replacing Fireball with Immolate. Immolate is more spammable and causes burning, but Fireball is AoE and causes about double the damage. That's why now I'm thinking of using [epidemic] instead of Arcane Echo, since 3 of the 4 damage skills cause burning. What's your opinion on these ideas?

Tyla · Aug 07, 2008, 11:32 AM // 11:32

My opinion is going /Rt and bringing Splinter Weapon aswell.

Gaia_Hunter · Aug 09, 2008, 02:52 PM // 14:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaia_Hunter

I like mesmers but they are on the weak side for PvE

Well they seem alot better after the update now, especially cause epidemic was leaving my ranger heroes builds for that 2nd copy of splinter weapon more and more.