Curse

Legendary Battousai · Jul 04, 2006, 08:19 PM // 20:19

A/W

Leaping Mantis Sting
Jungle Strike
Horns of the Ox
Falling Spider
Twisting Fangs//Death Blossom//Blades of Steel
Moebus Strike
Frenzy
Wild Blow//res sig

16 Daggers
13 Critical

Repeat the skills in impact fonts after you hit the first two until the target dies.

build counters touch rangers because of the endless knockdowns and stance removal, kills any target including warriors before they can really react, hard for single monks to heal and is completely suicidal. Build can also be concidered a 4 double strike chain, which gives out massive dps which is also increased by use of frenzy. Best for alliance battles (only use this build if you know when not to use frenzy)

ColaManiac · Jul 04, 2006, 08:43 PM // 20:43

works beter with R/A, more energy to use but deals less dmg. good for RA and AB, bad for everything else... still i use it with my pvp char.

self heal is bigest problem here because at RA you cannot be so sure that you get monk.

you cannot do the whole combo if your target is adj to ally

you might be able to remove stances but you still can't remove guardian or any similar ench

how do you manage your energy? 11 skill combo. every skill takes 5-10 energy , so it would take 70 energy for whole combo even if you get enough criticals you still would have to wait for more nrg to use combo again.

blind is also your enemy, but almost every sin has problems with blind

so good luck with killing things... and swords are shiny!

X Cytherea X · Jul 05, 2006, 06:31 AM // 06:31

nice combo, looks like fun. heres one i use...

dagger 15
critical 11
air 10

1. conjure lightning
2. critical eye
3. shock
4. falling spider
5. horns of the ox
6. moebius strike
7. twisting fangs
8. dash/rez

your longest combo is shock-falling-horns-moebius-horns-falling-twisting, which is 3 kd, poison, bleeding, deepwound for 40 nrg.
if target has adjacent allies or moebius didnt hit while health<50%, just do 3-7 in order, which aint bad. 1 and 2 (buffs that stack and last pretty long) add more damage and crits.

Kijik Oni Hanryuu · Jul 05, 2006, 06:39 AM // 06:39

I am guessing you are using Ssaresh's Kris Daggers or just some daggers with a lightning dagger tang.

Legendary Battousai · Jul 06, 2006, 11:01 AM // 11:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by ColaManiac

works beter with R/A, more energy to use but deals less dmg. good for RA and AB, bad for everything else... still i use it with my pvp char.

self heal is bigest problem here because at RA you cannot be so sure that you get monk.

you cannot do the whole combo if your target is adj to ally

you might be able to remove stances but you still can't remove guardian or any similar ench

how do you manage your energy? 11 skill combo. every skill takes 5-10 energy , so it would take 70 energy for whole combo even if you get enough criticals you still would have to wait for more nrg to use combo again.

blind is also your enemy, but almost every sin has problems with blind

1. R/A is stupid, no damage at all, and the build has no problem with energy.
2. Dont get attacked, and no heal necessary. If they are persistent or your entire team dies, it is not like if having a self heal would have saved you in the first place.
3. Dont attack targets standing next to you or dont do the combo in order.
4. Then interrupt guardian with horns of the ox or pick another target.
5. Zealous Daggers, 13 Critical. If you happen to run out of energy, regular attacks for 5 seconds brings you up to full.
6. So is every hex, snare and enemy speed buff in the game, but you dont see me sitting here saying that damage is the perfect counter to heals? Some things are so obvious that they need not be mentioned. The assassin should pick targets distant from healers and without capabilities to inflict enough damage on you to do anything serious. I.E. Target the necro with vampiric skills instead of the flame burst ele seeing as frenzy does not double vampiric damage and flame burst would kill you in two hits with frenzy up. Simple logic like this should not need to be mentioned, so I usually dont need to post this worthless information for anyone, except for you. Not only this, but you should seriously look into getting a spell check that is integrated into your browser if you are that slow.

Quote:

Originally Posted by X Cytherea X

nice combo, looks like fun. heres one i use...

dagger 15
critical 11
air 10

1. conjure lightning
2. critical eye
3. shock
4. falling spider
5. horns of the ox
6. moebius strike
7. twisting fangs
8. dash/rez

your longest combo is shock-falling-horns-moebius-horns-falling-twisting, which is 3 kd, poison, bleeding, deepwound for 40 nrg.
if target has adjacent allies or moebius didnt hit while health<50%, just do 3-7 in order, which aint bad. 1 and 2 (buffs that stack and last pretty long) add more damage and crits.

conjure seems unnecessary seeing as it will just be removed and prevents you from bringing zealous daggers.

Siren · Jul 06, 2006, 02:14 PM // 14:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legendary Battousai

6. So is every hex, snare and enemy speed buff in the game, but you dont see me sitting here saying that damage is the perfect counter to heals? Some things are so obvious that they need not be mentioned. The assassin should pick targets distant from healers and without capabilities to inflict enough damage on you to do anything serious. I.E. Target the necro with vampiric skills instead of the flame burst ele seeing as frenzy does not double vampiric damage and flame burst would kill you in two hits with frenzy up. Simple logic like this should not need to be mentioned, so I usually dont need to post this worthless information for anyone, except for you. Not only this, but you should seriously look into getting a spell check that is integrated into your browser if you are that slow.

You're a fool. Your entire battle strategy ("Logic" you say? Spock laughs at you.)takes place in a vacuum. If I were facing this build, the minute I saw you, an Assassin, go into Frenzy (and knowing your build has no stance cancel), I'm spiking you into the frigging ground.

Does Frenzy not double damage from Vampiric? No matter if it does or doesn't, because everything else will kill you almost instantly.

One KD every 10 seconds means absolutely nothing, because you're depending on Moebius Strike to enable even a second combo chain/KD. If your target is under 50% health, Moebius is either going to kill the target (which means you're only getting one KD per target) or you're going to have to use some of your other attack skills, which will screw up the rhythm for your next targets, because your leads/off-hands won't be available for the other dual attacks.

You're wasting slots with Leaping Mantis and Jungle Strike. If you're not bringing Twisting Fangs, your build is sucking most heinously--especially since you're focusing on dealing damage. Deep Wound is critical for damage infliction.

Your stance removal vanishes when you need to bring a Rez Sig. And you should always bring a Rez Sig, especially in RA/TA.

If you're using it for AB? If you aren't dead most of the time, I'm amazed. You'd have to be facing absolute morons for this build to work in any meaningful way at all.

To summarize: your build looks awful. I wouldn't even consider bringing it anywhere.

There's zero synergy, both in the skills themselves and in your approach to using them.

You have at least two entirely useless skills at the top of your skill bar.

Your KD becomes useless, as you're only using it once per target.

You're depending on a highly conditional recharge when you should be concerned only with killing your target. Don't be fooled by Moebius Strike; it's entirely a PvE Elite.

Your goal for this build (presumably AB) is inherently flawed, because I see no speed boosts (even Dash would be an improvement), a combo that is utterly castrated when you try to capture any of the control points (clustered NPCs+Ele+Warrior+Frenzy=you are dead), an IAS that will get people to laugh at you right before they spike your Ass into the ground, damage output that's absolutely dreadful due to choosing between Deep Wound or miniscule improvement from Blades of Steel...and I could go on.

Bottom line here is...what are you trying to pull here? No competent Assassin would use your build.

jonny5v · Jul 06, 2006, 02:55 PM // 14:55

Shadow Arts

Assassin/Mesmer
Level: 20

Critical Strikes: 9 (8+1)
Dagger Mastery: 16 (12+4)
Shadow Arts: 11 (10+1)

Alliance Battle Build:

Leaping Mantis Sting (Dagger Mastery)
If Mantis Sting hits, target foe takes +21 damage. If this attack strikes a moving foe, that foe is Crippled for 16 seconds.
Energy:5 Cast:0 Recharge:8

Jungle Strike (Dagger Mastery)
Must follow a lead attack. If it hits, this attack strikes for +21 damage. If it hits a foe that was Crippled, it does +33 damage.
Energy:5 Cast:0 Recharge:10

Twisting Fangs (Critical Strikes)
Must follow an off-hand attack. If it hits, Twisting Fangs strikes for +16 damage and struck foe suffers from Bleeding and Deep Wound for 14 seconds.
Energy:10 Cast:0 Recharge:15

Moebius Strike [Elite] (Dagger Mastery)
Must follow a Dual Attack. If it hits, Moebius Strike strikes for +37 damage. If you strike a foe whose Health is below 50%, all your other attack skills are recharged.
Energy:5 Cast:0 Recharge:8

Death Blossom (Dagger Mastery)
Must follow an off-hand attack. If it hits, Death Blossom strikes for +42 damage against target foe and all adjacent foes take 42 damage.
Energy:5 Cast:0 Recharge:12

Heart of Shadow (Shadow Arts)
Shadow Step to a random nearby location. For 60 seconds, the next time you take damage you are healed for 70 Health.
Energy:5 Cast:0.25 Recharge:15

Viper's Defense (Shadow Arts)
For 30 seconds, the next time you are struck you are teleported to a nearby random location. The foe who struck you is Poisoned for 16 seconds.
Energy:5 Cast:0 Recharge:10

Shadow Refuge (Shadow Arts)
For 4 seconds, you gain 9 Health regeneration. When Shadow Refuge ends, you gain 64 Health if you are attacking.
Energy:5 Cast:1 Recharge:8

Use Heart of Shadows and Viper's Defense constantly. Shadow Refuge for healing and the rest, just do it.

Imperial Sanctum Running:

Dagger Mastery: 13 (12+1)
Shadow Arts: 16 (12+4)

Dark Escape (Shadow Arts)
For 12 seconds, you move 25% faster and take half damage. Dark Escape ends if you successfully hit with an attack.
Energy:5 Cast:0 Recharge:30

Dash (Assassin None)
For 3 seconds, you run 50% faster.
Energy:5 Cast:0 Recharge:15

Shadow of Haste (Shadow Arts)
For 16 seconds you move 25% faster than normal. When Shadow of Haste ends, you return to the location where you activated this skill.
Energy:10 Cast:0 Recharge:30

Death's Charge (Shadow Arts)
Shadow Step to target foe. If that foe has more Health than you, you are healed for 106.
Energy:5 Cast:0.25 Recharge:45

Heart of Shadow (Shadow Arts)
Shadow Step to a random nearby location. For 60 seconds, the next time you take damage you are healed for 70 Health.
Energy:5 Cast:0.25 Recharge:15

Shadow Refuge (Shadow Arts)
For 4 seconds, you gain 9 Health regeneration. When Shadow Refuge ends, you gain 64 Health if you are attacking.
Energy:5 Cast:1 Recharge:8

Shadow Form [Elite] (Shadow Arts)
For 16 seconds, all hostile spells that target you fail and all attacks against you miss. When Shadow Form ends, lose all but 38 health.
Energy:5 Cast:1 Recharge:60

Arcane Echo (Mesmer other)
If you cast a Spell in the next 20 seconds, Arcane Echo is replaced with that Spell for 20 seconds. Arcane Echo ends prematurely if you use a non-Spell skill.
Energy:15 Cast:2 Recharge:30

Arcane Echo Shadow Form, use running skills to get around. Heart of Shadows is in emergancy. Shadow of Haste to aggro monsters out of an area.

Legendary Battousai · Jul 06, 2006, 11:41 PM // 23:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Siren

You're a fool. Your entire battle strategy ("Logic" you say? Spock laughs at you.)takes place in a vacuum. If I were facing this build, the minute I saw you, an Assassin, go into Frenzy (and knowing your build has no stance cancel), I'm spiking you into the frigging ground.

Does Frenzy not double damage from Vampiric? No matter if it does or doesn't, because everything else will kill you almost instantly.

One KD every 10 seconds means absolutely nothing, because you're depending on Moebius Strike to enable even a second combo chain/KD. If your target is under 50% health, Moebius is either going to kill the target (which means you're only getting one KD per target) or you're going to have to use some of your other attack skills, which will screw up the rhythm for your next targets, because your leads/off-hands won't be available for the other dual attacks.

You're wasting slots with Leaping Mantis and Jungle Strike. If you're not bringing Twisting Fangs, your build is sucking most heinously--especially since you're focusing on dealing damage. Deep Wound is critical for damage infliction.

Your stance removal vanishes when you need to bring a Rez Sig. And you should always bring a Rez Sig, especially in RA/TA.

If you're using it for AB? If you aren't dead most of the time, I'm amazed. You'd have to be facing absolute morons for this build to work in any meaningful way at all.

To summarize: your build looks awful. I wouldn't even consider bringing it anywhere.

There's zero synergy, both in the skills themselves and in your approach to using them.

You have at least two entirely useless skills at the top of your skill bar.

Your KD becomes useless, as you're only using it once per target.

You're depending on a highly conditional recharge when you should be concerned only with killing your target. Don't be fooled by Moebius Strike; it's entirely a PvE Elite.

Your goal for this build (presumably AB) is inherently flawed, because I see no speed boosts (even Dash would be an improvement), a combo that is utterly castrated when you try to capture any of the control points (clustered NPCs+Ele+Warrior+Frenzy=you are dead), an IAS that will get people to laugh at you right before they spike your Ass into the ground, damage output that's absolutely dreadful due to choosing between Deep Wound or miniscule improvement from Blades of Steel...and I could go on.

Bottom line here is...what are you trying to pull here? No competent Assassin would use your build.

funny post... and the thing that makes it funny is everything you say has no logic in it, and you even mention it.

1, attack targets attacking someone else, not looking at you noticing that you have frenzy.

2, the reason why you wouldnt want twisting fangs is so that you DONT kill the target before moebus strike, the way everything works out, moebus strike almost is always the last hit and kills the target allowing you to switch targets, if deep wound was added, no moebus strike needed and you would need to wait for your skills to recharge.

3, 10 second long difference between knock downs? more like 3 seconds, and if the target is down for 2 for the first one, that only gives them a chance to barely cast a 1 second cast or attempt running.

4, using my kd only once per target? if they get healed, you hit them twice with it, which moebus strike allows you to continue to add more chains to your attack until they die.

5, yes, i realize a lot of pve'rs probably use moebus strike, but its no better than some of the assassins use flourish and other skills... but for the specific build, moebus strike works well in it.

6, you can bring twisting fangs if your that obsessed about it, reread my first post: Twisting Fangs//Death Blossom//Blades of Steel (meaning you could chose any of those three, blades of steel being the worst of the three due to the situational damage and long recharge of it if moebus strike worked). Death blossom is best usually because it does allow your moebus to recharge your skills.

7, (clustered NPCs+Ele+Warrior+Frenzy=you are dead) was very stupid... you dont take ports by yourself, you take them with monks around you or a stupid wmo that loves his healing hands and tanks for you. In the case that you are attacking npcs that are cluttered, try this combo: Leaping, jungle, death blossom, moebus, death blossom and usually something will die from your regular attacks after or you will eventually be able to use your horns. also as a note, horns of the ox still deals +30 damage if you dont knock them down... its like saying final thrust is horrible if you dont attack someone under 50%, it is better if it works, but doesn't destroy all worth of the skill.

8, res sigs are worthless in RA/TA, nobody else brings them with them, so reusing someone else who cant even res you after you die is pointless... and for TA I usually run with monks that I know, and I never die... so basically if your dying and your monk cant keep prot spirit on you, find a new group.

9, "You're wasting slots with Leaping Mantis and Jungle Strike." What would you like them to be? a hex and black mantis thrust? or an enchantment and golden phoenix strike? otherwise you cant get to your dual attacks.

10, You really lack logic, so basically your wasting your time reading this post. You dont even read the entire post and haven't realized yet that this build is infact suicidal for those who can not pick targets. The build will slaughter 90% of all warriors and rangers that you will ever find.

and seeing as you lack logic, allow me to explain how you kill warriors:
walk up to him without frenzy,
hit him with your lead and offhand,
frenzy + horns and do your chain,
moebus will hit when he is at 40% health,
horns to knock him down again,
finish your chain
and hes dead.

Although of course there are exceptions, allow me to list them so I dont need to read another one of your pointless posts: Deadly Riposte, Riposte, shock (If used by someone who knows when to use it)

In summary, play the game for 14 months, learn how to choose targets and the build will look fine, otherwise, dont post knock a build that you cant run due to your own stupidity.

Bottom line here, no uncompetent assassin or critic who think they are competent would use my build.

Bloodied Blade · Jul 07, 2006, 12:57 AM // 00:57

I really tried to come up with something constructive other than "completely change half your build", but I couldn't. The other option was just to say this in like 12 sentences, but since I would get flamed anyway for offering advice, I'll leave it at this.

Siren · Jul 07, 2006, 03:23 AM // 03:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legendary Battousai

funny post... and the thing that makes it funny is everything you say has no logic in it, and you even mention it.

1, attack targets attacking someone else, not looking at you noticing that you have frenzy.

2, the reason why you wouldnt want twisting fangs is so that you DONT kill the target before moebus strike, the way everything works out, moebus strike almost is always the last hit and kills the target allowing you to switch targets, if deep wound was added, no moebus strike needed and you would need to wait for your skills to recharge.

3, 10 second long difference between knock downs? more like 3 seconds, and if the target is down for 2 for the first one, that only gives them a chance to barely cast a 1 second cast or attempt running.

4, using my kd only once per target? if they get healed, you hit them twice with it, which moebus strike allows you to continue to add more chains to your attack until they die.

5, yes, i realize a lot of pve'rs probably use moebus strike, but its no better than some of the assassins use flourish and other skills... but for the specific build, moebus strike works well in it.

6, you can bring twisting fangs if your that obsessed about it, reread my first post: Twisting Fangs//Death Blossom//Blades of Steel (meaning you could chose any of those three, blades of steel being the worst of the three due to the situational damage and long recharge of it if moebus strike worked). Death blossom is best usually because it does allow your moebus to recharge your skills.

7, (clustered NPCs+Ele+Warrior+Frenzy=you are dead) was very stupid... you dont take ports by yourself, you take them with monks around you or a stupid wmo that loves his healing hands and tanks for you. In the case that you are attacking npcs that are cluttered, try this combo: Leaping, jungle, death blossom, moebus, death blossom and usually something will die from your regular attacks after or you will eventually be able to use your horns. also as a note, horns of the ox still deals +30 damage if you dont knock them down... its like saying final thrust is horrible if you dont attack someone under 50%, it is better if it works, but doesn't destroy all worth of the skill.

8, res sigs are worthless in RA/TA, nobody else brings them with them, so reusing someone else who cant even res you after you die is pointless... and for TA I usually run with monks that I know, and I never die... so basically if your dying and your monk cant keep prot spirit on you, find a new group.

9, "You're wasting slots with Leaping Mantis and Jungle Strike." What would you like them to be? a hex and black mantis thrust? or an enchantment and golden phoenix strike? otherwise you cant get to your dual attacks.

10, You really lack logic, so basically your wasting your time reading this post. You dont even read the entire post and haven't realized yet that this build is infact suicidal for those who can not pick targets. The build will slaughter 90% of all warriors and rangers that you will ever find.

and seeing as you lack logic, allow me to explain how you kill warriors:
walk up to him without frenzy,
hit him with your lead and offhand,
frenzy + horns and do your chain,
moebus will hit when he is at 40% health,
horns to knock him down again,
finish your chain
and hes dead.

Although of course there are exceptions, allow me to list them so I dont need to read another one of your pointless posts: Deadly Riposte, Riposte, shock (If used by someone who knows when to use it)

In summary, play the game for 14 months, learn how to choose targets and the build will look fine, otherwise, dont post knock a build that you cant run due to your own stupidity.

Bottom line here, no uncompetent assassin or critic who think they are competent would use my build.

I'm sorry, what is your point here? Are you trolling? Is this entire thread some lame, misguided, incoherent attempt at satire? Or are you really that myopic as to think bringing Frenzy on an Assassin is a smart thing to do?

Dude, get a life, get a clue, then come back to talk about proper build design.

And if you're trolling, you won't be the first, and you sure as hell won't be the last, so you don't even get a cookie.

Xioden · Jul 07, 2006, 04:52 AM // 04:52

Pretty much you can't rely on your opponent to sit there and let you beat on them.

- You have no way to catch an opponent who kites you. If they're stupid and sit there long enough to get the full combo off they were likely not an experienced player.

- You have no way to avoid damage when you do get into the fray, you also have no way to get away, and no way to heal any damage. Basically you are assuming you will have a monk tied to your back at all times. In addition, you don't even have the element of surprise on your side, you have to run in to your opponent, which goes back to the first point, being able to KD every x seconds doesn't mean jack when you can't get to the guy.

- Frenzy is the absolute worst skill to use for an assassin. ESPECIALLY when you have no way to avoid damage. It's all fine and well to go after targets that aren't directly focused on you, but the second someone sees it you can GUARANTEE they're going to have a field day. Have fun taking 100+ damage from every attack, and god help you if an Ele gets on you.. Hello 200+ a hit.

- "The build will slaughter 90% of all warriors and rangers that you will ever find." So will the Pre-made "Fangs of Melandru", and that even comes with a self-heal, a movement skill and a rez!

- "and seeing as you lack logic, allow me to explain how you kill warriors" And if they have any Anti-KD your screwed royally. There is also the entire part where if pretty much anything doesn't go according to plan you are once again royally screwed.

- Any blind/slow effects your screwed.

In all honesty, if you are going to play an assassin like a warrior you may as well just play a warrior. Assassins are already fragile as hell, adding Frenzy to the mix doesn't help you at all.

Kijik Oni Hanryuu · Jul 07, 2006, 05:39 AM // 05:39

ok guys calm down, no flaming needed, and OMG what's up Jonny!?! He's a guildie of mine.

umm anyway, I don't see too darn much fault in the build except for frenzy, if a tank can't use frenzy, you can't use frenzy. I messed up my wording X.X What I am saying is that if a tank with it's huge armor can't take a hit while using frenzy then an assassin shouldn't take the risk of geting hit while frenzying.

Legendary Battousai · Jul 07, 2006, 07:17 AM // 07:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Siren

I'm sorry, what is your point here? Are you trolling? Is this entire thread some lame, misguided, incoherent attempt at satire? Or are you really that myopic as to think bringing Frenzy on an Assassin is a smart thing to do?

Dude, get a life, get a clue, then come back to talk about proper build design.

And if you're trolling, you won't be the first, and you sure as hell won't be the last, so you don't even get a cookie.

sigh... I posted what works well, kills many things and because simple logic eludes you does not mean that everyone else in the world is an idiot and your the only one here that has a life. That insult is pretty lame too, so please get a real one if your going to waste my time reading your posts that you fancied up with dictionary.com because you wanted to look smarter than everyone here. I dont mind criticism that is feasible, and I do agree frenzy on an assassin is very stupid for 99% of people who play guild wars, but the 1% who actually know when and when not to use frenzy may enjoy this build. You are obviously not one of the 1%, so please go troll another thread.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xioden

Pretty much you can't rely on your opponent to sit there and let you beat on them.

- You have no way to catch an opponent who kites you. If they're stupid and sit there long enough to get the full combo off they were likely not an experienced player.

- You have no way to avoid damage when you do get into the fray, you also have no way to get away, and no way to heal any damage. Basically you are assuming you will have a monk tied to your back at all times. In addition, you don't even have the element of surprise on your side, you have to run in to your opponent, which goes back to the first point, being able to KD every x seconds doesn't mean jack when you can't get to the guy.

- Frenzy is the absolute worst skill to use for an assassin. ESPECIALLY when you have no way to avoid damage. It's all fine and well to go after targets that aren't directly focused on you, but the second someone sees it you can GUARANTEE they're going to have a field day. Have fun taking 100+ damage from every attack, and god help you if an Ele gets on you.. Hello 200+ a hit.

- "The build will slaughter 90% of all warriors and rangers that you will ever find." So will the Pre-made "Fangs of Melandru", and that even comes with a self-heal, a movement skill and a rez!

- "and seeing as you lack logic, allow me to explain how you kill warriors" And if they have any Anti-KD your screwed royally. There is also the entire part where if pretty much anything doesn't go according to plan you are once again royally screwed.

- Any blind/slow effects your screwed.

In all honesty, if you are going to play an assassin like a warrior you may as well just play a warrior. Assassins are already fragile as hell, adding Frenzy to the mix doesn't help you at all.

1, Knockdown and cripple, and there is no way to kite after the first horns of the ox hits. I could see if you were fighting someone from a top 50 guild that knows how to look at their radar and knows how to avoid trouble (which is basically what I am and know how to do the same thing, thus is why I know how to use frenzy) will be a hard target to catch, but with frenzy up, it takes a short amount of time to get to horns and easily eliminating them.

2, Again, I must repeat, find targets that are focused on another person. If your an assassin running into a large group of people, you probably weren't made for this build and lack the logic to use it.

3, And again, I must repeat, find targets that are focused on another person (meaning not you, and choose when to use frenzy, meaning only use frenzy when you hit horns of the ox if that is what it takes so they cant spike you anyways).

4, Any build with a self heal or a character with a monk nearby can survive that horrible build, this build takes 100% of a monks attention to heal, and if left unattended, leads to a dead target in less than 4 seconds.

5, Anti-knockdown? Yes, balanced stance and dolyak signet. I am not afraid of anyone stupid enough to use that and probably have better targets to choose from than a warrior who uses balanced stance. It is not like he is going to hurt my team any anyways, so I will allow him to continue to noob it up.

6, And diversion screws up any monk in AB too. Does that mean monks in general are a bad build? Also, refer to number 3, excluding the text in the parentheses.

7, Frenzy allows you to pull off chains faster and deal more damage than a warrior can. I am yet to see a warrior kill a soft target in 4 seconds, it usually takes them about 10 or more, including adrenalin building time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kijik Oni Hanryuu

umm anyway, I don't see too darn much fault in the build except for frenzy, if a tank can use frenzy, you can't use frenzy.

1, I am not a tank

2, "tanks" do not use frenzy, they use balanced stance and doylak signet apparently. Go talk to Xioden I bet he has awsome anti-knockdown tank builds which are awsome for farming. And btw, this is for PvP, not for PvE incase you missed the last 4 words of my first post (not counting the ones in parentheses).

3, I can use what I want, frenzy works well with the build, so I shall continue to use it if tanks use frenzy or not.

Siren · Jul 07, 2006, 01:48 PM // 13:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legendary Battousai

sigh... I posted what works well, kills many things and because simple logic eludes you does not mean that everyone else in the world is an idiot and your the only one here that has a life. That insult is pretty lame too, so please get a real one if your going to waste my time reading your posts that you fancied up with dictionary.com because you wanted to look smarter than everyone here. I dont mind criticism that is feasible, and I do agree frenzy on an assassin is very stupid for 99% of people who play guild wars, but the 1% who actually know when and when not to use frenzy may enjoy this build. You are obviously not one of the 1%, so please go troll another thread.

Then I'd love to face your build in PvP and decimate you, because against any coherent, attentive player, you're dead within a second. If you've been having success with your build, you've been facing complete and utter scrubs, simple as that. I offered you criticism that was entirely "feasible." You reacted like some hyperemotional teenager. Keep replying like you've got some magical build. You don't have a magical build. Hell, you barely have a build in the first place.

By the way...Frenzy? You know how and when to use it, you say? I've killed Frenzying Warriors in a second, with one skill, just as they started to Frenzy. You think you're somehow going to bypass those windows of Mesmer opportunity, just because you've had dumb luck so far?

Xioden · Jul 07, 2006, 02:14 PM // 14:14

I wasted my time writing up a point-by-point rebuttal, hit submit and it just sorta never showed. Being as it's a waste of time to retype I'll say the following:

If you think it works so great run with it. More likely than not you've just been running up against complete idiots, but your running this in RA so its not too surprising. People tried pointing out flaws in the build, you do nothing but swear about your godly KD chain. So have fun running around with it, and I hope I run into you at some point so I can laugh after I drop the frenzy-sin in no time flat.

Kijik Oni Hanryuu · Jul 07, 2006, 07:42 PM // 19:42

Battousai, watch your use of words, you really come off flaming, and Siren, give him some slack man, lol siren really adamant about your points..

Celab · Jul 07, 2006, 10:38 PM // 22:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Siren

Then I'd love to face your build in PvP and decimate you, because against any coherent, attentive player, you're dead within a second. If you've been having success with your build, you've been facing complete and utter scrubs, simple as that. I offered you criticism that was entirely "feasible." You reacted like some hyperemotional teenager. Keep replying like you've got some magical build. You don't have a magical build. Hell, you barely have a build in the first place.

By the way...Frenzy? You know how and when to use it, you say? I've killed Frenzying Warriors in a second, with one skill, just as they started to Frenzy. You think you're somehow going to bypass those windows of Mesmer opportunity, just because you've had dumb luck so far?

You would have already created a character to combat this one i pressume? probably a pure earth who uses kinetic armor, armor of earth and their own knockdowns with ward against melee?

or maybe a mesmer with empathy, or a warrior with doylak's. Maybe a ranger with a defence skill.

Every character has a weakness, and that weakness has a weakness.
It may be easy to point out this characters weakness, and to critisize it.

One suggestion i would make though, is adding some sort of shadow stepping. Because you can, as you say, kill a fleshy in 4 seconds, you should be gone before anyone realises your there.

Siren · Jul 07, 2006, 11:21 PM // 23:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Celab

You would have already created a character to combat this one i pressume? probably a pure earth who uses kinetic armor, armor of earth and their own knockdowns with ward against melee?

or maybe a mesmer with empathy, or a warrior with doylak's. Maybe a ranger with a defence skill.

It's a classic Mesmer build that I run in GvG, using Prophecies skills. lol. And Empathy has nothing to do with it.

Celab · Jul 08, 2006, 09:36 AM // 09:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Siren

It's a classic Mesmer build that I run in GvG, using Prophecies skills. lol. And Empathy has nothing to do with it.

Forgot the name of the skill, but it does damage when you attack, i think its empathy. assassins speed with that skill = ouch.

Legendary Battousai · Jul 10, 2006, 07:25 AM // 07:25

Well I have been running this build for about 2 months and came across bloodlight eyes, a few WM players and other high ranked players that know how to play well and they cant do much to stop me from slaughtering, regulardless if they know I have frenzy or not.

All this talk about eles spiking me and yet I completely demolish almost every ele, necros can cast hexes all they want on me and I can either kite or kill them through it, mesmers can cast empathy on me and I will *gasp* not attack with frenzy or through it at all, warriors get completely annihilated by it unless they spam riposite and deadly riposite (switch targets anyone?), touch rangers get knocked down so many times they cant cast at all, and regular rangers either run or get slaughtered. The only times I have died were from running into large groups, so Im confused as to where everyone says that they would spike me down as soon as they use frenzy and yet day after day I keep winning without being spiked down, choosing when to use frenzy.

Any coherent, attentive player cant attack me when I use frenzy during horns of the ox and not before it, so there is no return attack, its stand there and take a damn beating. You can have all the spike skills in the world and it will not save you when your on your ass. Sure, counters like ward of stability might hurt, going into groups an being hunted down by 4 people will destroy this build, but all of these are counterable themselves by either avoiding the situation, kiting into npcs or not using frenzy 24/7.