Curse

rick1027 · Apr 26, 2007, 02:34 AM // 02:34

its funny its one of the few primaries i like. one that works fine as it is. if you wanna fix a primary go strength or soul reaping or fast casting

Samurai-JM · Apr 26, 2007, 03:31 AM // 03:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Isil`Zha

No, it probably seems that way cause I was talking about it as if AL affected your chance to critical strike, which I now know it does... it just has to do with level.

So, by basing it on the correct value, my suggestion would fix Critical Strikes for PvE, and have no affect whatsoever on PvP.

So, now that I know, here's my modified suggestion:

In PvE, as previously mentioned, the Assassin's e-management gets nerfed to almost nothing because of the huge level difference of high-level enemies.

Speccing 1 into Critical Strikes would make it so that the reduction in the ability to make critical hits, is capped at level 20. IE: When playing as an Assassin, if you come up against a level 27 monster, your chance to critical will be as though you were attacking a level 20 monster, not the damage done by the critcals, just the chance to land a critical hit.

As you can see, since everyone in PvP is already level 20, this would have no affect on PvP whatsoever, and not shove Assassin's out of late-game areas by making their primary attribute nearly useless.

Since when has the chance to land a crit been determined by enemy armor?

I never noticed, probably since I just use Critical Strike in builds where I actually need crits. But if it is determined by armor, then this is a good suggestion. I thought it was only from the level of CS, meaning 0% on non assassins and +13% at 13 CS.

If it is affected as you say, then /signed.

Skyy High · Apr 26, 2007, 03:57 AM // 03:57

Assassins are far better at taking out enemy warriors than any other physical profession. The vast majority of their damage comes from +damage on their skills, and conditions like deep wound, both of which are armor ignoring. High armor does basically nothing to defend against an assassin, since armor will only reduce it's already-pitiful auto attack damage.

Summary: you're trying to fix the assassin for a problem that is not there.

Alleji · Apr 26, 2007, 04:07 AM // 04:07

Critical strikes don't need to be fixed.

First, assassin damage is nearly unaffected by armor. Daggers do pitiful base damage anyway and 80% of assassin's damage is from bonus on attack and conditions, both of which ignore armor.

Second, critical chance is based on level, not AL, so in PvP you always have same crit%. In PvE, doing less damage to higher level mobs is only in line with other classes, such as warrior, dervish, paragon, ele, and rit, who all get hindered by higher armor of high-level mobs.

Next time please do some research before posting an argument that completely falls apart because you got your facts wrong.

LightningHell · Apr 26, 2007, 04:43 AM // 04:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tan Blademaster

QFT

I can't really belive anyone is complaining about CS. It's a pretty dam good Primary Attritube as far as they go.

I mean, look at Strength - now THAT's a bad attribute.

THe only problem that you could argue however, is the fact that the breakpoint for 3 energy is 13 CS, which is quite high, thus reducing the amount of other attributes you can specify in. But that's only if I'm nitpicking.

Expanding on that point, the reason why people spec into Strength is because it has worthwhile skills, like Enraging Charge. Strength may be a pile of crap, but it grows beautiful roses.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samurai-JM

Since when has the chance to land a crit been determined by enemy armor?

I never noticed, probably since I just use Critical Strike in builds where I actually need crits. But if it is determined by armor, then this is a good suggestion. I thought it was only from the level of CS, meaning 0% on non assassins and +13% at 13 CS.

If it is affected as you say, then /signed.

So, according to your logic...Warriors, Dervishes, and Paragons would have no chance to crit?

Sol Deathgard · Apr 26, 2007, 04:47 AM // 04:47

I actually have no problems getting energy from critical strikes from any class, Warriors included. Armor level does not matter on getting a critical strike. If you are having energy problems, then you need to raise your Critical Strikes att a little more to increase the chance of getting one.

LightningHell · Apr 26, 2007, 04:52 AM // 04:52

13 Critical Strikes should be what you're aiming for, as that's the breakpoint for 3 energy per critical hit.

Xiaxhou of Trinity · Apr 26, 2007, 05:13 AM // 05:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by rick1027

its funny its one of the few primaries i like. one that works fine as it is. if you wanna fix a primary go strength or soul reaping or fast casting

you just attacked the warrior......REDENGINEGOREDENGINEGORED......

Strength is in no need of being fixed, it's the warrior's strongest attribute (i suppose you're no warrior..). Soul Reaping can be conditional on it's benefit but it seems balanced enough. Fast Casting has it's uses here and there though is not widely used, a few more skills in this attribute would help.

IMO I do not have much energy problem with assassin (zealous dags with their fast attack speed and black lotus strike =]). Though I have to say that maybe an increase in Critical percentage that is a bonus from Critical Strikes attribute can be beneficial. I was trying to run a Crit Ranger with Disrupting Accuracy and etc, running 16 crit strikes (decently experienced sin my sin is about a month old) and I did not have many interrupts with the build. Of course it relies on near 24/7 criticals, and the attack speed on the bow is a bit slower than daggers but I was still hitting criticals.....though just not very much. The thing is you need to pump up Crit Strikes so high to get casual criticals, and at 10 it is near useless aside from it's skills. Great att though! lol

LightningHell · Apr 26, 2007, 05:28 AM // 05:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xiaxhou of Trinity

you just attacked the warrior......REDENGINEGOREDENGINEGORED......

Strength is in no need of being fixed, it's the warrior's strongest attribute (i suppose you're no warrior..). Soul Reaping can be conditional on it's benefit but it seems balanced enough. Fast Casting has it's uses here and there though is not widely used, a few more skills in this attribute would help.

Strength is the Warrior's strongest attribute...

...until you take into consideration the three Weapon Masteries.

Yanman.be · Apr 26, 2007, 07:36 AM // 07:36

I do agree on Critical Strikes limiting sin builds ( especially dagger users ).

You basically NEED 13 crit strikes. that leaves little to no extra points for other attributes.

Coloneh · Apr 26, 2007, 09:39 PM // 21:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xiaxhou of Trinity

Strength is in no need of being fixed, it's the warrior's strongest attribute

thats all i could read, it was to funny. strength is the worst primary attribute by far. adding AP? how useless is that. go try your warrior with 0 strength and tell me what the damage difference is.

Samurai-JM · Apr 26, 2007, 11:14 PM // 23:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

Expanding on that point, the reason why people spec into Strength is because it has worthwhile skills, like Enraging Charge. Strength may be a pile of crap, but it grows beautiful roses.

So, according to your logic...Warriors, Dervishes, and Paragons would have no chance to crit?

sry, +0%, not just 0 xD

Trylo · Apr 26, 2007, 11:35 PM // 23:35

you guys arent listening... he only wants it so that it is easier to maintain energy in higher level PVE areas... it wouldnt affect hitting warriors in pvp, it would stay the same. i dont have a sin in high level areas, i wouldnt know how bad it truly is. i would say that it cannot be as much as a gimp compared to any other class, and it is probably balanced compared to other classes...

rick1027 · Apr 26, 2007, 11:36 PM // 23:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xiaxhou of Trinity

you just attacked the warrior......REDENGINEGOREDENGINEGORED......

Strength is in no need of being fixed, it's the warrior's strongest attribute (i suppose you're no warrior..). Soul Reaping can be conditional on it's benefit but it seems balanced enough. Fast Casting has it's uses here and there though is not widely used, a few more skills in this attribute would help.

IMO I do not have much energy problem with assassin (zealous dags with their fast attack speed and black lotus strike =]). Though I have to say that maybe an increase in Critical percentage that is a bonus from Critical Strikes attribute can be beneficial. I was trying to run a Crit Ranger with Disrupting Accuracy and etc, running 16 crit strikes (decently experienced sin my sin is about a month old) and I did not have many interrupts with the build. Of course it relies on near 24/7 criticals, and the attack speed on the bow is a bit slower than daggers but I was still hitting criticals.....though just not very much. The thing is you need to pump up Crit Strikes so high to get casual criticals, and at 10 it is near useless aside from it's skills. Great att though! lol

sad fact is warrior is one of my first chars and is the one i hold many titles o. and strength doesn't make that much of a difference. i always thought tactics was a much better line but that may be my opinion

Kiba of hidden leaf · Apr 26, 2007, 11:49 PM // 23:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

thats all i could read, it was to funny. strength is the worst primary attribute by far. adding AP? how useless is that. go try your warrior with 0 strength and tell me what the damage difference is.

This is the difference:
16 Swords
10 Str - 0 Str

Auto attack: 2 dmg average difference
Pure Strike: 6 dmg average difference
Dragon Slash: 9 dmg difference

The more dmg you are dealing out the more penetration gives you in DPS.
Using an axe or hammer would be more efficient than a sword for strength. Mending wammos

LightningHell · Apr 27, 2007, 12:00 AM // 00:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kiba of hidden leaf

This is the difference:
16 Swords
10 Str - 0 Str

Auto attack: 2 dmg average difference
Pure Strike: 6 dmg average difference
Dragon Slash: 9 dmg difference

The more dmg you are dealing out the more penetration gives you in DPS.
Using an axe or hammer would be more efficient than a sword for strength. Mending wammos

Strength gives you armor penetration only if you're using an attack skill. That already makes your little chart wrong.

Also, the added damage from an attack skill is already armor ignoring, so it only adds the AP to the base damage on an attack skill.

viper11025 · Apr 27, 2007, 12:01 AM // 00:01

Sins need 80 armor OR more powerful skills.
It takes a pro to use them.I finally got my sin build perfected!It took 3 months

Crazyvietguy · Apr 27, 2007, 01:01 AM // 01:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by viper11025

Sins need 80 armor OR more powerful skills.
It takes a pro to use them.I finally got my sin build perfected!It took 3 months

WOW... umm so basically you want to make the warrior useless?

An assassin with 80AL would compeltely render the Warrior worthless because not only would it have close to the same AL, Assassins have much better defense skills.

Assassins have pretty powerful combos on their own, while a minor buff in some skills would be handy it isnt crucial. And.. it doesnt take a pro to use them, just takes practice.

AND the assassin primary is fine. One of the few primarys that can work for ANY melee class.
Critical Strikes > Strength.. any day

Dr Strangelove · Apr 27, 2007, 02:34 AM // 02:34

Spawning power would just like to poke its head in here and tell you to stop whining about ineffective primary attributes.

LightningHell · Apr 27, 2007, 02:39 AM // 02:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by viper11025

Sins need 80 armor OR more powerful skills.
It takes a pro to use them.I finally got my sin build perfected!It took 3 months

Please stop making them even more skillless than they already are in PvP.