Originally Posted by Theosephus

ontopic: Assassin utility is crap at the moment. i'd like to see some alternative sin builds that help keep it fun at least in PvE.

Originally Posted by Magikarp

i just dont understand the frustration you all have. its called the tab button. you radar tells you exactly how close someone is. if you see a sin in your aggro, preprot, and you should have a veil on anyhow. if you're a different class than a monk, call it, or kite back until they notice.

all blocking/blinding/interupting, still works just as well, if not better on a sin as it does any other physical class. its really just people wanting to be lazy, so they want to see something they actually have to work against get removed.

every good mmo or rpg has at least one stealth class, who sacrifice armor or auto attack damage output for huge single target dps, and the ability to critical and suprise the enemy. it allows a whole different spectrum of any game to be unlocked, rather than the Redcoats forming in a big wall and standing still firing muskets.

if the idea of suprise spikes is upsetting to you all, idk why you all play gws, seeing as thats all this game is really based around pvp wise. you complain because ONE sin could kill ONE person very fast, if you stand there like dummies while he does it, but you never mention ONE dervish tearing peoples asses, or ONE kd warrior shredding a target ect. not to mention, its easier to stop ONE, than it is to stop a TEAM.

ranger spikes, and bloodspike have always been much stronger options than a single sin running around trying to gank everyone. so what if you hide behind a rock, anyone can move, and while you all whine about a single assassin that you guys are too blind to see clearly running up to your aggro bubble, i'd actually like to see a nice bit of balance to the actually dangerous spikes. instagib just never struck me as something hard to counter i suppose...

Originally Posted by Keekles

You've ignored my statement about the importance of positioning. Battlefield awareness is also much more difficult that you're making it out to be, something moving to casting range is a lot harder to notice when there's 15 other dots on the compass, some of which are already inside casting range, some which are outside. Sins have better mobility than most other characters, kiting away while you're on a split is difficult, although it is not impossible.

I never said that sins couldn't be countered. Stop distorting my argument.

Regardless of if other MMOs have stealth classes or not, Guild Wars is already different from many other MMOs. To counter your redcoat statement, all classes in guild wars have the ability to split off, however, assassins completely ignore positioning with shadowsteps.

I've never been completely against tele-instagib. Once again, stop distorting my argument. I run an assassin for fun in pvp, every time the sin is nerfed, I have to find something else to run.

And you still haven't addressed why sins should be able to ignore an important part of the game, positioning. They should have greater mobility, I agree with that. But being able to completely ignore an aspect of the game is bad. (I don't know about you, but you can still spike things with 2 wars without needing teleports)

Originally Posted by moriz

the recent assassin skill updates, i feel, is merely the backlash from the fact that every assassin build post-NF that uses a hex conditional to trigger their lead skips is a cookie cutter build.

Originally Posted by Keekles

If you get rid of return, get rid of all the offensive ones as well please.

Originally Posted by Magikarp

i'd worry more about dervs and warriors using x/A skills than an actual assassin, who could be in a large amount of trouble if you counter him and start wailing on his face, moreso than the other melees.

Originally Posted by Bobby2

Indeed, but they DON'T, take for instance the popular Shock Axe build. Going /A would yield a Shadow Step in exchange for Shock. Apparently something about the KD is more attractive.

Moriz hit the nail on the head - with the BLS nerf all that was 'overpowered' disappeared.

Originally Posted by ensoriki

isn't there still that trampling ox bullshit moron sins use in low level pvp?

Originally Posted by Brimstonez

Boohoo...sins are taking over the battle arenas with their ganking. They're too powerful. They can kill way too fast.
(RESULT~Sin Nerf)

Boohoo...dervs are way too overpowered. They're taking over everything.
(RESULT~Derv Nerf)

Boohoo...monks are too strong, everyone is using them for solo'ing.
(RESULT~Monk Nerf) Though thanks to dedicated people, the solo'ing continues with new builds. Though I am rather pissed off that the heal party skills got trashed.

Boohoo...rits are taking over PvP with their spike teams. We can't beat them *no you just suck*
(RESULT~Rit Nerf)


Anyone else seeing a pattern here? So what if people come up with builds to do certain things. I feel that A.Net should not have the right to nerf these skills as badly as they do, for the sake of a few whingers. Every skill has a counter of some sort. There are ALWAYS ways to get around these supposed 'Overpowered' characters, it's just a matter of time and effort. A.Net is simply making things easier on PvP by nerfing these skills and forcing these 'elite groups' into creating new builds. By them doing this, it's just making a more lazy PvP community with no imagination.

Originally Posted by ensoriki

isn't there still that trampling ox bullshit moron sins use in low level pvp?

Originally Posted by Unreal Havoc

All it takes is a well placed interrupt, something any adequate player should be able to do, to keep an Assassin out of the game a while. That was before all the heavy nerfs. So I really don't see what all the bitching is about.

Assassins have powerful attack chains but they are easily stopped and the Assassin is pretty fragile to play. By weakening their attack chains, attacking their mobility, and not even attempting to even at least buff any survivability or utility they have, makes an underdog class even less powerful than it already was compared to other classes.