Curse

Bobby2 · Mar 08, 2009, 04:21 PM // 16:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by ele pl

Being able to remove conditions/hexes from your allys>KD. It's a team game.

Where did I mention taking HotO over those 2 Monk skills? Learn to reason, please.

X Cytherea X · Mar 11, 2009, 09:09 PM // 21:09

Quote:

Actually, it's exactly 100. KD is still more powerful. It's a team game.

so kd occasionally stops a skill from activating, sometimes it is an important one. but the threat is not over if the target is still alive. in RA, you cannot depend on your team to bring the damage, much less hit the guy you're kd-ing. id rather kill and be done with it.

Quote:

Being able to remove conditions/hexes from your allys>KD. It's a team game.

it's mostly for oneself but yes it can used on allies too. it's a very reliable bar

Tyla · Mar 11, 2009, 11:28 PM // 23:28

If you knock someone down, then you have quite a few advantages.

- It interrupts a skill.
- It disables the usage of the majority of skills.
- It sets up a knockdown chain to keep people from using skills, and sets up someone else to throw a D-Shot off, get in a better position for a kill and various other scenarios which include more defensive uses if need be.

Saying that it will only "interrupt a skill occasionally" is dumb and closed minded to all of the kill oppertunities and tactics that can be exploited by such tactics.

You also have a more flexible bar with HoTo. Not necessarily more powerful in "123456lolurded", but in utility.

I think I'd take the ability to aid others in their killing while holding better defense.

awry · Mar 12, 2009, 12:34 AM // 00:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Celeborn10

The reason people laugh at Critical Defenses is that it's easy to combat just by kiting against a sin for 8 seconds and then your hammer warrior can have their way with them. If you really want something that is hard to lineback, take Shadow Walk with a good cancelstance like Dark Escape or Dash. Don't pick something that makes you a sitting duck without any escape.

I remember playing AoD shocksin against a poor Shockaxe warrior (RA a year ago, good glad streak). The poor guy couldn't lineback me as I kept on jumping around and abusing the terrain. Mobility was and still is the Assassin's domain.

As for the build, drop wild strike+GLS+BoS and put Shock+Falling Spider/Falling Lotus+Twisting Fangs in. It helps against monks who like to use Disciplined Stance; count till the stance is about to end and knock them down with Shock. Ddagger also is an option to stop Guardian but it doesn't have the ability to lead into a chain like Shock does which makes your build more resilient to Shieldbash. As for Twisting Fangs, Deepwound trumps big damage and any melee bar should have a deepwound.

they can't kite you if you keep them perma crippled. melee out in the open, they can't do anything (run under cripple or attack back at blocks) unless their monk notices and dismisses/ guardian

awry · Mar 12, 2009, 12:38 AM // 00:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by X Cytherea X

so kd occasionally stops a skill from activating, sometimes it is an important one. but the threat is not over if the target is still alive. in RA, you cannot depend on your team to bring the damage, much less hit the guy you're kd-ing. id rather kill and be done with it.

it's mostly for oneself but yes it can used on allies too. it's a very reliable bar

kd is awesome. End of story. it prevents kiting, prevents healing, can be used defensively to stop someone from raping your own monk. there's a reason why war hammer kd attacks are so freaking expensive. no trampling on a ps sin is fail.

X Cytherea X · Mar 12, 2009, 08:17 PM // 20:17

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kd is awesome. End of story. it prevents kiting, prevents healing, can be used defensively to stop someone from raping your own monk. there's a reason why war hammer kd attacks are so freaking expensive. no trampling on a ps sin is fail.

trampling is on the bar dumbass learn2read lol

Quote:

I think I'd take the ability to aid others in their killing while holding better defense.

that's not a role i like to play

Bobby2 · Mar 12, 2009, 09:34 PM // 21:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by X Cytherea X

so kd occasionally stops a skill from activating, sometimes it is an important one.

I will stop arguing with you here. We play totally different games.

Lusciious · Mar 12, 2009, 10:56 PM // 22:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by X Cytherea X

[palm strike][trampling ox][falling lotus strike][twisting fangs][blades of steel][remove hex][mending touch][resurrection signet]

this is the best palm strike build for RA.

so a chain like PS -> Trampling -> Lotus -> Twisting Fangs before using the same chain but now with blades of steel ? if there is a healer, the other chain wouldn't be as good since your DW is removed.

off topic: i'd rather get [backbreaker][flurry][falling spider][twisting fangs][falling lotus strike][blades of steel]. a normal BB bar is probably the strongest spike bar you can get. probably cus nobody likes building up adren. it only takes 10 seconds to build up the adren needed to use BB. lets say if you're going against a monk, you wouldnt be able to kill anyone unless you assist someone's spike or the monk fail at monking. but with BB, you can even kill a 100al when your spike finishes ( go test it at the isle of nameless ) and monks usually cast Patient spirit when you do twisting fangs and with an IAS, you'd be able to use Falling lotus + Blades of steel faster than Patient spirit's end effect can take place. i've killed many 60al profession in monk teams. try it for yourself if you don't believe.

back to topic: and PS can be easily interupted. so .. and without an IAS, your chain wouldn't be as effective as monks can easily negate your spike.

@ele pl, yeah i agree its a team game. no offence but its with people like you with that cause RA to be so easy. you bring hybrid builds thinking that you can assist + kill which isn't true when your damage can't do much at all.
sins usually don't pressure. they spike. thats what they're made for. so you're saying a w/mo with healing breeze to help heal party members ?

ele pl · Mar 12, 2009, 11:14 PM // 23:14

@up

Well, i understand your point. For long time, i was against all Cytherea's builds, because i though it was just version of wammo with assassin primary. I changed my mind, when i played that build once. A sin with this bar can kill, even without IAS, mending touch and holy veil is to counter the best counter to the sins, like blind and melee hexes. Also, hybrid builds are fun imo

Stealth Bomberman · Mar 13, 2009, 02:37 AM // 02:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lusciious

sins usually don't pressure. they spike. thats what they're made for.

no other prof can incorporate multiple conditions and hexes in one bar like sins. they're a pressure class to me with the potential to spike.

Bobby2 · Mar 13, 2009, 08:52 AM // 08:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stealth Bomberman

no other prof can incorporate multiple conditions and hexes in one bar like sins. they're a pressure class to me with the potential to spike.

Man PS really fked up some people brains...

Dronte · Mar 13, 2009, 09:07 AM // 09:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by ele pl

Pretty much this.

Being able to remove conditions/hexes from your allys>KD. It's a team game.

Thats an obvious contradiction. Its a team game, that means your monk has to do its own job so you can concentrate on killing (and thats the assassin's job).

Stealth Bomberman · Mar 13, 2009, 05:46 PM // 17:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby2

Man PS really fked up some people brains...

I dont use PS so you cant be talkin bout me.

Bobby2 · Mar 14, 2009, 09:14 AM // 09:14

Oh, but I was. If your remark didn't stem from warped views caused by extensive PS usage, I'd like to know what counts as 'pressure' for your argument...

X Cytherea X · Mar 14, 2009, 12:37 PM // 12:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lusciious

so a chain like PS -> Trampling -> Lotus -> Twisting Fangs before using the same chain but now with blades of steel ? if there is a healer, the other chain wouldn't be as good since your DW is removed.

no, it's ps-to-fls-tf-ps-bos. 61+160++ damage on a target with dw is epic pain.

Quote:

off topic: i'd rather get [backbreaker][flurry][falling spider][twisting fangs][falling lotus strike][blades of steel]. a normal BB bar is probably the strongest spike bar you can get. probably cus nobody likes building up adren. it only takes 10 seconds to build up the adren needed to use BB. lets say if you're going against a monk, you wouldnt be able to kill anyone unless you assist someone's spike or the monk fail at monking. but with BB, you can even kill a 100al when your spike finishes ( go test it at the isle of nameless ) and monks usually cast Patient spirit when you do twisting fangs and with an IAS, you'd be able to use Falling lotus + Blades of steel faster than Patient spirit's end effect can take place. i've killed many 60al profession in monk teams. try it for yourself if you don't believe.

yeah but if a blindbot or any average nec so much as looks at you, you can expect to spend most of the match doing pretty much nothing. and dont tell me "kill him first/run away/wait for it to wear off/let your monk remove it", nothing beats removing it yourself right when you need to. i can even do this mid-combo, it must surprise the shit out of the poor antimelee im slaying.

now if you were talking about TA, i would gladly leave the cleanup to the designated guy on the team and possibly bring a bar like that one.

Quote:

back to topic: and PS can be easily interupted. so .. and without an IAS, your chain wouldn't be as effective as monks can easily negate your spike.

no they fail quite a lot.

Quote:

@ele pl, yeah i agree its a team game. no offence but its with people like you with that cause RA to be so easy. you bring hybrid builds thinking that you can assist + kill which isn't true when your damage can't do much at all.
sins usually don't pressure. they spike. thats what they're made for. so you're saying a w/mo with healing breeze to help heal party members ?

not healing breeze. but if he brought my same 2 monk skills, he would be decent. healing breeze is a weak defensive skill. but get this... [remove hex] and [mending touch] on a sin in RA are powerful offensive skills, more so than an ias, and they will bring you more success.

Dronte · Mar 15, 2009, 04:16 PM // 16:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by X Cytherea X

no, it's ps-to-fls-tf-ps-bos. 61+160++ damage on a target with dw is epic pain.

yeah but if a blindbot or any average nec so much as looks at you, you can expect to spend most of the match doing pretty much nothing. and dont tell me "kill him first/run away/wait for it to wear off/let your monk remove it", nothing beats removing it yourself right when you need to. i can even do this mid-combo, it must surprise the shit out of the poor antimelee im slaying.

Against a blindbot or an average nec you would spend most of your time pretty much doing nothing EVEN with remove hex and mending touch. Faintheartedness or IP covered with parasitic is the least you will get. And thats still pretty lucky, imagine a mesmer there as well.
Ebon Dust Aura/bsurge low recharge simply owns mending touch so.. If you want to make yourself clean go Mo/A with PnH at least in the current meta.

Tyla · Mar 15, 2009, 04:32 PM // 16:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by X Cytherea X

that's not a role i like to play

Well you sure like to bring your removals which can be utilised in defense and offense...

Also, if a Necromancer is hexing you, Veil will be a lot better, and if a blindbot is coming onto you, you'll probably be blind more than you can remove. That, and when you cast, you also get this thing called "aftercast" which lets them have even more time to move away from you, and that makes a problem when you don't have an IMS of some sort.

Please improve.

Selket · Mar 15, 2009, 05:09 PM // 17:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

Also, if a Necromancer is hexing you, Veil will be a lot better, and if a blindbot is coming onto you, you'll probably be blind more than you can remove. That, and when you cast, you also get this thing called "aftercast" which lets them have even more time to move away from you, and that makes a problem when you don't have an IMS of some sort.

Remove Hex has a shorter recharge, veil would not be better.

There are tonnes of ways that you can overcome any blindbot problem with mend touch and palm strike.

In either case, RA is bad and you're both bad for arguing bad things.

The real palm strike answer is:
[palm strike][flurry][trampling ox]([falling spider] or [falling lotus strike])[twisting fangs][blades of steel][dash][bull's strike]

Dronte · Mar 15, 2009, 06:05 PM // 18:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Selket

Remove Hex has a shorter recharge, veil would not be better.

Wow. Its not all about recharge, if you start casting remove hex you'll end up removing parasitic bond or wastrels worry from yourself >< veil is instant remove

X Cytherea X · Mar 15, 2009, 06:21 PM // 18:21

Quote:

Against a blindbot or an average nec you would spend most of your time pretty much doing nothing EVEN with remove hex and mending touch. Faintheartedness or IP covered with parasitic is the least you will get. And thats still pretty lucky, imagine a mesmer there as well.
Ebon Dust Aura/bsurge low recharge simply owns mending touch so.. If you want to make yourself clean go Mo/A with PnH at least in the current meta.

Quote:

Also, if a Necromancer is hexing you, Veil will be a lot better, and if a blindbot is coming onto you, you'll probably be blind more than you can remove. That, and when you cast, you also get this thing called "aftercast" which lets them have even more time to move away from you, and that makes a problem when you don't have an IMS of some sort.

i wont try to remove every single blind or hex. sometimes i even let them stay on and spam palm strike until i successfully time the removal simultaneously with the cond/hex application and use moments of (relative or complete) cleanliness to get kills. i also try to trample their recast of any antimelee stuff.