Curse

Red Fireball · Jun 18, 2010, 10:47 PM // 22:47

hey all,

I wanted to start a thread listing oldschool, req9/8/7 20%HSR/20%HCT wands and offhands. I´d just put those in here, which have all mods and the req on the same attribute

just post items you have seen. Just post what you know about the item: order of the mods, item´s value, current owner (pay attention: no full IGNs due to the Trader´s outpost guidelines), custo/non custo?, maybe add a screen.
Also post if it is 20/19 and q8(or q7^^), cause rarity should be similar...
I got special interest in offhands, due to the fact, that the one closest to these stats I saw was a q12 air 20/19 storm artifact...

here the list of the items posted in the thread:

ele:
q9 earth: earth wand 20HCT/20HSR value: 220g (mine)
q9 earth: earth wand 20HCT/20HSR value: 204g (Partizanovac´s) - customized
[q7 energy: plagueborn focus 20/19 Water] - thought this is worth putting it on here, so I added it

(even if mixed (req and dualmods))

mesmer:

monk:

necro:
q9 curses: straw effigy 20%HSR/20%HCT
[q8 death: deathly cesta 19HSR/20HCT value: 372g (dunno)]

ritualist:

I´d be happy about loads of posts revealing some other gw treasures.

cheers,
Red Fireball

Pleikki · Jun 19, 2010, 12:54 AM // 00:54

there is hundreds and hundreds of em excisting, ones of nicests are like. Luke D:s r9 20/20 curses straw effigy, image in other thread here, simply they've become more rare recently due noneone plays tyria or proph so much

Red Fireball · Jun 19, 2010, 09:54 AM // 09:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pleikki

there is hundreds and hundreds of em excisting, ones of nicests are like. Luke D:s r9 20/20 curses straw effigy, image in other thread here, simply they've become more rare recently due noneone plays tyria or proph so much

well, I guess we could just list the ones req7,8 or 9 here, if there are too many to list with higher reqs. the straw effigy is really nice!
could you please post a link to that post with the pic (couldn´t find it...)?

system.fan · Jun 19, 2010, 02:32 PM // 14:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Fireball

hey all,

I wanted to start a thread listing oldschool, req9/8/7 20%HSR/20%HCT wands and offhands. I´d just put those in here, which have all mods and the req on the same attribute

won't work anyway cause there are thousands of em.... pretty useless thread but well:

you only want 20/20's with same attribute as the req right?
you should delete Luke's straw effigy from your list then... its soul reaping + curses^^

hmm some of the coolest 20/20's or 20/19's ive seen were:

- Req7ES 20/19water plagueborn focus (you can find it in exposition thread i guess... one of the last 5 sites)
- Req9DF 20/19heal paper fan

Yawgmoth · Jun 19, 2010, 04:20 PM // 16:20

For those doubting that those are very rare I got some figures - Approximate chances for:

A random Gold Tyrian/Canthan Necromancer Wand (for example "Truncheon") to be 20HCT/20HSR of the same attribute as req. is:
0.0164609%, that is for example 1 in 6,075 Gold Truncheons will be 20/20 Blood/Blood.
if you also want it to be req.9 then it's:
0.0032922% = 1 in 30,375.

For Elementalist Wands (for example "Fire Wand") the chances are lower:
1 in 10,800 Gold Fire Wands will be 20/20 Fire/Fire
if you want it to be req.9 then the chance drops to:
1 in 54,000.

And how about the cool Multiprofession wands, like for example a Zodiac Scepter? The rates are just fantastic, have a look:

If you get a Gold Zodiac Scepter (or any other multiprofession wand) to drop, the chances for it being:

- 20/20 of the same attribute, with ANY (9-13, matching or unmatching) reqirement is:
1 in 12,150

- 20/20 of the same attribute as the req (I don't count hct/hsr healing, prot or illusion with req. divine or something else here at all)
1 in 218,700 - this is astronomical, there are less of those than unconditionals imho.

- 20/20 of the same attribute with req.9 of a specific attribute requirement you want
(for example 20/20 Domination req.9 Domination or 20/20 Healing req.9 Healing)

1 in 15,309,000

yes, 1 in over 15 Million chance. Good luck

For comparison, chance for any oldschool Gold Wand to be 10/10 is just 1:132

Despite having collected enough data to make quite precise rarity approximations for any mod combinations, I haven't found even one matching 20/20 wand myself, including all the years of GW before I started recording data.

I don't have precise calculations for focus items done yet but I can assure you that it's a much greater degree of rarity.
Without doing any calculations I'd expect chance for a gold Straw Effigy drop to be an identical copy of that infamous 20/20 curses /req9SR http://img697.imageshack.us/img697/6388/strawdog.jpg (except the gold value and order of mods) to be smaller than 1 in 100 Million.

system.fan · Jun 19, 2010, 06:00 PM // 18:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yawgmoth

Despite having collected enough data to make quite precise rarity approximations for any mod combinations, I haven't found even one matching 20/20 wand myself, including all the years of GW before I started recording data.

Those are some rly interesting statistics... But well how did you do those calculations? where did you get those amounts? =)

I'm pretty sure it's not that easy to say how "rare" something is

Cause like you said... you never got any 20/20wand with fitting mods.
But well I got 3 from chestruns....and i'm pretty sure you started playing earlier than me

So i guess the chance that i get 3 and you get 0 with only calculations is... well rly rly low^^

I got:
Truncheon req13 20/20blood
Smiting Wand (or rod) dont remember the exact english name req10 20/20smite
Amber Wand Req9Spawn 20/20channelling

Guess I still have screenshots of amber and smiting anywhere. might post em later if I find them.... but well got over 2k screens so i cant promise anything :/

best wishes

Luke D · Jun 21, 2010, 09:21 PM // 21:21

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/q...t10409781.html

Here's a link to the thread with the 20/19 water req 7ES plagueborn focus. I still have a subscription to this thread just so I can take a look at it every once in a while

Yeah, I'm kinda sad like that.

Red Fireball · Jun 21, 2010, 10:11 PM // 22:11

yawgmoth, tyvm for the statistics! (I´d also be interested how you calculated these numbers, I guess just analyzing drops!? - well not "just", cause I guess it would be a lot of work...)

for all the others, who said that these items are some kind of common and not at all rare and that thousands of these would exist...: Yawgmoth expressed it in numbers, what I am thinking about these items´ rarities - never saw one on the whole german wartower forum since start of that homepage (unfortunately here on guru old thread contents are always destroyed, which makes it impossible to check on items, that were sold here long time ago). So I guessed they might be pretty rare, maybe even rarer than some things like unconds (as Yawgmoth said).
Therefore I´d be interested in the thousands of wands oldschool q9 (lower) 20/20 on same attribute, that are out there according to other entries. Please prove, that there are many more out there than I thought, by posting screens or links to old threads. I´m looking forward to find screens of nice oldschool wands, cause I think: Inscriptions destroyed the rarity of perfect weps and made them just common! (everybody in Guildwars got many perfect 20/20 wands for their caster classes nowadays, whereas almost none has an oldschool one of these - ofc they got exactly the same functionality, but I think that perfect weapons shouldn´t be that usual)
well everything just my opinion, which doesn´t change the fact that this thread was started to collect screens or reports of these items requested in the original post ;-)
go on posting here, maybe someone could start with screenies finally... :-)
cheers,
Red

system.fan · Jun 22, 2010, 11:34 AM // 11:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Fireball

So I guessed they might be pretty rare, maybe even rarer than some things like unconds

thats just ridiculous

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Fireball

maybe someone could start with screenies finally

Well YOU started the thread. And YOU want a list of all 20/20's lower q9 (what is impossible anyway)....
You can find screens of all items posted here so far and many others in guru... so why don't YOU start with some screenshots eh??

byteme! · Jun 22, 2010, 01:12 PM // 13:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yawgmoth

For those doubting that those are very rare I got some figures - Approximate chances for:

A random Gold Tyrian/Canthan Necromancer Wand (for example "Truncheon") to be 20HCT/20HSR of the same attribute as req. is:
0.0164609%, that is for example 1 in 6,075 Gold Truncheons will be 20/20 Blood/Blood.
if you also want it to be req.9 then it's:
0.0032922% = 1 in 30,375.

For Elementalist Wands (for example "Fire Wand") the chances are lower:
1 in 10,800 Gold Fire Wands will be 20/20 Fire/Fire
if you want it to be req.9 then the chance drops to:
1 in 54,000.

And how about the cool Multiprofession wands, like for example a Zodiac Scepter? The rates are just fantastic, have a look:

If you get a Gold Zodiac Scepter (or any other multiprofession wand) to drop, the chances for it being:

- 20/20 of the same attribute, with ANY (9-13, matching or unmatching) reqirement is:
1 in 12,150

- 20/20 of the same attribute as the req (I don't count hct/hsr healing, prot or illusion with req. divine or something else here at all)
1 in 218,700 - this is astronomical, there are less of those than unconditionals imho.

- 20/20 of the same attribute with req.9 of a specific attribute requirement you want
(for example 20/20 Domination req.9 Domination or 20/20 Healing req.9 Healing)

1 in 15,309,000

yes, 1 in over 15 Million chance. Good luck

For comparison, chance for any oldschool Gold Wand to be 10/10 is just 1:132

Despite having collected enough data to make quite precise rarity approximations for any mod combinations, I haven't found even one matching 20/20 wand myself, including all the years of GW before I started recording data.

I don't have precise calculations for focus items done yet but I can assure you that it's a much greater degree of rarity.
Without doing any calculations I'd expect chance for a gold Straw Effigy drop to be an identical copy of that infamous 20/20 curses /req9SR http://img697.imageshack.us/img697/6388/strawdog.jpg (except the gold value and order of mods) to be smaller than 1 in 100 Million.

Not sure on these numbers but I believe it's reasonable to assume they are quite rare. In the 5+ years I've been playing I've seen more unconditionals then perfect 20/20's. You look around at all these collectors over the years and even they don't have many 20/20's.

system.fan · Jun 22, 2010, 01:21 PM // 13:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by byteme!

In the 5+ years I've been playing I've seen more unconditionals then perfect 20/20's..

you can buy req13 20/20 truncheon or similar crap skins for less than 100k.
you won't get any unconditional (no matter what req, dmg or dmg mod) for under 1750e...

there are far more 20/20's than unconditionals lol..... unconds only dropped in a period of time. 20/20 shit can drop since 5 years and still does...

its like comparing Panda with any Bday-Miniature

Yawgmoth · Jun 22, 2010, 09:36 PM // 21:36

Please note I have compared only the rarity of Multiprofession Wands with 20/20 of the same attribute as the req with unconditionals. Multiprofession wands are the Canthan skins that can have requirements for all 5 caster professions. They're for example Zodiac, Celestial, Platinum, Koi, Plagueborn, Wayward. How many 20/20s of the same attribute as req have you seen of those?

Note that when calculating the estimate of 1 in 218,700 I didn't include ones which aren't exactly matching, like 20/20 healing with req Divine or 20/20 inspiration with req something else, but only ones with the same attribute to make it simplier.

There's an astronomical difference in rarity between 20/20s on those Multiprofession skins and 20/20s on skins exclusive to a profession as different parameters are used when generating those. Just compare the 1:6,000 chance for a 20/20 Truncheon to 1:218,700 of getting a Canthan Platinum Wand 20/20 of any matching attribute with the req.

As for the way I've calculated the estimated rarities, it should be obvious I didn't need millions of drops to estimate something can be of 1 in 10 million drop. It's about knowing how drops are generated and knowing the parameters and I think I'm very close with them. I may post the exact explanation of the method later or even make a calculation tool but not before I finish my work on on the formulas and parameters for Shields and Focus items aswell.

. .