Curse

Jab · Jun 02, 2005, 11:13 PM // 23:13

I also don't think monks need to be nerfed, but I do agree that the other classes need a few more ways to survive better. First off I think that at least 2 more classes should have some sort of unlimited rez skill, no where near as powerful as a monk, but something that can be used if let's say the entire party gets wiped except for a ranger, or warrior or someone who ran early. I think all casters need stronger armor to some extent that's including monks.

I've seen warriors survive 4 player beatdowns due to powerful armor. As a mes nec(main) if 2 guys are targeting me I'm pretty much dead with out healing.

Basically anything that can take some of the importence off of monks would be good.
Without nerfing them of course.

I would say that perhaps more skill intrrupting skills would do more to stop healing but after playing with mes , nec, warrior, and ranger skills I think there are enough of those out there.

Goonter · Jun 02, 2005, 11:18 PM // 23:18

Right Kuptain, but I was also suggesting how that could also reflect on how the classes them self should sustain themselves if they so choosed too.

Well, primehealer, you have a point.

Monks points are spread across 3 attubites to be both a good healer and attacker. Divine, Healing and Smite.

Warriors are the same sort of or could be, with Strength for defence, Tactics for offence and defence and whatever weapon for offence.

Rangers to, if skills are divide into Expertise for defence, Marskmanship offence, and Wilderness Survial for offence and defence.

Mesmers to, if skills are divide into Fast Casting (for fast casting), Domination for offence, Illusion for defence.

.....well..can necs and elements follow the same trend? I believe so.

The point of a beefer defence for classes would be for there own sake. A monk is still the only one that can add to the defence for everyones sake, cuz thats what monks do.

If you have a relaible monk on your team. Your warror doesnt need to beef up on defence skills. He can go straight offence.
I dont think monks should be pointless. I dont hate monks. But monks hold a certain nessacity that no other class has.

Even if you wanted to balance your defence out so you dont need a primary monk, you looking for a team that has a majority of secondary monks. Cuz monks is the only class that can add a relable defence. If you cant plan on anything else you'll encounter, pvp or pve, you can plan on that. Your going to need a healer.

It would help healers too. There job sucks, have you heard them complain?

Strong defencive possablites should be inherent to the class itself as is thier strong offence.

...actually, after some thinking about it. Even thought I like my own idea, I can see its not going to happen. We are to adjusted to the way things are now. The amount of time it would take to test, balance and intergrate into the game, to only be received with mix resolutes would probably make the idea no more than an "only if" idea.

But here this,.........................monks are to important. :P

And I wont be the last to say it! AND THE DAYS WILL COME WHEN YOU TO WILL FIND YOURSELVES IN NEED OF NOTHING BUT A MONK. ALL OF YOUR STRADIGIES WILL HENGE ON THOSE WHO CAN HEAL AND HOW THEY HEAL YOU! YOU WILL RUE THE DAY YOUNG SQUIRE! YOU WILL RUUUE THE DAY!

.....uhm...im done...thank you..

eA-Zaku · Jun 03, 2005, 06:28 AM // 06:28

Come on now, people...the power to heal does not make the monk unbalanced. It's what makes monks MONKS! If any other class could "sufficiently heal themselves" then what's the point of having a monk?!

And I've never seen monks charge to be in parties...nor have I charged people to be in their party.

DarrenJasper · Jun 03, 2005, 06:36 AM // 06:36

Nor have I, it's not a bad idea though. People will probably scoff at first, then I'll wait around for a while until they get really desperate, and double my price.

I already refuse to chip in for Temple missions so this seems like a logical step.

Hah, and if you nerf monks guess what will happen? People will leave the class (myself included) and you'll be stuck with less monks than there are now and missions of the same difficulty. In PvP the only groups with any left will be guilds, so your precious PUGs will be torn to shreds even faster than they are now. Yeah, that's a fabulous idea.

RTSFirebat · Jun 03, 2005, 07:18 AM // 07:18

I have no issues with all the monks running about. I just wish later missions didn't require them so badly. Its easy to get a party together, but finding monks is always hard!

Goonter · Jun 03, 2005, 07:29 AM // 07:29

........the power to heal is what makes the monks more balanced.

I never said the other classes should be able to heal. I never said nerfing monks now would be good.

..... I dont know how else to say what Ive been saying..

Zeno2750 · Jun 03, 2005, 07:44 AM // 07:44

Healer classes have been needed in hard missions and quests since the beginning of MMO's, or any RPG for that matter. Name one and I bet there are people who spam "LFG HEALER NEEDED" in it. Monks just get the most attention because they are the only class with the healing abilities. I have often seen my monk allies being killed first without a single other party member damaged, even healer henchmen. How much more can you nerf them?

Mah two cents.

Goonter · Jun 03, 2005, 07:48 AM // 07:48

Right. I see now that its important that, that never chances. Healers HAVE to be needed. Thats just the way it is.

Zeno2750 · Jun 03, 2005, 07:52 AM // 07:52

Its just a shame they're the only class that could heal others. I'm afraid to be a monk now, paranoid that my textbox will be filled with invitational whispers as soon as I step into town. I don't know, its probably not that bad.

DarrenJasper · Jun 03, 2005, 08:21 PM // 20:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeno2750

Its just a shame they're the only class that could heal others. I'm afraid to be a monk now, paranoid that my textbox will be filled with invitational whispers as soon as I step into town. I don't know, its probably not that bad.

No use being afraid, you're on the same server with thousands of people so the ones you interact with don't really matter. There's plenty of space to disappear.

And I rarely ever get tells, mostly just random invites that I promptly review and reject.

none · Jun 03, 2005, 09:16 PM // 21:16

Quote:

I think thats a better way to look at it, if im a lvl 20 warrior i should have the ability to do any mission alone, without help, if i cant acomplish this, then somthing is wrong. this i think is whare the problem is. is the fact that the monk, is the only profession that can remotly hold there own, and so i beleave the solution might be to add skills or less healing time to the other classes

Eh, this is not Diablo. You're (hopefully) never going to be able to do every mission alone. Heck, you shouldn't be able to do a single mission alone, except when you're bored and going back as a lvl 20 to do Fort Ranik or whatever. The whole concept of this game is based around group play, if you didn't get this, you better go back to Diablo, because you'll be much more satisfied there.

Oh, and just to mention it. No monk can do a mission alone. I could set up my skills, so that I can solo a certain part of the mission, but then again, I would probably miserably fail at other parts, because I didn't bring that 'anti-caster' or 'anti-melee' or 'megaheal' or whatever is needed. Each mission needs alot of different spells, too many to bring them all at once.

Quote:

No more than I think its sane for a group of 8 lvl20 players attacking a monk boss with little or no success.

Sorry, but whatever you did, you did something wrong. I just spent half an hour in Perdition Rock, battling a lvl 28 monk boss - and it was incredibly hard work to keep that bastard alive. I battled through half of the map and killed 4 (ele, warrior, necro²) other bosses in the process, just so that the monk boss could survive. Oh, and I had only henchies with me - including Mhenlo & Lina. Add to that myself, and you have 3 (heal & prot-)monks in the team, so only 5 slots for damage dealers. If I had wanted, I could have brought down the monk boss in a matter of seconds (or rather, the henchies could). I've spent alot of time in the Southern Shiverpeaks and Perdition Rock, and killed countless bosses of all classes. And monk bosses are no more difficult than any other bosses. If anything, they're easier, because their damage output is so crappy.

As for the rest. Nerf monks, yeah. That probably means the same as nerfing groups or nerfing every other class. Yes, monks are essential - but only because that's what they are supposed to be. They are healers. But they themselves need teammates as well. No matter how great your healing capabilites are, you're lost if you can't deal damage. You couldn't even get the drop from that single mob out there, because although you can easily outheal his uber-dmg, you can't get him down to more than two thirds of his lifebar. Every class has its own role in the party, and I think they're all pretty balanced. The only thing that isn't balanced so far, are the players.

Llud · Jun 04, 2005, 04:53 AM // 04:53

Having mesmers actually create illusions a player character can see would be really neat. But, this game has no monthly charge, and the extra expenses Arena NEt would have in order to implement them means thay won't do it. It'd be cool though.

mommas_b_o_y · Jun 04, 2005, 01:57 PM // 13:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by PrimeHealer

have the people that complain about monks ever tried really playing one? Probably not, they are not the easiest class to play and yes if we do good then people say so, but the same goes for if we do something bad we get yelled at or told we suck etc...its gotta be one of the most stressful posiotions to play in any game. Even if for some reason (which happens alot) that the mob the group is taking out hits the warrior 3 times with crits then warrior goes down, often I hear why didnt you heal me, well its really hard sometimes to pull off a heal in 2 seconds so again its the monks fault. Oh and soloing with a healing monk is completely out of the question, now Im talking about a pure healing monk, not one with smite and healing. Therefore the monk is not as "self sufficient" as people make them out to be. There are no healing druids, clerics, shamans, or any other type of priest class in this game, just one and that is the monk, so of course you hear alot of people asking for them...duh. In pvp and what seems like pve the monk is 1st on the hitlist and if the group isnt paying attention then bye bye healer, so ontop of watching out for yourself tremendously you're constantly looking at HP bars of others and have to be quick on the reflexes, plus our ability to heal ourselves isnt that great at all, so that is why it is more or less a necessity to have a 2nd or 3 rd monk in the group so they can help heal other monks. Monks are not played by just everyone, it takes a certain person I think IMO to play a pure healing class, and if you were to nerf a monk then we would start getting, "monks cant heal worth a crap and my party keeps dying" So I say before we start thinking monks are over powered and all that, go roll yourself a monk and play with him, Im not just talking a low level one, play him past ascending and in tombs then come back and state your post. I'll bet your attitude will have changed about them by then lol

Monk is the hardest to play.If we fail then we pummeled with insults.
But if your team doesnt kill fast enough its not there fault its yours cause u couldn't keep them alive for the 5 minutes it took for them to kill 1 player in pvp.So if your thinking of being a monk be prepared to take alot of abuse it comes with having the hardest job.

The Red Knight · Jun 04, 2005, 03:25 PM // 15:25

monks are fine stuff like rend enchant defile flesh and or concetrated ele fire on 1 monk is one dead monk