Curse

Nexx · Jul 12, 2005, 05:45 PM // 17:45

[my thoughts]

I'm sure many of us started off as warriors and tried playing PvP only to find how terrible they are in arenas... errr, how different they are. (okay okay... how difficult they are to play

)

A lot of warrior abilities and skills provide defense only to themselves and since in PvP, warriors are rarely targeted first.. much of what they used to be good at then, now stinks. Why? A complex answer with many perspectives but in short, I think other classes simply have better counters to stop warriors making the warrior's fearsome DPS output irrelevant in PvP.

At first I thought, "wow, warriors suck" but as many people on this forum have spoken or rather religiously argued: “The warrior is balanced. You just suck.” Well, I can't argue with that. If they can win in PvP and are selected regularly in arenas, obviously they're doing something right. Anyways, my post isn't about how different the warrior role is in PvP but rather how we can add new skills that can somewhat refocus what warriors do best so that they're useful again in PvP... well, in it's current form that is as the environment is always changing.

[/end my thoughts]

Why not add MORE area of effect warrior skills that provides bonuses to allies or other skills that help protect allies? Or even some interrupting or cross-class elemental defensive skills?

EXAMPLES:

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HARM’S WAY – Stance (Tactics)
For 10-20 seconds, whenever target nearby ally takes damage from an attack, redirected the damage to you. [Damage dealt to you this way is reduced by your equiped armor].

The skill is a stance so it will limit what skills a warrior can use but imagine how neat it would be to throw the stance on your caster. Also the nearby ally part will force the warrior to stay in close proximity to his "mark" (perhaps within aggro circle?) to stay true to the stance. It’ll be a great way to save casters whose life are low.

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”HOLD THE LINE!” – Shout. (Tactics)
For 8-18 seconds, you and nearby allies gain +24 armor against melee damage and can not be knocked down but move 33% slower.

Shields up counterpart but nevertheless a great shout to use with “Watch Yourself”. Hopefully the reduction in speed and armor bonus only for melee damage will offset the no knocked down bonus

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FLANKING SLASH – Sword Skill. (Swordsmanship)

If this attack hits, you strike for 5-9 more damage. If your target is also being attacked by an ally, you have a 10%~34% chance to interrupt target foe’s action.

A skill like this would encourage focused group attacks and would be a half decent interrupting spamming tool. It should probably be a low cost adrenaline skill like “sever artery” to really be effective but the fact that you need someone else to attack your target makes the skill more interesting to use.

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PIERCING BLOW – Skill. (Strength)
For 8 seconds, your melee attacks have an additional 1~10% armor penetration bonus.

Didn’t really think about this one much but how imagine how neat this skill would be if you used it before a final thrust or another high-damage melee attack.

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RESIST CONDITION – Skill. (Strength)
For 7-12 seconds, remove all negative conditions on you [and you are immuned to those conditions]. When this skill ends, return all removed conditions. (Lose “X” damage for each returned condition or Returned conditions last 50% longer).

Cripple getting you down?

Dumachum · Jul 12, 2005, 05:58 PM // 17:58

"Leeroy Jenkins" - Shout (tactics)
instantly aggros all mobs in a 250'' radius wiping your party and saving the idiot running the Warrior the time from training up everything by foot.

Kuku Monk · Jul 12, 2005, 08:08 PM // 20:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dumachum

"Leeroy Jenkins" - Shout (tactics)
instantly aggros all mobs in a 250'' radius wiping your party and saving the idiot running the Warrior the time from training up everything by foot.

Hahaha

Winterclaw · Jul 12, 2005, 10:01 PM // 22:01

My major qualm with warrior skills is their lack of self healing compared to other classes. The best they have is ViM, but you can only use that after you've put a few conditions on the other guy. Then again, you don't want monks to be useless (when you can find them).

I think they should have a few more adrenal based sword attacks but that's all I can think of right now.

Rayea · Jul 12, 2005, 10:27 PM // 22:27

how about this one?

Manac Strike
Sword skill
you sacrifce 50% of your health, but you deal a fatal blow to the opponent, providing they hit you while you cast.

like a guy that accepts a near or fatal blow in a gladiator dual, so that he can kill his opponent

CaptainGuru · Jul 12, 2005, 11:09 PM // 23:09

Quote:

HARM’S WAY – Stance (Tactics)
For 10-20 seconds, whenever target nearby ally takes damage from an attack, redirected the damage to you.

The skill is a stance so it will limit what skills a warrior can use but imagine how neat it would be to throw the stance on your caster. Also the nearby ally part will force the warrior to stay in close proximity to his "mark" (perhaps within aggro circle?) to stay true to the stance. It’ll be a great way to save casters whose life are low.

Not a good move because if a group of enemies attack the same target or targets around you while you use this move, it'll kill you.

Quote:

”HOLD THE LINE!” – Shout. (Tactics)
For 8-18 seconds, you and nearby allies gain +24 armor against melee damage and can not be knocked down but move 33% slower.

Shields up counterpart but nevertheless a great shout to use with “Watch Yourself”. Hopefully the reduction in speed and armor bonus only for melee damage will offset the no knocked down bonus

You'd end up snaring spellcasters nearby in the area with this move. Watch yourself is more safer than this move here.

Quote:

FLANKING SLASH – Sword Skill. (Swordsmanship)

If this attack hits, you strike for 5-9 more damage. If your target is also being attacked by an ally, you have a 10%~34% chance to interrupt target foe’s action.

A skill like this would encourage focused group attacks and would be a half decent interrupting spamming tool. It should probably be a low cost adrenaline skill like “sever artery” to really be effective but the fact that you need someone else to attack your target makes the skill more interesting to use.

It would be almost impossible to land attacks at the same time unless you were both using speed boost while pulling this move off.

Quote:

PIERCING BLOW – Skill. (Strength)
For 8 seconds, your melee attacks have an additional 1~10% armor penetration bonus.

Didn’t really think about this one much but how imagine how neat this skill would be if you used it before a final thrust or another high-damage melee attack.

Would be too uber to use W/R use Quickening Zephyr conjuction with this move.

Quote:

RESIST CONDITION – Skill. (Strength)
For 7-12 seconds, remove all negative conditions on you. When this skill ends, return all removed conditions. (Lose “X” damage for each returned condition or Returned conditions last 50% longer).

It would be useless and can used against you by Rangers or Necros who chain condition.

Nexx · Jul 13, 2005, 01:11 AM // 01:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainGuru

Not a good move because if a group of enemies attack the same target or targets around you while you use this move, it'll kill you.

Well, currently in PvP, I'll trade a warrior to save a caster any day.

Would factoring the Warrior's armor bonus make it more usable? Think of the warrior as being a bodyguard and throwing himself in front of the attack. Meatshield!

Quote:

You'd end up snaring spellcasters nearby in the area with this move. Watch yourself is more safer than this move here.

Yes, watch yourself is safer and better. No argument there but I was thinking more along the line of PvE (against stompers)... and besides, what are casters doing within the aggro circle of a frontline meatshield anyways? And don't casters normally run away from melee units in combat so shouldn't the bonus help (perhaps not enough, huh)?

Quote:

It would be almost impossible to land attacks at the same time unless you were both using speed boost while pulling this move off.

I don't think your ally needs to hit the target at the same time as you do but as long as the the enemy is being targeted and being damaged from two sources, it is possible. I'm sure the game can recognize and register that a target is being attacked from two sources. Would limiting the attack to another melee attacker be better or worst?

Quote:

Would be too uber to use W/R use Quickening Zephyr conjuction with this move.

Perhaps we can make the recharge time slower? How much more damage will a +10% pentration allow? Hmmm... I better look into the stats.

Quote:

It would be useless and can used against you by Rangers or Necros who chain condition.

I'm just trying to find a means to tackle the condition effects on a warrior without having them splash into another class. I don't think the warrior class has any way to deal with conditions... and no, "I will survive" does not deal with conditions. How about make them immune to the removed condition until the skill is over. For example, say the warrior is hit with cripple and blind. The warrior can remove those conditions temporary and be immune from them for the duration of the skill. But once the skill ends, everything comes back... perhaps even last longer? I don't know. Just throwing out ideas.

Either way, great responses. Do you have any recommendations or changes instead of one sentence bashing?

Mariodood · Jul 13, 2005, 01:52 AM // 01:52

Manac Strike
Sword skill
you sacrifce 50% of your health, but you deal a fatal blow to the opponent, providing they hit you while you cast.

Quite possibly the most broken skill ever, it would ruin the balance of the game, and you would get 8-Warrior teams who all used the skill = instant win, It would problably be used on every Warrior build.

The way Guild Wars is balanced you can't have skills that deal 1-hit blows

CaptainGuru · Jul 13, 2005, 02:00 AM // 02:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nexx

Either way, great responses. Do you have any recommendations or changes instead of one sentence bashing?

I wasn't bashing as I would need to thrown insults to do it. I have ideas, but none of the ideas would work this game.(Making my own game for ANet.) The only ideas I have for this game to balance the warrior class is giving them the ability to hit while running and up the damage they do with weapons.

Eskimo Bob · Jul 13, 2005, 02:40 AM // 02:40

I like those skills. I would find them very usefull. Harm's Way should also reduce damage by a little bit.

Lord Malikai · Jul 13, 2005, 05:55 AM // 05:55

Sever Fingers - Indefinately makes enemy unable to cast spells.
Pokey Stick to Forehead - Dazed effect for 1 minute + 50% chance to miss attacks.
Groin Kick - Target Foe is knocked down for 3 seconds and moves 66% slower for 10 minutes.
Flushie - Adds Bully Effect, target falls down whenever you are within 5 foot radius and using /taunt command.
Supa Fly Jimmy Snooka - If you are on terrain above target, you make a leaping attack that does double damage + cool points.

Winterclaw · Jul 13, 2005, 03:34 PM // 15:34

There is something like Harm's Way in the game already. I think it is the monk spell life bond. I pretty much agree with CG about the OP. Reyea, a better option would be to use furry. That's close enough without being over-powered.

This might be an okay skill:
Denying Offesnse (tactics)
For 3-15 seconds your attacks have a 50% chance of interrupting skills and spells. 10 energy cast 30 to 60 second recharge.

viet · Jul 13, 2005, 06:08 PM // 18:08

Wild Blow
you have a chance to hurt your own teammates!

GranDeWun · Jul 13, 2005, 06:35 PM // 18:35

Kata Stance: For x seconds, blindness has no effect on you.

Counters the most crippling anti-warrior tool, but prevents using other stances.

Nexx · Jul 13, 2005, 06:49 PM // 18:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winterclaw

There is something like Harm's Way in the game already. I think it is the monk spell life bond. I pretty much agree with CG about the OP. Reyea, a better option would be to use furry. That's close enough without being over-powered.

This might be an okay skill:
Denying Offesnse (tactics)
For 3-15 seconds your attacks have a 50% chance of interrupting skills and spells. 10 energy cast 30 to 60 second recharge.

I think you're referring to "Life Bond" but I think what really hurts a warrior is the mana upkeep. With only two energy pipes, you'll be stressed on what mana based skills you can use and if you're a tactic or sword based warriors where most of your skills use energy, you're pretty much handicapped.

Denying Offense looks good but might be a little too powerful. With all of your attacks having a chance to interrupt everything it hits, that's really strong stuff. Perhaps lowering the time limit to 10 seconds instead of 15 and making it only melee attacks, it'll probably be more managable.

Ristaron · Jul 13, 2005, 06:56 PM // 18:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Malikai

Sever Fingers - Indefinately makes enemy unable to cast spells.
Pokey Stick to Forehead - Dazed effect for 1 minute + 50% chance to miss attacks.
Groin Kick - Target Foe is knocked down for 3 seconds and moves 66% slower for 10 minutes.
Flushie - Adds Bully Effect, target falls down whenever you are within 5 foot radius and using /taunt command.
Supa Fly Jimmy Snooka - If you are on terrain above target, you make a leaping attack that does double damage + cool points.

Brilliant!!!!!!!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nexx

RESIST CONDITION – Skill. (Strength)
For 7-12 seconds, remove all negative conditions on you. When this skill ends, return all removed conditions. (Lose “X” damage for each returned condition or Returned conditions last 50% longer).

Cripple getting you down?

I personally loathe when warriors won't piss off. Running them through a barbed trap or using pin down on them is the only way my Ranger can tell them that if they keep coming after him he's going to have to put every condition in the game on them and laugh at them as they run away with his barrage right on their heels.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nexx

HARM’S WAY – Stance (Tactics)
For 10-20 seconds, whenever target nearby ally takes damage from an attack, redirected the damage to you.

The skill is a stance so it will limit what skills a warrior can use but imagine how neat it would be to throw the stance on your caster. Also the nearby ally part will force the warrior to stay in close proximity to his "mark" (perhaps within aggro circle?) to stay true to the stance. It’ll be a great way to save casters whose life are low.

I like this. Warriors become THE ultimate meatshield.

Another good one:

SEPPUKA! - Shout (Strength)
Every enemy within your aggro circle targets you.

Would make warriors actually pretty useful. I mean, come on. A ranger who has Droknar's armour has +150 vs. elemental damage (+210 vs Cold/Fire if you have Furlined/Drakescale)(Both figures referring to total armour bonus, not per piece of course), so if the party ele casts conjure [flame/frost, etc], the Ranger can be the best tank you have. Making warriors able to draw fire away from the monk/mesmer/ele would be excellent.
One thing, though, should it work against real players? I can see it getting abused in PvP. 4 warriors doing it one at a time every 10 seconds would slow a PvP round to a gradual halt, and from there a crawl.

Rayea · Jul 13, 2005, 07:08 PM // 19:08

lol, i love the funny ones.

as to broke, well it was just a sugestion, and all.

but you forgot..
Wedgey of Pain: target is under a no-attack penalty similar to the monks peace whatsit one (one where you cant attack, that those roots like aloe use)

and what about a proper skill for taunt? then we could have...

Oy! you! : taunt skill. warrior pulls all mobs within a specified distance (classed as in earshot, grows with taunt skill) with the cry of 'Your Moma Wears Army Boots!'

agroed mobs fight at a 10% attk loss