Curse

Naqser · Apr 10, 2006, 01:09 PM // 13:09

Most fun necromancer spells requires health sacrifice, and you can easily kill yourself if your not carefull. If you calculate a sacrifice skill is to take 89 dmg and you have about 200 left and you get hit real hard before spell is cast and you are left with around 50 hp and you don't react because it happens so fast, you kill yourself. Now that is not fun.

If you die directly because you sacrificed health that spell should be more powerfull. maybe 2 or 3 times as powerfull, of course, those spells that benefit you wouldn't apply to this, but dark pact for example, you give 40 shadow dmg with it and sacrifice 10%. You die directly because you had 40 hp left and it required 50 cause you had 500 maximu, then it would deal 80 or 120. Other spells that only are timed based would get a longer duration, 2 times longer or just 10-20 seconds.

Phoenix Arrows · Apr 10, 2006, 05:28 PM // 17:28

Sac-spells are sac-spells because they are over-powered. EX: Offering of Blood [E] and Blood is Power [E]. Or even Barbed Signet. They need a sacrifice because without it, the skills would be over-powered. That is why when you sac, you have to do it at the correct times. Saccing takes some skill to learn.

Vilaptca · Apr 10, 2006, 07:19 PM // 19:19

I think it'd be cool to see a new spell in Blood Magic, that if you die sacrificing yourself with it, then it does X more damage. Or maybe have an enchantment that you could put on an enemy, and if you sacrifice yourself to death, it does X damage to them.

It would be interesting to see...and I trust ANet would keep it from being too overpowered, that we wouldn't see all Blood Necro Sac teams running around in PvP killing themselves and causing massive damage to the opposing team.

bulletsmile · Apr 10, 2006, 07:28 PM // 19:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vilaptca

Blood Necro Sac teams running around in PvP killing themselves and causing massive damage to the opposing team.

lol

yes, we need sacrifice, but i think they could something like you can't die from sacrificing, like: 40hp of 500hp, sacrifice 50hp and u would normally die, but this would prevent it and you would have like 1hp left, and we would be able to turn this function off, or else it would be to bad for the minion factories!

Viruzzz · Apr 10, 2006, 08:50 PM // 20:50

sacrificing works EXACTLY like it is suposed to.

you can sacrifice yourself to death, yes. and some build use that ability. generate corpses

you should not gain anything as an advantage if you sacrificed yourself to death

Hunter Sharparrow · Apr 10, 2006, 09:03 PM // 21:03

Personaly I think they added the hp sacrifice just to suit the class of necromancy not to make for balance but then added skills that took hp from the enemy, dead or undead to create the balance since the sac spells makes for tipping the scale in the favor of other magic users. It was something the necro had to do from the beginning before extensive playing of the game.

The spells are really not that powerfull especially when compared to mesmer's an ele's spells. Take meteor shower for example. Sure it cost 25 energy (nothing when you have points in energy storage) and has a 60 second recast time but with arcane echo you can get two off in a row (since you will have the energy with energy storage) and it only takes 5 seconds to cast. It lasts for 9 seconds doing three waves of 7 to 112 damage per wave and knocks the enemies (since its AoE) down interupting their actions and makes it hard for them to run away from it. The loss in you maximum energy replenishes over time durring the fight where a necro's hp won't.

The necro has one signet, 14 normal spells and 6 elites that steal health. Sounds like alot but that one sig requires a sac of 10% to take just 18 to 60 from just one foe and has a 30 sec recast time. Out of the 14 normal spells one requires 33% sac, one requires the enemy to cast a spell, two requires you to be next to the enemy (not good with a necro's low armor), one requires the enemy to be attacking, one requires the enemy to be hexed, two can be done while out of harms way without unique situations or sacrificing and they are vampiric gaze and life siphon (60 hp steal at best from one enemy or the only real decent healing spell for a necro (life siphon) which only gives you +3 hp regen but when put on 3 enemies gives you a +9 hp regen). Four require dead (fleshy) bodies. The last two you have to wait for them to end. So for normal spells (other than life siphon) the only good hp gaining spell is soul feast but if your the first target the enemies want there most likely wont be a corps for you to steal the hp from. As for elites you can only take one with you (something that should be changed for all classes).

I'm not saying that the necro is at a huge disadvantage compared to the other classes but rather just a small one since there are numerous other spells that sac hp without healing. Just seems like there are too many spells that sac hp and not enough that readily give it back. Maybe the addition of a hex that when cast on a target that target get their hp sacced for each spell you cast requiring a secrifice. From what I've seen looking at the necro spells they are really set up in a way to combo. Having 3 or so spells that, when cast in the right order, can seriously mess an opponent's day. This can make the necro strong against any foe one on one or even one on two but any more than that and it gets iffy. According to the prima guide (seriously outdated) the necro was originally designed to take the spunk out of the warriors making them do less damage, weaken armor, harder to get healed etc.

/signed sorta

keep the sac spells but just add a spell to help out.

BahamutKaiser · Apr 11, 2006, 04:34 AM // 04:34

Sacrifice is just another unique cost for Necromancers, just like Maintaining for Monks and Exhaustion for Elementist. Sacrifice can kill you, but those spells usually have totaly unique and remarkable effects which make them invaluable, unlike say Elementist exhaustion which just means other classes get screwed for using it and you get screwed if you use it too much (reguardless of effectiveness).

Necromancers can lose alot of health doing sacrifices, but the energy restoration they give to monks keeps entire parties alive, and most sacrifice spells come from the blood line, which also has alot of effective life stealing skills.

It would be kind of nice if you couldn't kill yourself by accident with sacrificing, but then again, that could be a tactical feature to helping others or yourself to corpses for your death magic. So if Sacrificing health isn't a good tactic for you, perhaps you could go with Ether prodigy? cause up to 160 damage for unused energy kills too. Just about all energy restoration skills have heavy tolls, it is a daily part of this balanced game (other breakfast items not included).

Sacrifice does less damage if you have less health (hint, Sup Runes), and as long as your not using Awaken the Blood with Blood is Power, your not going to kill yourself, it will require help from your enemy. And if spiking a necromacer during a sacrifice is broken, then we need to remove interupting attacks so elementist can't be totaly shut down by half of the classes in the game. Second serving of balance, served.

Try combining death nova with suicide, then have a teammate instantly cast putrid explotion. That's over 200 ignore armor damage in an AoE plus poison. Wouldn't want to rob GvG of that. I would rather wish that Necromancers had a or some skills which reduced DP, it would help foster the use of suicide bombers, "Damn those evil Alkida Necros!, Damn them to the Underworld where they belong!". Vengence would actually work wonders with this build, revive at full health and no added DP if you die again. Did you ever wonder what signet of agony accomplished?