Curse

xRustyx · May 02, 2006, 11:29 PM // 23:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phoenix Arrows

Let me get this straight. Just because people beat you with Air of Enchantment, you need a nerf for it? And did anyone say that you couldn't use it?

Let me get this straight. You can't read the first topic? Notice there are question marks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phoenix Arrows

If Air of Enchantment is such a pain for your teams, try actually USING it so that both teams are overpowered to the same level. Just because the other team chose to use the "overpowered" skill doesn't mean you can't use it.

Oh shit, look what happened to Spirit spam. Wait, you've played Tombs right?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phoenix Arrows

/not-signed

No one asked you to sign anything.

Sekkira · May 02, 2006, 11:43 PM // 23:43

Okay I know I'm missing something. Air of Enchantment reduces an enchantment by 5 energy, Bally's Aura costs 25 energy, now 20 energy, but it cost 5 energy to bring it down to 20 energy.

Zatara · May 02, 2006, 11:48 PM // 23:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sekkira

Okay I know I'm missing something. Air of Enchantment reduces an enchantment by 5 energy, Bally's Aura costs 25 energy, now 20 energy, but it cost 5 energy to bring it down to 20 energy.

Balt's Aura's not the problem its the Zealot's Fire Aoe dmg every second for only 5 energy every 9 seconds

Sekkira · May 03, 2006, 12:04 AM // 00:04

Ah now I get it, you confused me entirely Zatara before. I didn't realise it was the actual smite that made it overpowered but the zero energy cost you could use with boon prot skills as well as smiting skills while this is up.

Yes it's overpowered. It doesn't mean it's unbeatable, but just because you can beat something doesn't mean it's balanced.

Linkie · May 03, 2006, 12:29 AM // 00:29

It saddens me to see that people have not changed much since the spirit spam days. "If you can't beat it, use it yourself" is hardly an argument against a skill being overpowered. Besides, it only encourages to what the real problem with these kind of skills, and that is that it creates an extremely static gameplay, almost comperable to PvE. Now, admittedably tombs was very static already, but this skill will definately not improve the environment.
And sure, there are counters for it out there, like there are counters for most things. The problem is creating counters that doesn't completely gimp your build against everything else, and that are efficient enough against these builds to make you chose this over simply running this build yourself (again, creating a very static environment).

scars of insanity · May 03, 2006, 12:37 AM // 00:37

have yall seen the new mesmer skills? some look like it really screw this build.
for example

Arcane Languor- 10 energy 2 second cast 15 second recharge
For 1...4 seconds, all spells cast by target cause exausion.

i have seen this build in observer mode and they are Spamming skills with Air of enchantment. Place this baby on a monk spammin and he will either stop spamming or keep spamming. if he keeps spamming thats gonna be at least 4 spells cast by the monk. i believe exausion in 10 energy so he will be sitting on 40 energy exaustion. 15 seconds later pick a new target to screw with.

then with this mabye team up with a Ranger with this spirit.
Equinox
Spells cast within its range that causes exhaustion cause double the exhaustion instead. This spirit dies after 30-126 seconds.

this is just a thought tho i have no idea if these would actualy work against it.
personaly i think nerfing a skill because of one build is rediculous. but it does seem a little overpowered mabye lengthen recharge to 15 or 20.

Ascension · May 03, 2006, 12:48 AM // 00:48

Smiting is not overpowered at it's current state. In fact, the very original counter - IWAY - can still easily defeat it. Saying this, some of the counters to IWAY are stomped by the newer smiting builds. It still, however, can be edged out by a good teams (I.e. KITE!).

The build itself is just very well designed. It takes advantage of your hesitation in a beautiful way.

BahamutKaiser · May 03, 2006, 05:12 AM // 05:12

Elementist should own IWAY, but somehow it doesn't, so people are turning to the Healing job, Monk.......

Does someone have a big red flag that says "BROKEN" for me to wave?, The "healing" job is being used for AoE Group attack counters, the job can heal and protect teammates, it shouldn't be able to mount an offense AT THE SAME TIME!, Why the Hell can't people see this?

Sekkira · May 03, 2006, 07:10 AM // 07:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by scars of insanity

have yall seen the new mesmer skills? some look like it really screw this build.
for example

Arcane Languor- 10 energy 2 second cast 15 second recharge
For 1...4 seconds, all spells cast by target cause exausion.

i have seen this build in observer mode and they are Spamming skills with Air of enchantment. Place this baby on a monk spammin and he will either stop spamming or keep spamming. if he keeps spamming thats gonna be at least 4 spells cast by the monk. i believe exausion in 10 energy so he will be sitting on 40 energy exaustion. 15 seconds later pick a new target to screw with.

then with this mabye team up with a Ranger with this spirit.
Equinox
Spells cast within its range that causes exhaustion cause double the exhaustion instead. This spirit dies after 30-126 seconds.

this is just a thought tho i have no idea if these would actualy work against it.
personaly i think nerfing a skill because of one build is rediculous. but it does seem a little overpowered mabye lengthen recharge to 15 or 20.

You just completely missed the point I and Linkie made previously.

Xasew · May 03, 2006, 01:45 PM // 13:45

Dang, I made a build using Air of Enchantment with Smiting a week or so ago, but I didn't think it would be bringing Dual Smite back...
Dual Smite was the only FotM I liked/played, so I'm actually happy if it really is back(I'm not able to play atm). But overpowered... I don't think that. Sure Balth's Aura is a bit more powerful, but Diversion/Enchantment removal is still in the game. Actually there's so much new enchantment removal, that I don't see Smite becoming a huge problem.

*edit*
But if it does, then it should be nerfed accordingly.

JR · May 03, 2006, 02:27 PM // 14:27

Whoever thinks Air of Enchantment even COMPARES to what Ether Renewal was like back in the Dual Smite days is either on crack, or has a terrible memory.

However, I do agree that Air of Enchantment does probably need tweaking. I'll experiment later.

wren e · May 17, 2006, 02:47 AM // 02:47

I am sure that there are other skills more powerful than air of enchantment with the new faction skills, but people are still learning them. I do not think that this new incarnation of duel smite needs to be nerfed considering that you can get the same effect from using divine spirit and glyph of renewal. Also, you need to remember that balthazars aura does not do as much damage as it once did and recharges slower, and zealous fire does less damage as well. On top of that, I can remember when people where smiting of themsleves using shouts, which you can not do anymore. All that air of enchantment has done is bring back a FOTM that had been nerfed and made it a viable, but not overpowered, choice. Plus, it is my opinion that the more choices and different builds that you are likely to see, add to the fun of PvP, versus playing against the same build time after time. Before calling for nerfs, give the state of the metagame time to try out new combinations and incorperate all the new skills and doubles that we have a chance to try in new ways.

UltimaXtreme · May 17, 2006, 02:50 AM // 02:50

its not overpowered, strip zealots fire -.- not that hard

Thom · May 17, 2006, 07:41 AM // 07:41

I see this two ways: First, I saw the Air of Enchantment and immediately fell in love. I capped it as soon as I could and use it for my boon/proter now. If they find a way to keep this skill in tact I would be very happy. The amount of my happiness could indicate the need for it to be nerfed.

There are several enchantment removal options, but if you are playing the guild correctly zealots should always be double/triple covered. Remove is not a reasonable option outside of profane. Energy drain is not feasible, because if played correctly the booners are sitting at about zero energy. Proper kiting goes a long way, but an oppent with half a brain with have this covered. If things get really bad just bring mantra of fire.

If you are interested in fame farming, this is your best option since IWAY got nerfed. For the doubters out there, for a single target you can cast RoF, Guardian, AoEnch and Veil INDEFINITELY for 2 energy a cast. Prot spirit costs 5, switching targets costs 5. This is the equivalent to something like 20+ free energy every 10 seconds if you don't need to switch targets. AoEnch triggers boon so at the very minimum you heal a target every 5 seconds for 2 energy while your bar recharges. The opponent has two reasonable strategies: consistantly switch targets or attack the boon/protter. This makes holding ridiculous: your standard boon/prot can single handedly keep a hero alive almost indefinitely without a fancy holding build. To put it in the immortal words of the Zashian's: "gg".

Sure the build can be beaten and countered, but this beautiful skill has take what was already on on the most insanely successful builds in game and made it substancially better. Smite was nerfed enough last time around that players may be able to substancially adopt, but Air of Enchantment is to date my favorite elite to come out of factions across all classes.

Pete1975 · May 17, 2006, 08:14 AM // 08:14

/notsigned

Take out the smiters and the build has very little damage, there are many ways to counter this. There is quite alot of prot in this build so I imagine it makes using iway builds a little difficult, shame........

Ranger spike should be nerfed, iway should be nerfed, that rit spke thingy should be nerfed, blood spike should be nerfed, the build the team was running last night should be nerfed as they beat me, so basically when we enter a match in HA we have to stand there seeing who has the most "wand power" I think you can see where I am going here

MCS · May 17, 2006, 08:40 AM // 08:40

Quote:

its not overpowered, strip zealots fire -.- not that hard

QFT, with all the monks using inspired enchantment and revealed enchantment it's a wonder smite is useful at all.

pah01 · May 17, 2006, 08:49 AM // 08:49

Well when you can wipe out every second team you meet in less than two minutes with one smiter two thumpers and a shock warrior something has got to be overpowered or at least very strong of the three I just mentioned.

Its a lot of fun tho

Sam

jummeth · May 17, 2006, 09:14 AM // 09:14

And the next thread is shouting at how OoA is over powered.

Please just give some people some time to discover counters before shout NERF!

You got skills like shadow shroud which will totally shutdown the standard boon prot with air of enchant or not.
That exhaustion skill, backfire are all potent since the monk is usually spamming this in quick sucession.

Kyune · May 17, 2006, 09:20 AM // 09:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by UltimaXtreme

its not overpowered, strip zealots fire -.- not that hard

Agreed, though I wonder just how hard it is to get at it directly in a stack situation. There are a number of ways to do this--Necro with rend/lingering/gaze, Asn with expunge enchantments/Dark Apostasy/shadow shroud, and Mesmer with Shatter Storm. A Rit could even bring along disenchant for the backline with draw spirit to make sure it's getting its kicks in.

I admit they're not particularly pretty but potentially one of them could do the job but as long as the meta-game remains set in pre-factions mentality as far as what should and shouldn't be a good skill to bring people are just trying to get by with as little effort as possible.

Kinda reminds me of all the fuss that went on over old-style tombs heal balls, haha.

Karmaniac · May 17, 2006, 09:28 AM // 09:28

Even though the OP seems to have been banned (there's still justice in the world after all) I'd still like to express my point.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete1975

Ranger spike should be nerfed, iway should be nerfed, that rit spke thingy should be nerfed, blood spike should be nerfed, the build the team was running last night should be nerfed as they beat me, so basically when we enter a match in HA we have to stand there seeing who has the most "wand power" I think you can see where I am going here

OMG!!!!111 I'm gonna stock up on wands before they get nerfed and make $$$

Anyways, I'd dare say that air of enchantment is indeed bit imba. It's the ultimate energy management for prot monks and if OoB was overpowered (it wasn't) then I'm at loss. This is not overpowered? Altho I admit I have no firsthand experience on how much energy you save using it but if it exceeds OoB or MoR by far a rebalance is definitely in order. Can't call for nerf on a gut feeling alone.

Finally what was said about eles: stop spouting nonsense. You have superior energy reserves and skills that can be spammed to the extent it's nauseating. The hell you need more buffs!