Curse

Marz08 · Oct 19, 2006, 02:26 PM // 14:26

I Have recently been discussing the PVE Skills system with friends and random players. We are very fed up with buying the same skills over and over again with new and different characters. It wastes time and money and is unfair.We think that the PVE skill system should work account baed unlocked like the PVP system apart from elite skills. All those in favour of this Idea/Suggestion say "Aye"!

Bolygo · Oct 19, 2006, 02:32 PM // 14:32

I dont know, that doesnt sound like real RPG, i mean, learning new skills is an adventure, my monk shouldnt know how to hamstring someone just because my warrior knows it

Nestle Mint Aero · Oct 19, 2006, 02:36 PM // 14:36

This idea is going to be shat upon by many people, Pages worth of hate, All directed at you my friend. Run before they get here. Good luck.

Marz08 · Oct 19, 2006, 02:37 PM // 14:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bolygo

Not signed, all these stupid PvE ideas, go back to preasearing and learn to play man :/

that was a joke btw ignore it

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nestle Mint Aero

This idea is going to be shat upon by many people, Pages worth of hate, All directed at you my friend. Run before they get here. Good luck.

Good one another joke

Arkantos · Oct 19, 2006, 02:43 PM // 14:43

Keep this thread flame free, or it shall be closed very soon.

Bolygo · Oct 19, 2006, 02:45 PM // 14:45

Sorry Marz i just couldnt stand it

DD

Awesome Nuke · Oct 19, 2006, 02:50 PM // 14:50

Its indeed a pretty... not-good idea buddy. Get ready for some action :s

Hammer1066 · Oct 19, 2006, 02:58 PM // 14:58

What does flame free mean?

Dougal Kronik · Oct 19, 2006, 03:36 PM // 15:36

/not signed

It's enough the you can buy any skills that have been unlocked by previous characters from trainers.

I would rather they implement that all skills (non-elite) are learned through quests.

I think it's not in the character development that one character has to do a quest to unlock Animate Bone Fiend (or buy it at Ember Light Camp), then a brand new Necro in Factions can go and purchase the skill once he gets his first skill point.

FrogDevourer · Oct 19, 2006, 04:54 PM // 16:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marz08

It wastes time and money and is unfair.

First reason why it won't be implemented: this system has been specifically designed to make PvE players get a lot of XPs and gold. Time sink, gold sink, it's the very fabric of any MMO game. In short, you're asking ANet to remove PvE grind, but once you've completed all missions and quests, there is nothing left to do in PvE but grinding for XP, items or gold. Without grind, the amount of time spent in PvE would be ridiculously low, which is no-no for any MMO.

Honestly, instead of requesting time-free and gold-free PvE content, players should be grateful towards ANet for providing a (somewhat) healthy and fair PvP environment.

Winterclaw · Oct 19, 2006, 10:11 PM // 22:11

Frog, at some point though, you are just asking for too much XP/Grind.

A warrior who's gotten all the warrior skills from the other games will need 25K plus an extra 25 skill points (or 375,000xp) to just get all the warrior skills in nightfall. Now imagine that same person also gets a few monk, paragon, and elementalist skills as well. Now imagine that this same person also needs to get skills for 2-3 other existing PCs and not just new ones from nightfall. Some people have more than 1 PvE character and they might want or need to get their characters skilled up.

IMO, the skill buying system should change so that after skill cost 1 plat each, you should be able to buy them with money or with a skill point and not both. You are right in the fact there needs to be some grinding, but right now it is a little too much.

Marz08 · Oct 19, 2006, 10:25 PM // 22:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winterclaw

Frog, at some point though, you are just asking for too much XP/Grind.

A warrior who's gotten all the warrior skills from the other games will need 25K plus an extra 25 skill points (or 375,000xp) to just get all the warrior skills in nightfall. Now imagine that same person also gets a few monk, paragon, and elementalist skills as well. Now imagine that this same person also needs to get skills for 2-3 other existing PCs and not just new ones from nightfall. Some people have more than 1 PvE character and they might want or need to get their characters skilled up.

IMO, the skill buying system should change so that after skill cost 1 plat each, you should be able to buy them with money or with a skill point and not both. You are right in the fact there needs to be some grinding, but right now it is a little too much.

Exactly.I see you have too warriors bet it co
st a bomb buying the skills again.I with your idea, once the skill has been unlocked on your account it should cost a Skillpoint and no money. This would be a biig improvement for the system and make many happy. Espicially considering you can buy up too 26 character slots now,players will have more than one PVE character the same profession!

Blackhawk · Oct 19, 2006, 10:54 PM // 22:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrogDevourer

Honestly, instead of requesting time-free and gold-free PvE content, players should be grateful towards ANet for providing a (somewhat) healthy and fair PvP environment.

So being able to buy a complete skillpack for a PvP char from the GW Shop is "fair" compared to the ones who grinded for the skills now is it?

Knightsaber Sith · Oct 19, 2006, 11:23 PM // 23:23

/notsigned

Maybe you need to just stop constatnly remaking characters.

yunthi · Oct 20, 2006, 12:31 AM // 00:31

jst a small bit of info,

ive been "collecting" skills for my warrior and ive done all the quests that reward u with skills + sec profession skill quests ( profession specific quests)

ive got about 4 mil xp (-~30k) and to get all the skills currently ingame ill need 289 skillpoints worth 4'335'000 xp so it adds up to about 8,3 mil xp not counting nf skills (300 more)

currently there are
604 normal +
180 elite skills
784 skills total +300 from nf =1084 total

got some grinding to do

Knightsaber Sith · Oct 20, 2006, 02:41 AM // 02:41

^I've been getting all the skills to, but not all one charcter. Much easier if you do it accross all your characters.

thedeadwalk! · Oct 20, 2006, 05:06 AM // 05:06

I've thought about suggesting skill points not being used for skills you've already unlocked. I think mainly this allows for current characters to focus their skill points on future skills instead of using them up for secondary classes in their builds, or what not.

It'd still be a money sink but I know what kind of effect the limited use of skill points would have.

9th Requiem · Oct 20, 2006, 10:49 AM // 10:49

Well, as time passes and the number of chapters available increases, even the time constraints as to finishing the chapters will prove problematic - I only have 1 Canthan that has finished Tyria, and 3 Tyrians who have finished Cantha. I'm already decided to only keep up a selection of my favourite characters, so I don't really need to get all skills for everything. It's just not worth it.

Secondly, you don't have to have every single skill. Pick up the ones you want as and when you want to try them out, and leave the rest until you're ready.

In short, it works fine as it stands, as long as you don't get greedy and demand everything for every character. I've deleted a lot of my characters (2 Ele's, 2 monks, 1 ranger, 2 mesmers, 1 necro) and I've had to buy a number of skills for re-made characters, but I don't mind that. It means that I'm more careful, and I get what I need and a few others to swap in/out. Getting all skills would be like getting every set of armour - you can do it, but don't complain because it's too expensive and difficult.

/counter-signed.

Riesz · Oct 20, 2006, 11:09 AM // 11:09

I just wish skills didn't cap at 1k platinum. What I dread most about new chapters is having to spend 250k+ on just SKILLS. I can understand unnecessary fancy armors and weapons as a gold sink but not skills (which are the very core of this game).

Just change skills to only needing a skill point to buy.

FrogDevourer · Oct 20, 2006, 12:12 PM // 12:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riesz

What I dread most about new chapters is having to spend 250k+ on just SKILLS.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winterclaw

A warrior who's gotten all the warrior skills from the other games will need 25K plus an extra 25 skill points (or 375,000xp) to just get all the warrior skills in nightfall.

To be honest, this is basically nothing for a hardcore PvE player, and UAS has to be calibrated for top hardcore players. It may seem unfair to the casual player (and for the records, I *am* a casual player). Yet if you give the casual player an easy/free access to everything (including weird/weak/unused skills or rare loot), how will you convince the hardcore player with bazillions of XP and platinum to keep playing the game? Grinding for items? What's the point if gold and XP are worthless in the game... Collecting all skills (as described in the OP) or all armors or a lot of loot is the typical MMORPG time/gold sink.

Point is, MMORPGs *need* time sinks and money sinks, and they *have* to be calibrated to entertain the most addicted players. Collecting all skills (as described in the OP) or all armors or a lot of loot is the typical MMORPG time/gold sink, so you just cannot reasonnably ask for free PvE unlocks.

However it's also important for a MMORPG to give the average player an access to the basic stuff. IMHO, GW is doing a very good job at this. 9th Requiem gave a very good explanation: contrary to WoW, in GW you don't *need* to grind if you want to play the game casually. That's more than I need.

In short I disagree with the OP because I understand and I accept that PvE UAS is out of my league. I have access to all the skills I need, but I'm not trying to unlock everything on every character because I don't have the time to grind for content I'll never use.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackhawk

So being able to buy a complete skillpack for a PvP char from the GW Shop is "fair" compared to the ones who grinded for the skills now is it?

Strange as it may seem, yes. The alternative would be to force new players into grinding, which would basically mean 'no new pvp player for GW'. That's also why ANet is planning to release a PvP-edition for Nightfall.

Unlock packs provide an *optional* alternative for players who do not care about PvE, and for those who feel they need unlocks to be competitive. Granted, many players would like to see free UAS implemented, but ANet decided to link PvE and PvP and I certainly understand why as I enjoy both aspects of the game. Therefore the current unlock system (with PvE grinding or with Balthazar factions) is a very good alternative if you don't want to implement UAS.

Conclusion: asking for free content, free unlocks and so on (with a cookie and a glass of milk) is bound to fail.