Curse

Zuranthium · Feb 05, 2007, 06:13 PM // 18:13

Blanket statement for this thread -- Because of the proposed decrease in recharge for shadowsteps, they should disable adrenaline skills so as to not overpower the skills for Warriors. Teleporting melee spikes are simply something an Assassin should be totally superior at. They NEED to have that distinguishing ability.

CRITICAL STRIKES - Just a pre-note, I think every single enchantment in this line NEEDS to be changed to simply a "skill" like Critical Eye or Ritual Lord. Mainly because they aren't very useful otherwise but also because it aesthetically makes sense (I'm getting RPG now) that these abilities are a fighting style the Assassin has learned. On with the show:

Assassin's Remedy - Change to a skill with automatic activation and have it activate when ANY Assassin skill is used, not just an attack skill.

Why? - Because now it’s actually useful, while at the same time not making Mending Touch inferior.

Critical Defenses - Change to a skill with automatic activation. All other current updates are perfect.

Why? - It’s too much of a time waster to have to cast it.

Critical Eye - Dramatically increase the duration (something like 5 seconds base plus and extra 10 seconds per rank in critical strikes) and increase critical % to 3 + your rank in crit strikes.

Why? - Because it's currently a waste of a skillslot. The +1 energy bonus per critical is lessened when you consider that 5 energy needs to be spent every 30 seconds to reapply the skill.

Dark Apostasy - Change to a skill with automatic activation and decrease to 5 energy.

Why? - Because standing there casting a spell for 2 seconds as an Assassin is way too obvious and if left as a removable enchantment that requires so much energy, there would be non-Elite methods of removing enchantments that would be preferrable.

Deadly Haste - Change to a skill with automatic activation.

Why? - Because you could make some great builds with this skill but at the moment it's too risky to really be worth it.

Fox's Promise - Change to a skill with automatic activation and remove the “if you fail to hit” component.

Why? - Because otherwise Expose Defenses really negates the purpose of spending your ELITE slot on this skill.

Locust's Fury - Decrease to 5 energy and change to a skill with automatic activation. All other current updates are perfect.

Why? - Because this is similar to a Instant-Attack-Speed ability (though not nearly as good because it doesn't help your attack chains) and I don't recall frenzy/flurry/tiger's stance being easily removable. It's also a waste of time to be casting this when you need to be attacking and 10 energy is too unwieldy for the effect that it gives.

Malicious Strike - Change to an Offhand Attack that does not require a Lead Attack for it to activate and increase recharge time to 10 seconds.

Why? - Because the effect is currently almost worthless. As an offhand attack with no requirement, however, it could be interesting.

Palm Strike - Decrease to 5 energy and an 8 second recharge.

Why? - Because it's an Elite and deserves to be better than other Offhand attacks that are non-Elite.

Sleeping Wound - Decrease to 1/4 second cast and 5 second recharge.

Why? - Because the effect isn't that amazing for an Elite but if spammable the skill could actually become useful for condition pressure builds and as a cover hex.

Sharpen Daggers - Keep the 2 second activation but change to a skill, decrease recharge to 10 seconds, dramatically increase the duration (5 seconds base plus an extra 10 seconds per rank), and slightly increase the bleeding duration that is caused.

Why? - Because you shouldn't have to waste time constantly re-applying a skill with an effect that's this small and if interrupted you can at least go for it again in a shorter amount of time.

Unsuspecting Strike - Make it unblockable/unevadable.

Why? - Cause it's a leet sneak attack. They don't know it's coming (in RPG terms), so they shouldn't be able to block/evade. A 10 energy Lead Attack better be worth it.

Way of the Assassin - Change to a skill with automatic activation, remove the "while enchanted" conditionality, and dramatically increase the duration (same as Critical Eye).

Why? - Because the effect is already barely worthy of being an ELITE, so it should always be working and you should have the option to use an IAS stance with it.

DAGGER MASTERY

Black Mantis Thrust - Decrease to 5 energy. All other current updates are perfect.

Why? - Lead Attacks need to be worth it!

Blades of Steel - The current update is perfect.

Why? - (no changes needed)

Desperate Strike - 1/2 of the damage it currently causes should always be applied no matter what your health is at and the full bonus should come whenever you're under 80% health. Also decrease the recharge to 4 seconds.

Why? - The Mantra is “Lead Attacks need to be worth it, Lead attacks need to be worth it...”
Disrupting Stab - Change to simply a "Melee Attack" instead of a Lead Atack and have it disable all skills, not just spells.

Why? - Because it makes little sense to use this as a Lead attack when you need to save it to interrupt something and it should be able to disable signets and such just as the Warrior equivilent Disrupting Chop does.

Exhausting Assault - Should be able to follow a Lead or Offhand Attack.

Why? - Just a bit of versatility.

Flashing Blades - Decrease to 5 energy and keep the recharge at 20 seconds. All other current updates are perfect.

Why? - Still too much of an energy sink.

Fox Fangs - Decrease recharge to 4 seconds.

Why? - It’s obsolete otherwise.

Golden Fox Strike - Decrease the recharge to 4 seconds.

Why? - I’ve come to the conclusion that every Lead Attack needs to be on a 4 second recharge. That’s what Lead/Offhand/Dual chains need to be effective when compared to attack chains that bypass Lead attacks.

Golden Skull Strike - Reduce to 5 energy.

Why? - To balance out with Temple Strike.

Golden Lotus Strike - Decrease recharge to 4 seconds.

Why? - Because the benefit here is the energy gain and with its current recharge there are better skills available.

Golden Phoenix Strike - Decrease to 5 energy.

Why? - Because 10 energy is a lot for something that's conditional and doesn't even do a ton of extra damage. Using a spammable hex with Black Spider Strike and Black Lotus Strike is almost always going to be better if this remains at 10 energy.

Jagged Strike - Add a small damage bonus (base of 5 + your rank in dagger mastery).

Why? - Again, it’s just not good enough currently. Lead Attacks need to be effective not just “oh, that’s cute”.

Jungle Strike - Decrease to a 4 second recharge.

Why? - To fit in with new recharges of Black Mantis Thrust and Leaping Mantis Sting, making these attack chains worthwhile.

Leaping Mantis Sting - Decrease to 4 second recharge.

Why? - Becuase lead attacks need to be worth taking, otherwise Offhand + Dual + Offhand + Dual will almost always be the favored attack chain. The effect here is conditional on factors outside of what you can do (ie. being enchanted or hexing the foe), so it deserves to be spammed.

Repeating Strike - Should be able to follow any Lead or Offhand melee attack.

Why? - Because there isn't much use for it right now. It should be able to be used as the offhand attack in a normal attack chain.

Temple Strike - Decrease to 10 energy.

Why? - Because no Assassin skill should cost more than 10 energy. 15 energy is a big investment for an ELITE with such a long recharge.

DEADLY ARTS - This is currently without a doubt the weakest skill line of any class.

Assassin's Promise - Reduce to a 20 second recharge and a 1/4 second cast and slightly increase the duration (equal to the energy gain of the spell).

Why? - Because it's currently only playble in SBRi group builds and maybe now an actual Assassin can give the spell a use.

Dark Prison - Reduce to a 30 second recharge and increase hex duration (exact same numbers as Shadow Prison).

Why? - Because it’s rather worthless at the moment.

Enduring Toxin - Decrease to a 5 second recharge.

Why? - Because it's sub-par unless it can be kept up at all times.

Entangling Asp - Should be able to follow any dagger attack or melee Assassin skill.

Why? - Because it's currently way too limited. This needs to be available at any time you've engaged your opponent.

Expunge Enchantments - Decrease to a 20 second recharge.

Why? - Because 30 seconds is too long of a time to make it worth taking.

Lift Enchantment - Reduce to 5 energy and a 1/4 second cast.

Why? - It's conditional and therefore needs to be quick and efficient when it can actually be used.

Impale - Current change is perfect.

Why? - Kudos ANET! Brilliant change.

Iron Palm - Reduce to 5 energy.

Why? - Because 10 energy is too much for something that's conditional and does barely any damage.

Mantis Touch - Should be able to follow any melee dagger attack or melee assassin skill.

Why? - Because it's too conditional right now to merit use over Caltrops.

Mark of Death - Increase the duration (5 + rank in attribute) and decrease recharge to 15 seconds.

Why? - Because now it might be useful outside of SBRi to add pressure.

Mark of Insecurity - Decrease casting time to 1/4 second.

Why? - Not really worth taking over other Elite abilities if it’s not quick.

Scorpion Wire - Reduce to a 20 second recharge.

Why? - 30 seconds is too long for this conditional effect.

Shadow Prison - Decrease recharge to 15 seconds and increase energy cost to 10.

Why? - Fits perfectly into a huge attack chain at a 15 second recharge (as that is the recharge time of Twisting Fangs and Impale). Increased energy cost balances it out.

Shameful Fear - Reduce to 1/4 second cast and do not cause the spell to increase your target's movement speed.

Why? - Because if your opponent is running away it doesn't do too much good to stand there casting this for 2 seconds, especially when this just makes them get away faster. The spell needs to quickly force your opponent into a predicament...they either stand there and get hit by your melee or they run away and take damage.

Shroud of Silence - Reduce to a 20 second recharge.

Why? - Because 30 seconds is too long for an ELITE with such a short duration...there's other shutdown that is more constant.

Signet of Shadows - Reduce recharge to 20 seconds.

Why? - Why not? Signet of Toxic Shock is a 20 second recharge.

Siphon Strength - Reduce the bonus critical chance to 25% but allow it to affect all attacks, not just the ones made on the hexed target. Also decrease to 10 energy and set as a half-range spell.

Why? - Because it's usefulness is lessened when you are forced to attack the physical damage dealers you're trying to debuff. It's currently like the equivilent of a Mesmer whose Spirit of Failure energy bonus would only take effect if they were actively attacking or casting on that target. Not good.

Way of the Empty Palm - Decrease to a 15 second recharge.

Why? - Because it's already of limited usage and for the builds you'd want to use it with the spell need to be kept up more consistently.

SHADOW ARTS

Beguiling Haze - Reduce to 10 energy. All other current updates are perfect.

Why? - The dazed duration is really short, this doesn’t need to be at 15 energy.

Blinding Powder - Should be able to follow any melee dagger attack or melee Assassin skill. Also change this to a touch skill.

Why? - Well first of all it makes no sense why this isn't a touch skill (pretty damn hard to throw powder and make it go very far) and secondly it needs to be reliable. Being required to make a successful offhand attack seriously hampers its usefulness currently, especially since it is pretty much THE only Assassin ability that makes Unseen Fury worth using.

Death's Charge - Reduce to 30 second recharge.

Why? - Because 45 seconds for shadowsteps is too long. These quick mobility abilities actually need to be constant enough for an Assassin to pressure with them.

Death's Retreat - Reduce to a 15 second recharge.

Why? - Because otherwise Return is almost always going to be superior.

Heart of Shadow - Decrease to 10 second recharge. All other current updates are perfect.

Why? - Because it's not constant enough healing right now to worth being used.

Mirrored Stance - Reduce to a 2 second recharge.

Why? - Because at the very least this should be an extremely spammable cover hex...the effect it has is SO conditional.

Shadow of Haste - Increase the duration by 5 seconds for every critical hit while in the stance. All other updates are perfect.

Why? - Makes the skill useful for melee Assassins while keeping it balanced for other builds.

Shadow Refuge - Decrease casting time to a 1/4 second.

Why? - Casts too slow for PVP these days.

Shadow Shroud - Decrease to a 12 second recharge.

Why? - Because the duration is so short; needs to be usable more often.

Shadowy Burden - Increase speed debuff to 33%, remove the "while foe has no other hexes" condition for the armor debuff, and slightly increase duration to 3 + Attribute Rank. All other current updates are perfect.

Why? - Needs to be worth 10 energy.

Shroud of Distress - Current update is close to being perfect. Reduce the recharge to 30 seconds and change duration to 15 + (Attribute rank * 4).

Why? - 45 second recharge makes it a bit too prone to removal. The minimum duration is also lowered so that a Monk can’t just 0-spec and constantly maintain the spell.

Unseen Fury - Reduce to a 10 second recharge.

Why? - Because for this kind of build to be viable, the skill needs to be up constantly.

Viper's Defense - Remove the teleportation component, increase to a 15 second recharge, and cause it to knock down and poison the next person who damages you with a melee attack (50% failure on the knockdown component with Shadow Arts under 4).

Why? - Because the skill is horrible right now; it doesn't give you much defense at all. With this change it would definitely give you concrete protection while still adding a bit of pressure from the poison as well.

Way of Perfection - Reduce to 1/4 second cast and 10 second recharge.

Why? - Because it needs to be reliable if you're going to depend on it for healing.

Way of the Fox - Decrease to a 30 second recharge.

Why? - Needs to be available more often to be really useful as a spiking aid. Plus, Dervish get a skill that does the exact same thing with a 30 second recharge.

Way of the Lotus - Reduce to a 10 second recharge.

Why? - Too inconsistent at the moment to be used for energy management.

NO ATTRIBUTE

Aura of Displacement - Decrease energy cost to 5.

Why? - Uses up too much energy to be worth the Elite status.

Mark of Instability - Decrease energy cost to 5.

Why? - Because there are better ways to spend your 10 energy if it remains as such.

Recall - Decrease to 10 energy.

Why? - Keeping in line with the "no Assassin ability should cost more than 10 energy" mantra. The effect here is hardly worth 15 energy.

Shadow Meld - Decrease to 5 energy and a 15 second recharge.

Why? - Because at 10 energy and a 20 second recharge, there's really not much point in spending your Elite slot on it.

Signet of Twilight - Reduce activation time to 1 second.

Why? - Conditional abilities need to be usable quickly during the window of opportunity.

Spirit Walk - Reduce to a 4 second recharge.

Why? - Because it's already very specific but at least now you can use it with Consume Soul on the same recharge timer for hunting down spirits in HA.

Swap - I think this should be an Elite, cost 10 energy, have a 30 second recharge, and be usable on ANY target. One thing the game currently lacks are spells/skills that physically move your opponent in some way.

Why - “Summoning” abilities need to be carefully balanced but they are a mechanic that I hope is introduced into the game. Please think about it ANET.

Wastrel’s Collapse - Cause it to simply do nothing instead of ending prematurely if the opponent uses a skill.

Why? - Because now the spell can be used to reliably open attack windows for the “Black Strike” skills.

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Discuss!

Zuranthium · Feb 05, 2007, 06:21 PM // 18:21

Yes, I know it's a lot to get through. Use the wiki as a reference guide...here's a direct link to the page of Assassin skills:

http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Assassi...uick_reference

~Z

djbartek · Feb 05, 2007, 06:58 PM // 18:58

I pretty much agree with your changes, but I would like to post here some of mine(if it isn't a problem):

Palm Strike
Give it shadowstep effect(like in BH), increase recharge if needed.

Seeping Wound
Change to unconditional 1...10 Health lost per second and 1...10 when bleeding or poisoned.

Way of The Assassin
IAS please.

Golden Skull Strike
Make the Daze unconditional(5...10) and give it conditional(enchantment) ~+30dmg.

Temple Strike
Make 2...9(because of BH buff I want to list).

Mark of Insecurity
Add that target foe cannot block attacks(from anybody, not just the caster).

Shroud of Silence
Decrease your spells' disable to 10 sec and recharge to 20 sec.
And of course it blackouts also shouts and chants.

Way of The Empty Palm
All your Assassin skills cost no energy(for DA sins).

Beguiling Haze
Increase duration to 3...8(really, with 1...6 and 0.75 aftercast along it's worthless again).

Hidden Caltrops
Unnerf it(remove "while moving" condition).

Wastrel's Collapse
If target foe uses a skill, WC ends and that skill takes additional 15 sec to recharge.

BoondockSaint · Feb 05, 2007, 07:15 PM // 19:15

Wow, why dont you just change the sin class name to mega uber pawnage class, but seriously, those are some serious buffs. I do believe that sins need some varity for pve since the same builds are usually run over and over, but in pvp I think A-net, as well as the players, have done an excellent job at making the sin a more viable class to play. What you have suggested is, in my opnion, too much.

djbartek · Feb 05, 2007, 07:43 PM // 19:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoondockSaint

Wow, why dont you just change the sin class name to mega uber pawnage class

I thought that, thanks to update, this is ritualists name now

clawofcrimson · Feb 05, 2007, 09:10 PM // 21:10

^ way too much....

the only thing I agree with is giving SOH a link to critical strikes.... adress the problem where it lies... in non primaries abusing this skill.... dont nerf it for the pure sins please